Retrosaurus

quote: Originally posted by rat: on a somewhat related note, some shit-for-brains drilled a bolt station at the top of each of iconclast's two .10c pitches and added a chicken bolt on the second .10c pitch. these may disappear in the future since they are completely unnecessary. I've got the tools. Anyone want to go along. Next Wednesday is good for me. I assume that no one wants to claim responsibility for these bolts either. Another PNW legend? Rat, what size and style of bolts are these? Anyone have salient points to make before these bolts are removed?

Just search "Hyperspace" on this site.

I heard on the radio that someone fell off a cliff at Washington Pass and was transported to Central Washington Hospital by military helicopter. Does anyone know anything more? Did a touron fall off the overlook or was this a real climbing accident?

Still making friends David? Not the sharpest pencil in the box, are ya

I am a father and a husband and a climber. I continue to climb and to free solo, although my standards have slipped some on a good day I still free solo to 5.10. If I did not climb, I do not know who I would be. My son is 4 years old and sometimes he wants to go climbing with me. We have climbed 3-pitch routes together. He has followed and cleaned trad pitches that I have lead. And we have rappelled together off of climbs. Sometimes he gets scared. He has learned that it is ok to be scared and that he can do tough things even when he is. Every day we risk failing our children in countless ways. Death is not the worst way that we might fail them. Mitch

quote: Originally posted by Rafael H: Is it faster to hand-drill with 1/4" bit? What is best put in such a hole for emergency bailing or new routes? Thanks. For emergency bailing: 1) Get good at down-climbing. It will save your ass more often than any other technique or piece of equipment can. Once you practice it you will find down climbing to be easier than climbing up; you will never have to do a pull up. 2) Sling a natural feature: root, tree, bush, chockstone, boulder, tunnel, pinch, knob. Or down-climb to where you can. 3) Cams are alot faster to place than even 1/4" bolts but nut placements are almost always available, especially if you are willing to down-climb. 4) If you've got a pencil dick it should easily fit into a 1/4" hole. And if you need help keeping it up, just think of Christian Griffith in Danskins.

BTW, my record is 21 pitches in three hours. But you can still be my hero, Antagonizer. You crack ho you. [This message has been edited by Retrosaurus (edited 08-30-2001).]

Smoked 15 rocks then pitched? WOW!

Steve, It should be open. I was in the Icicle today and that section of the road was not signed. The closed areas are fairly well delineated by signs along the road. Aidan, There are no restrictions on the Enchantments. The road to Stuart Lake Trail is gated at Bridge Creek Campground. You will have to approach up through Snow Lakes. [This message has been edited by Retrosaurus (edited 08-31-2001).]

There is never a lack for someone to beat the drum around here. Lambone, Have you thought about "sensitivity training"? Johnny, Have you thought about not being so sensitive? I am nauseated. I have to get out of here to eat some raw meat and sacrifice a few virgins. [This message has been edited by Retrosaurus (edited 08-30-2001).]

WE ARE THE ALIENS.

Slappy, The route that you are thinking of is Crossing the Deleware With Your Pants Down, on Sunshine Wall (1st crack right of Red M&Ms) which is a lot harder and a lot more difficult to protect. I placed the gear on Crossing on rappel and it was still terrible; worst of course at the crux. SBD Positive/Pudding Time is not that way at all. All gear was placed on lead and the climb was quite well-protected. Aside from the fooling around at the start (bouldering up and down the first 8 or 10 feet) that it took to get really good gear in it is very straight forward. That being said, it really would not bother me too much if the first bolt was replaced. But it really is not necessary to climb the route safely. And certainly none of the others are. Are you promoting the idea that it is ok to bolt cracks if you get there first? I hope not. Mitch

Peter Puget, Thanks for your clear, well studied thoughts on top-roping. I have to agree 100%. A willingness to top-rope instead of fixing gear displays a grace and humility that is rarely seen in climbing. Mitch

The way that I climbed it in 95 was not really a variation, it is the same route, same stone, same moves, just without clipping the bolts and with needing to find extra stances to place gear from.

quote: Originally posted by Cpt.Caveman: Puddin tane ask me gain I'll tell you the same Hey Retro I dont know about this route. What is the deal? How many holes in the rock now? Cpt., Pudding Time 5.11a FA Tony Miller, Matt Steele March 1994 is at the far left end of Middle East Wall. It has eight bolts plus the TR anchor. The first ten feet of the climb is a bit bouldery and difficult to place protection on. It is a bit over-rated (not at all unusual for Frenchman Coulee.) There is a good photo of the route on page 43 of Marlene and Jim's book. It is pretty good climbing. I climbed it without clipping any of the bolts in Oct 95 naming the variation "SBD positive" as in "Shrinking Ball Disease". It was never run out and all the pro was good (all nuts except for one microcam 1/2 to 2/3rds of the way up the route.) I remember bouldering up to the left of the crack and then right to arrange the first piece of gear on the climb. Have to ask Paul how many and which bolts are removed vs. smashed. If the first bolt remains, that wouldn't be too bad as this is the only place where the protection is not completely straight forward. The top-rope anchors can be reached from the top of the cliff. Mitch

Ok , back to Puddin' Time. Is any one going to be outraged when I pull all those bolts out of the rock with my new Dayton Bar? Y'all know how anxious I must be. (Itchy as a rap bolter with his finger on the trigger.) If you want input before I act, I need to hear about it very soon. I'm starting to twitch. Mitch

Paul, It was not me that chopped Puddin Time, although I have lead it and protected it well using only nuts. It is a shame "if" the rock was scarred in the chopping and a shame that it was bolted in the first place. Those that know me will know that I would be the first to take credit for any actions that I have been involved in; but this was not one. If it would help to clean things up, I volunteer to remove the remaining bolts. It is a bolted crack climb. I know that there are people that will presume that I was involved, but I am not responsible for their presumptions. Mitch

Brian, Before you tag Abbey as a terrorist based on a highly entertaining and funny piece of fiction you should read his book "Desert Solitaire". But since it seems obvious that you won't be swayed, just buy your Northwest Forest Pass and pave the world. Mitch [This message has been edited by Retrosaurus (edited 08-14-2001).]

quote: Originally posted by Brian Rybolt: "The late great Abbey"?? Surely you jest! Edward Abbey's "Monkey Wrench Gang" book puts him in a class with Timothy McVeigh and Osama Bin Laden. Brian, Abbey was an environmentalist and a writer, highly aclaimed. The characters in one of his books were terrorists (for the environment). If this puts him in the same class as Timothy McVeigh and Osama Bin Laden, you may have a bit of trouble separating fiction from reality.

While whe're talking about it; when you get to the top of OS and take a leak, remember not to piss on any vegatation or even soil, or you might as well be taking a rototiller to it as the goats will tear it up and it will all erode with the next rain or blow away with the next strong wind as the soil dries.

Peter Eater, It is very easy to stand behind a veil of anonymity and criticize others based on their track record when you have none of your own. I did smash those hangars at vantage out of respect for tradition and the environment. I did no damage to the rock and no increase in visual impact at all, merely rendered the bolts unusable. I chopped the bolts at first and then they grew back as half inchers. I hammered them flat and the lemmings just strainghtened them back out anc clipped them. quote: Originally posted by Cpt.Caveman: Peter since you have decided not to identify yourself I treat you like you are. Another faceless name. Dont expect much effort until then...

Matt, Get real . Those arguements against traditional routes are weak and we all know it. The only real controversial issues are installation of fixed gear, drilling, chipping and over use (erosion/multiple trails, etc) and overuse almost always requires mass bolting. Mitch

Wake up all thumbs, It's $30 this season. What about next season. This is our land. It does not belong to the forest service. It is public land that the forest service is entrusted to manage for us. A freedom has been taken away from us, our children and all future generations. Do you really want to support this action? Yeah, it's easier to bend over and take it, but it turns my guts. Retro

The mini-skirt is back. I have yet to see one of these with a harness though.

quote: Originally posted by bjorn: ... some tips and advice for removing unsightly bolts ... The first problem is getting your bar under the bolt hanger. Either back the bolt off with a wrench to where you can get under it or drive knifeblades then lost arrows then start stacking pins between the hanger and the rock until you can get a BIG ASSED bar under it. Then start working the bar from all different angles. Padding between the rock and the bar with hardwood scraps will help to minimize superficial scarring and positioning the fulcrum point for the best mechanical advantage. It helps to pound on the head of the bolt (as if driving the bolt back into the rock) while applying maximum pressure to the bar. This violent in/out jarring destroys the sleeve that tightens over the conical part of the expansion bolt and the bolt can then be pried out of the hole. I am still looking for the best way to fill the hole. I am thinking that sizing the right size/shape pebble with the 3/8, 1/2" hole in the bolt hanger and epoxing it in place with putty epoxy may have leave the best appearance. Does anyone out there have direct experience?