Peter_Puget Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Prole - Thats beyond the pale. Playoffs this year! Wish I was in AZ right now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrox Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 i might remind you that those who are professionally "my kids" are collectively "your kids" pete, i routinely start my class w/ quotes, facts, stats, political cartoons, pics, etc. - i usually want to understand them meself though, at least so i can help the kids sort out their own take on it - i can't say i understand your pics - wanna help? As a teacher, how you do feel about the mass use of sick days to shut the school system down and encouragement by the teachers for students to join in protesting (in lieu of attending school)? Teacher's shouldn't politic the kids, IMHO. The kids do not have a clue what's going on, though, nor do their parents. Taking sick days? I guess they're sick. At least they're standing up for something they believe in. Is it ok to lie to your employer so long as you're "standing up for something"? What are these kids learning from this situation? [video:youtube] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Choada_Boy Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Who says they are lying? Perhaps they are sick? Does the district require a note from a doctor as part of the collective bargaining agreement regarding acceptable employee absences? I don't live in WI. I can't say what the kids are learning. I don't really care what they think. I'd like to hear from the parents/taxpayers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrox Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 The protesters are claiming to be protesting certain policies yet their argumentation seems to be more of an ad hominem nature and is at best clichéd sloganeering. I was struck by how closely they resembled J_B’s attacks argumentation on this site. The links we a couple examples that popped up on a google search. I saw a video of a union rep claiming the teachers were taking a personal day despite the fact that Madison school district has a three day prior notice policy for personal days. Lying about their activities makes it pretty hard to claim they are on the right side of the argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Well if they are smart it will support the belief that the teachers union is not afraid to tell lies and cheat to get a some small gain. Whats amazingis that these same teachers will most likely penalize some kid who is caught forging a "sick note" to excuse a truant day. Irony eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 i might remind you that those who are professionally "my kids" are collectively "your kids" pete, i routinely start my class w/ quotes, facts, stats, political cartoons, pics, etc. - i usually want to understand them meself though, at least so i can help the kids sort out their own take on it - i can't say i understand your pics - wanna help? As a teacher, how you do feel about the mass use of sick days to shut the school system down and encouragement by the teachers for students to join in protesting (in lieu of attending school)? "sick outs" are a standard tool of unions to demonstrate power and resolve - sounds like this union has a legitimate fear and thus needs to demonstrate both those things - admin is within its legal rights to punish the abuse of sick days of coursse, but in reality will likely only intensify hostility if it does so in this case there is practical educational value for kids (and adults) in participating in politics, but no, i don't tell kids what to think about a particuliar issue, just try to understand the various sides viewpoints personally, present them in some sort of interesting fashion to the kids, then encourage them to sort them out themselves and figure out how to turn their thoughts into practical political actions - just spent my last class helping kids w/ radically different political values then mine map out their plan to destroy that which i want to protect - ironic, eh? dickhead that i am, were i to encourage my kids to skip school for a protest, i'd of course give them homework to do while they were there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I'd say this is a far, far more valuable education for WI's kids than the memorizing the quadratic equation. Might as well let 'em in on what America's really all about as early as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 The protesters are claiming to be protesting certain policies yet their argumentation seems to be more of an ad hominem nature and is at best clichéd sloganeering. I was struck by how closely they resembled J_B’s attacks argumentation on this site. The links we a couple examples that popped up on a google search. Liar! I only use ad-homs with reptilian trolls like yourself and your thuggish friends who specialize in personal attacks. In case you didn't realize with your pea-sized brain and fascistic tendencies, saying that JayB is a social darwisnist is an accurate description of the policies he advocates every day on this board, not an ad-hominem. I challenge you to show that I use ad-hominem regularly with anyone who actually debates to the point instead of attacking my person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivan Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I'd say this is a far, far more valuable education for WI's kids than the memorizing the quadratic equation. Might as well let 'em in on what America's really all about as early as possible. both things are valuable, and both things vital for a healthy republic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Regressives make anti-labor laws (no right to strike for teachers in WI) to prevent employees from legitimately exercising their collective rights, and then they whine when employees have to go around these unfair laws to exercise their civil rights. Hypocrites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 I'd say this is a far, far more valuable education for WI's kids than the memorizing the quadratic equation. Might as well let 'em in on what America's really all about as early as possible. both things are valuable, and both things vital for a healthy republic OK: give us the quadratic equation for 1/4 of your grade: Go. No GOOGLEZ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugh Conway Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 The protesters are claiming to be protesting certain policies yet their argumentation seems to be more of an ad hominem nature and is at best clichéd sloganeering. I was struck by how closely they resembled J_B’s attacks argumentation on this site. The links we a couple examples that popped up on a google search. The Shit calling the Turd brown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Righties are wondering WTF? in WI, but the state employees know this is a nationwide battle for collective bargaining rights and if they lose this one it's won't be just a WI thing. The Baggers are trying out a little union busting (nothing new there). We'll see if it works. Seems like it might not be going to plan, though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Well if they are smart it will support the belief that the teachers union is not afraid to tell lies and cheat to get a some small gain. Whats amazingis that these same teachers will most likely penalize some kid who is caught forging a "sick note" to excuse a truant day. Irony eh? Regressives like PP aren't satisfied with having taken the right to strike from WI teachers, they also want to take away their right to bargain collectively. Then, PP feels insulted when he is compared to a Pinkerton right out of robber barons time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Curiously missing: a proposed law that would remove most collective bargaining rights from WI state employees. This isn't 'teacher selfishness' at work here. It's a full on, gloves off, union busting attempt. The WI senate has so far refused to vote on the bill. Sounds like the governor just didn't have the mandate he thought he did. Now he's an asshole in the eyes of every one of his state employees...good luck governing effectively from here on out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 So the law takes away their right to bargain collectively or does it just remove certain items from the table? Now there you go again..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 So the Wisc unions appear to be encouraging their members to "call in sick." One here in Wa outright tells untruths in tv ads. Anything for a buck. what greedy fucks! seattle times Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 More accurately, using sick days rather than an out and out strike prevents the governor from putting an emergency contingency plan into place which would enable him to bring in the National Guard to fill in those slots. The state workers are just being smart. Not something you're familiar with, I realize, but there you have it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrox Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Curiously missing: a proposed law that would remove most collective bargaining rights from WI state employees. This isn't 'teacher selfishness' at work here. It's a full on, gloves off, union busting attempt. The WI senate has so far refused to vote on the bill. Sounds like the governor just didn't have the mandate he thought he did. Now he's an asshole in the eyes of every one of his state employees...good luck governing effectively from here on out! That's a strange way to say that the Democrats in the WI senate fled the state in order to stall the bill that they know will pass against their wishes. I guess maybe the Union shouldn't have stiff armed the state when the state came to them with the budgetary shortfall. While I can understand why the union is trying to defend itself I don't sympathize with their position after they essentially told the state to fuck off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrox Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 More accurately, using sick days rather than an out and out strike prevents the governor from putting an emergency contingency plan into place which would enable him to bring in the National Guard to fill in those slots. The state workers are just being smart. Not something you're familiar with, I realize, but there you have it. Actually they're being dishonest and violating their terms of employment. Being out sick and at the demonstration proves this. They also brought their students so they could teach them dishonesty is OK so long as it gets you what you want when you're a state/union employee/member. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) The governor's proposal would eliminate collective bargaining rights for health care and pensions, severely limit collective bargaining power for wages, and cut wages by 8%. Walker calls it a 'modest proposal'. His logic in removing these rights permanently? 'Hey, we don't have any money right now, so there's nothing to negotiate.' It's a union busting bill, pure and simple. Good luck with that, Govnuh! Edited February 18, 2011 by tvashtarkatena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Lots of swagger, lots of acrimony; no results. Voters tend to punish lawmakers who play this game for very long. Its kind of funny how every opinion poll out there contradicts the 'groundswell of support' the Bagger movement believes it has. Their concerns are simply not our concerns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitrox Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Regardless of what the Governor is doing I refuse to support liars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
j_b Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 stop the charade, everybody knows you wouldn't support public worker's right to a descent living no matter what. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvashtarkatena Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Spoken like a true Republican! LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.