The Trillion Dollar Toy

[rob]

[JayB]

I just don't know how Canadian's sleep at night without spending half their federal budget on bombs....

 

America maintains a big military, in part, as a means to enforce it's economic policy to keep our consumption juggernaut (over) fed. Successful or unsuccessful, this has been a cornerstone of our foreign policy strategy for decades.

 

But the party line that our military is defensive? Uh...yeah, right.

 

If defense were all that we were worried about, we could adopt the Dominican Republic's Coast Guard system: An old man, his nephew, and a double barreled shotgun.

 

 

I think the party line is that if we decide we're no longer interested in projecting power around the globe, we'll still be quite secure at least in the sense that the odds of anyone in China seriously contemplating any kind of invasion/domination of the anywhere Americas are literally zero.

 

Countries like Taiwan, Korea, and Japan and various countries in the Middle East would probably notice that we're gone. If we said a final goodbye and they had to assume 100% responsibility for their own defense, that would presumably affect their national priorities, sense of security, etc way more than it would affect ours.

 

I'm not even sure the Euros would notice we're gone unless there's another round of ethnic slaughter a' la the ex Yugoslavia that erupts somewhere nearby that they have zero will/capacity to do anything about.

 

 

 

[prole]

 

and the J-20 right on its heels...

 

 

Talk about a security blanket, Steve Wynn is lovin' it!

 

September will be our fifth anniversary in the People's Republic of China in Macau, and we love it there. We are so grateful to be part of that market and to be allowed to participate in that community. We find the political environment, the regulatory environment, the human resource environment that we're in to be absolutely delicious. Life is quite straightforward in China. The government is predictable. Our employees are eminently trainable. They're anxious to please. They have a fabulous attitude, whether they're local Macau people, mainland Chinese people, folks from the Philippines, they're just wonderful and all of that's come together to help us deliver the kind of product that we've always been delivering.

[JayB]

For myself, I'd rather we be the hammer than the anvil. Be the ones who dictate, rather be dictated too.

 

Oh, we're soon to be the anvil. And not because our military prowess has been usurped. It will be by those countries that have invested in technology, education, infrastructure, and implemented their global economic vision. And not flushing their treasure into the global military dominance black hole. India and China are coming on.

 

[1980's]Don't forget about Japan![/1980's]

 

All things being equal, people living in the US should be far less concerned with a relative military decline of the US than people who have collectively lived under the security blanket that the US has provided since WWII. Export driven growth is quite a bit easier when you don't have to worry about secure shipping lanes, etc, etc, etc...

 

We'll be fine.

 

 

 

80s Japan - effectively banned from having a military, democratic, interested in engaging with the west

00s China - largest standing army in the world rapidly militarising with technology stolen from the West, bizarre cleptocratic/communist system of government, interested in dominating the west

 

Yeah, it'll work out great. At least well get some shitty copies of climbing gear along the way so we can't even trust that. Oh, and they'll rip off everything else along the way:

http://birdabroad.wordpress.com/2011/07/20/are-you-listening-steve-jobs/

 

They're way poorer than us and probably will be for decades, they're aging rapidly, there's going to be something like 130-million mathematical bachelors cruising around the Chinese interior, and their power structure is a net long-term liability, rather than an asset.

 

They've got more than enough going on inside their borders to pre-occupy them, and even if they harbor fantasies about dominating the West their capacity to do anything more than sell us a bunch of stuff for lower prices than we can produce it here will be next to zero. Great.

 

What are they going to do with their military that would enable them to dominate us? Blockade their own exports to the US?

[Jim]

I don't think that is the strategy. But I'd say by owning one heck of a lot of our bonds that they have some leverage.

[JayB]

 

and the J-20 right on its heels...

 

 

Talk about a security blanket, Steve Wynn is lovin' it!

 

September will be our fifth anniversary in the People's Republic of China in Macau, and we love it there. We are so grateful to be part of that market and to be allowed to participate in that community. We find the political environment, the regulatory environment, the human resource environment that we're in to be absolutely delicious. Life is quite straightforward in China. The government is predictable. Our employees are eminently trainable. They're anxious to please. They have a fabulous attitude, whether they're local Macau people, mainland Chinese people, folks from the Philippines, they're just wonderful and all of that's come together to help us deliver the kind of product that we've always been delivering.

 

Don't forget this retard:

 

"China vs. America: Which Is the Developing Country?

From new roads to wise leadership, sound financials and five-year plans, Beijing has the winning approach.

 

Recently I flew from Los Angeles to China to attend a corporate board-of-directors meeting in Shanghai, as well as customer and government visits there and in Beijing. After the trip was over, in thinking about the United States and China, it was not clear to me which is the developed, and which is the developing, country.

 

Infrastructure: Let's face it, Los Angeles is decaying. Its airport is cramped and dirty, too small for the volume it tries to handle and in a state of disrepair. In contrast, the airports in Beijing and Shanghai are brand new, clean and incredibly spacious, with friendly, courteous staff galore. They are extremely well-designed to handle the large volume of air traffic needed to carry out global business these days

 

...Human Rights/Free Speech: In this area, our American view is that China has a ton of work to do. Their view is that we are nuts for not blocking pornography and antigovernment points-of-view from our youth and citizens..."

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303544604576430162195057084.html

 

Blah, blah, blah. Reads like a LeMonde Editorial from the 30's heaping praise on Stalinist Russia.

 

"Centralizing all decision making and resource-allocating power in the hands of a few technocrats made a lot of sense to me when I was running Microsoft. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we ran all of society this way. Just look at China!..."

 

Nauseating.

[billcoe]

Hugh Jardon wants a chart.

[billcoe]

Hugh, this one's for U babe.

 

 

Hope it helps:-) You're welcome.

_________________________________________________________

 

 

Lets add airplanes to this list:

 

 

[prole]

They're way poorer than us and probably will be for decades, they're aging rapidly, there's going to be something like 130-million mathematical bachelors cruising around the Chinese interior, and their power structure is a net long-term liability, rather than an asset.

 

Next!

 

[JayB]

I don't think that is the strategy. But I'd say by owning one heck of a lot of our bonds that they have some leverage.

 

Seems like the leverage is at least partly on our side. The reason that they've accumulated so many dollar-denominated assets is to keep the value of their currency depressed relative to ours, so that the stuff that they make their will be cheaper in dollar terms.

 

Say what you will about that strategy, but even if you assume it's got more pro's than cons, if they stop buying these assets then the value of their currency will skyrocket vs the dollar, and they'll quickly have an unemployment problem that worsens as their currency appreciates - since people will stop buying the stuff that they make if it costs more than alternatives made elsewhere. They're also rapidly losing their cost advantage in production, which makes them even more sensitive to the effects of appreciation vs the dollar.

 

Given the structural basis for government spending growth here, it's also worth asking what would happen if they hadn't bought so many bonds. The cuts being contemplated now would be even worse if we'd had to finance all of that debt at higher rates.

 

Not sure that having trillions of dollar denominated debts issued by the US government gives the Chinese quite as much leverage as is commonly thought, particularly when they have little choice but to keep buying unless they want to see what a rapid contraction in their exports does to the "harmonious society" that they're trying to create.

[prole]

 

and the J-20 right on its heels...

 

 

Talk about a security blanket, Steve Wynn is lovin' it!

 

September will be our fifth anniversary in the People's Republic of China in Macau, and we love it there. We are so grateful to be part of that market and to be allowed to participate in that community. We find the political environment, the regulatory environment, the human resource environment that we're in to be absolutely delicious. Life is quite straightforward in China. The government is predictable. Our employees are eminently trainable. They're anxious to please. They have a fabulous attitude, whether they're local Macau people, mainland Chinese people, folks from the Philippines, they're just wonderful and all of that's come together to help us deliver the kind of product that we've always been delivering.

 

Don't forget this retard:

 

"China vs. America: Which Is the Developing Country?

From new roads to wise leadership, sound financials and five-year plans, Beijing has the winning approach.

 

Recently I flew from Los Angeles to China to attend a corporate board-of-directors meeting in Shanghai, as well as customer and government visits there and in Beijing. After the trip was over, in thinking about the United States and China, it was not clear to me which is the developed, and which is the developing, country.

 

Infrastructure: Let's face it, Los Angeles is decaying. Its airport is cramped and dirty, too small for the volume it tries to handle and in a state of disrepair. In contrast, the airports in Beijing and Shanghai are brand new, clean and incredibly spacious, with friendly, courteous staff galore. They are extremely well-designed to handle the large volume of air traffic needed to carry out global business these days

 

...Human Rights/Free Speech: In this area, our American view is that China has a ton of work to do. Their view is that we are nuts for not blocking pornography and antigovernment points-of-view from our youth and citizens..."

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303544604576430162195057084.html

 

Blah, blah, blah. Reads like a LeMonde Editorial from the 30's heaping praise on Stalinist Russia.

 

"Centralizing all decision making and resource-allocating power in the hands of a few technocrats made a lot of sense to me when I was running Microsoft. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we ran all of society this way. Just look at China!..."

 

Nauseating.

 

Nauseating or otherwise, it's pretty clear that when comparing America's 30-year experiment with neoclassical economics with countries with even mild industrial policies, it's failed both to "deliver the goods" and maintain a vibrant democratic political culture. But hey, we do have really nice platinum-level facilities for millionaires and up!

[JayB]

Hugh, this one's for U babe.

 

 

Hope it helps:-) You're welcome.

_________________________________________________________

 

 

Lets add airplanes to this list:

 

 

Love the fact that whomever put that picture together chucked plastic surgery and McDonald's consumption and rape/crime/imprisonment into the same general basket of societal defects.

[JayB]

 

and the J-20 right on its heels...

 

 

Talk about a security blanket, Steve Wynn is lovin' it!

 

September will be our fifth anniversary in the People's Republic of China in Macau, and we love it there. We are so grateful to be part of that market and to be allowed to participate in that community. We find the political environment, the regulatory environment, the human resource environment that we're in to be absolutely delicious. Life is quite straightforward in China. The government is predictable. Our employees are eminently trainable. They're anxious to please. They have a fabulous attitude, whether they're local Macau people, mainland Chinese people, folks from the Philippines, they're just wonderful and all of that's come together to help us deliver the kind of product that we've always been delivering.

 

Don't forget this retard:

 

"China vs. America: Which Is the Developing Country?

From new roads to wise leadership, sound financials and five-year plans, Beijing has the winning approach.

 

Recently I flew from Los Angeles to China to attend a corporate board-of-directors meeting in Shanghai, as well as customer and government visits there and in Beijing. After the trip was over, in thinking about the United States and China, it was not clear to me which is the developed, and which is the developing, country.

 

Infrastructure: Let's face it, Los Angeles is decaying. Its airport is cramped and dirty, too small for the volume it tries to handle and in a state of disrepair. In contrast, the airports in Beijing and Shanghai are brand new, clean and incredibly spacious, with friendly, courteous staff galore. They are extremely well-designed to handle the large volume of air traffic needed to carry out global business these days

 

...Human Rights/Free Speech: In this area, our American view is that China has a ton of work to do. Their view is that we are nuts for not blocking pornography and antigovernment points-of-view from our youth and citizens..."

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303544604576430162195057084.html

 

Blah, blah, blah. Reads like a LeMonde Editorial from the 30's heaping praise on Stalinist Russia.

 

"Centralizing all decision making and resource-allocating power in the hands of a few technocrats made a lot of sense to me when I was running Microsoft. Wouldn't it be wonderful if we ran all of society this way. Just look at China!..."

 

Nauseating.

 

Nauseating or otherwise, it's pretty clear that when comparing America's 30-year experiment with neoclassical economics with countries with even mild industrial policies, it's failed both to "deliver the goods" and maintain a vibrant democratic political culture. But hey, we do have really nice platinum-level facilities for millionaires and up!

 

-Clear to whom? How have I missed the stories about the Americans risking death by packaging themselves in shipping containers to seek out a better life for themselves in China?

 

-It must be interesting to anyone who lived through the 70's to hear them expounded as the high-water mark of American civilization.

[prole]

Nauseating or otherwise, it's pretty clear that when comparing America's 30-year experiment with neoclassical economics with countries with even mild industrial policies, it's failed both to "deliver the goods" and maintain a vibrant democratic political culture. But hey, we do have really nice platinum-level facilities for millionaires and up!

 

-Clear to whom? How have I missed the stories about the Americans risking death by packaging themselves in shipping containers to seek out a better life for themselves in China?

 

-It must be interesting to anyone who lived through the 70's to hear them expounded as the high-water mark of American civilization.

 

Planes work just fine.

 

[Hugh Conway]

[

They're way poorer than us and probably will be for decades, they're aging rapidly, there's going to be something like 130-million mathematical bachelors cruising around the Chinese interior, and their power structure is a net long-term liability, rather than an asset.

 

Those sound reasons supporting external warfare. A huge group o f pissed off poor horny men.

 

 

Amusingly there are currently thousands of Americans risking punishment to illegally work in China. It's easier to entire legally and stay illegally in China; thanks to the W regime the US wastes billions and generally makes life a pita to enter legally for visitors from many countries.

 

Course like every Lynette failed wasteful policy jay never supported that

Edited July 20, 2011 by Hugh Conway

[billcoe]

To go along with the other chart for Hugh

 

[JayB]

[

They're way poorer than us and probably will be for decades, they're aging rapidly, there's going to be something like 130-million mathematical bachelors cruising around the Chinese interior, and their power structure is a net long-term liability, rather than an asset.

 

Those sound reasons supporting external warfare. A huge group o f pissed off poor horny men.

 

 

Amusingly there are currently thousands of Americans risking punishment to illegally work in China. It's easier to entire legally and stay illegally in China; thanks to the W regime the US wastes billions and generally makes life a pita to enter legally for visitors from many countries.

 

Course like every Lynette failed wasteful policy jay never supported that

 

-Might also make things interesting domestically.

 

-Yes. Engineers flying to China in 747 wide-bodies = paying organized crime syndicates tens of thousands of dollars to pack you into shipping containers for weeks of overseas transit.

 

How 'bout we turn our attention to Cuba so that we can find more ludicrous equivalents where none actually exist.

 

"What about all of the people risking everything to flee Cuba by boat?

 

"I don't know about you, but the last time I was in West Palm Beach and the Keys I saw *tons* of people out in boats, and there are multiple drownings in yachting accidents every year, not to mention the close calls in all of the charity regattas, so....

[Hugh Conway]

english teachers working for a pittance are now engineers?

 

If you haven't paid attention China's been externalizing threats (evil Americans/Europeans/colonialists) and pacifying the population with massive economic growth. That's quite often been a precursor to war. Why you refuse to make a connection between "external war" and "interesting domesticly" is fucking hilarious given your support for Iraq and Afghanistan - useless wars to shore up less interesting domestic situations

 

Course that wouldn't fit the "everythings fine" narrative