selkirk Posted January 18, 2011 Posted January 18, 2011 Has anybody tried these out? I'm looking for something that's lighter, more compressible, and provides an equal amount of warmth as my fleece for mid layer on winter climbs, PNW volcano's etc. Would prefer synthetic (have a down puffy already for when it's really cold) Was also contemplating the Nano-Puff, Montbell Thermawrap, and the Arctery Atom (I think?) TIA Quote
Water Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 Primaloft seems the general standard for synth insulation Nano puff comes in pullover variety for weight savings Thermawrap is good (its what I have) and feels quite warm to me but empirically doesn't rank as highly for its proprietary insulation (exeloft or whatever) can't speak to the Arcy Atom but am pretty sure it costs an arm and a leg. haven't heard anyone poopoo the 1st ascent stuff from EB really, mostly solid reviews people seem satisfied for what they pay for. I haven't compared all these but I am going to take a stab and say that the Igniter is the warmer and heavier of the two and Serrano the lighter, but both will be 2-5oz heavier than their Arcy, Montbell, or Pata cousins for equal size. depends on how big of a deal it is to you but for instance I have pata gift card and could get the puff pants they make right now, but am waiting for a coupon for the EB 1st scent Igniter pants even though they are a few oz more because i trust the quality is on par, warranty sure is, and I'd rather save the $50-80 difference an care less about the oz for something that has a limited life span to begin with (synthetic fill). Quote
hemp22 Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) I just recently got a serrano. I'm recovering from an injury, so haven't really tested it out yet - but I like the design and craftsmanship seems great. I'd say the primaloft one certainly lighter than a fleece of the same warmth. I'm not thrilled with the cut though - it's a little more baggy around the torso than I would have liked. When I tried on a medium, which fit well around the torso (and length was fine too), it was way too tight in the shoulders. To get one that doesn't feel like I'm going to rip the back apart, I had to size up to a large, which is baggy & a little long for me. I haven't tried on the Atom, but based on my experience with other arcteryx stuff, I'd expect that it would be a more "active" cut. So, I'd say try them on to get the fit you want, and if the FA cut works for you, then the serrano can be an excellent deal when one of their sales comes around. Edit to add: The fit complaint is in no way isolated to EB/FA stuff - I tend to have that problem with most clothing Edited January 19, 2011 by hemp22 Quote
layton Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 i've gone through 5 puffball (nanopuffs) so far and they get better everytime...plus refreshed for free at Patagonia Quote
JasonG Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 . . .meaning that you take them back when they are worn, and they are replaced a la REI? 5 times, eh? Quote
bgratias Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 I've been using an igniter for awhile and like it a lot. The cut fits me well, and I like the option of tall sizes. It is quite a bit warmer than a typical fleece, and less breathable. I keep it in the included stuff bag, and it takes up more room than a fleece, but I'm sure it could be compressed more in a different bag. I have no complaints about the quality; I am surprised at how well the thin outer fabric has held up to abuse. Overall, it's worked great as a belay jacket for temperatures that don't require a big down jacket. The low-ish price (119.00 for mine) is a definite plus as well. Quote
bearbreeder Posted January 19, 2011 Posted January 19, 2011 (edited) everything everybody said above with 2 notes 1. the serano is very similar to my atom ... the difference is that it uses 60g/m primaloft one ... and doesnt come in the hoody version unfortunately 2. the igniter is really comparable to the micropuff since its 100g/m primaloft one for a fleece replacement a 60g/m jacket is the way to go ... for something a bit more a 100-133 g/m jacket ... one very minor detail that didnt impress me on the EB FA was the use of foam inserts instead of plastic cord locks for the waist adjustment ... but thats a very minor quibble edit ... if you didnt already know patagucci is on sale on both the pata web site and campsaver ... if that helps Edited January 19, 2011 by bearbreeder Quote
Autoxfil Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 I have the NanoPuff and have used it extensively. My partner has an Igniter and I've used it a little. I tried them on quite a bit and they seem to run a little snug - I'm skinny and don't think a Medium would work for an over-layer for me. The Igniter is much warmer, as you'd expect from the weight. It also has a fully-featured hood, hem drawcord, velcro cuffs, etc. The NanoPuff just has elastic for the hood, cufs, and hem. I have also used the MH Compressor a lot, and I believe the Igniter is superior in every way. I do not reccommend either as a mid-layer. You're adding three layers of highly impermeabile fabric to your system, which will cause you to sweat up fast and not dry off quickly. I too was excited to get a warmer, more versatile layer in my system, but after experimenting and being very dissappointed, I'm back to fleece - R1 Hoody or R2 jacket, or both for really cold stuff. They are heavier, but in my experience the breathability and quick drying are more important than the weight. And I'm a real weight geek: gram scale, spreadsheets, and everything. Quote
robpatterson5 Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 I was just thinking of asking about the nanopuff as a mid-layer, sounds like its fairly sweaty even with a R1 for winter? Quote
Autoxfil Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 It all depends on your exertion level and personal physiology. One of my climbing partners sweats even when he feels chilly if he's working hard. He can't even wear down belay jackets because he soaks them while shivering at the belay. I personally don't sweat much until I'm feeling too warm, so I can get away with less clothing, and clothing that doesn't deal with moisture as well. However, we've both gone to fleece and softshells because we find they provide a much wider comfort range than hardshells and synthetic insulation. A lot of mountaineering involves quick changes in temperature and exertion - burning calves up a sunny snow couloir, then slow, careful mixed moves in a windy chimney, for instance. Even in less intense situations it's hard to swap layers when climbing, especially when harnessed. If you sweat less than my climbing buddy, and aren't working as hard (we usually climb vertical ice with high humidity and temps in the teens), then you can perhaps get away with a Nanopuff or other synthetic. For most hiking, I bet it would work fine. For non-technical climbs, maybe. I wore my Nanopuff on Adams (solo up the dog route) in July. It was in the 20's and I was too hot to climb in it - I shed it soon after starting up from 9k camp in the dark for a thin wool layer and Houdini. On top, standing around with 25-30mph winds it was very nice. So in my experience (mostly in the Northeast), and with my physiology, I opt for ultimate breath-ability and quick drying in all my clothing except the belay jacket - at least for technical climbing. For hiking, and non-technical mountaineering I may, on occasion, use something like my Nanopuff as a layer while moving to save some weight. If the effort is moderate and consistent, it can certainly work. Many Cascade snow climbs fall into that category. Like most questions pertaining to either people or the mountains, there's no universal answer, but hopefully my experience can provide some guidance. Quote
robpatterson5 Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 cool, thanks for the considered reply - I wonder if anyone else has any comments? I usually climb in a R1 hoody and R2 vest if it is cool, but the combo has been a little light for me on a few occasions when where a 100g PL1 hoody has been too much overtop. Dont usually take a fleece jacket with me b/c of weight and bulk but have been carrying a spare R.5 top b/c of this - I'd been thinking about the nanopuffs to save a bit of weight and also for their windproofness. I just got a pata ascentionist and my memory of their readymix was that the windproofing was lacking (but have been reassured that is fixed)... Quote
Autoxfil Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 (edited) Windproofing on the Ascentionist is not lacking. I just had mine on Mt Washington (NH) in 60mph gusts and was quite happy. Hold off on the extra layer if you haven't tried the Ascentionist yet - you might be surprised how much additional warmth it offers over a hardshell. Edited January 20, 2011 by Autoxfil Quote
lazyalpinist Posted January 20, 2011 Posted January 20, 2011 Don't have any experience with the Serrano. But the Igniter is too heavy for your intended use as a fleece. The EB folks tell you it is what RMI uses on Rainier in the summer. But probably as an in camp jacket. I have one, and use it in camp. Related to your request, I do have a MEC Uplink. (Think Nano Puff) I think it would be feasible to think this might act as a midlayer in winter. Although I doubt it breaths as well as a fleece. Looks like the Serrano is heavier than the Nano, so I don't see it working to your needs. Although everyone is different. Also, the FA stuff coming in tall sizes is awesome. Quote
Nitrox Posted January 22, 2011 Posted January 22, 2011 one very minor detail that didnt impress me on the EB FA was the use of foam inserts instead of plastic cord locks for the waist adjustment ... but thats a very minor quibble In addition to the neoprene waste cinches the Igniter only has a single front zipper. I think you can add plastic cinches but you're stuck with the single zipper unless you have the jacket altered. Overall I like the Igniter, its a heavy jacket though. Quote
MuchosPixels Posted February 10, 2011 Posted February 10, 2011 Hi, I have the FA Igniter and its an awesome jacket with nice details perfect for climbing. Its very warm, I mainly use it as an over everything layer when stopping or at camp. Its great for the summit. Its basically windproof. Doesnt breathe well enough IMHO to be used as a midlayer unless its extremely cold. It fits me very well with minimal layers or even over the shell with fleece and baselayer under. The fabric is pretty light so care must be taken not to snag or damage it (its quite typical of jackets of this type including the patagonia micro puff). The hood its awesome, easily fits over any helmet (its big) and the chin is lined with thin fleece (very nice), the Patagonia Micro Puff doesnt have those two features (hood is smaller, no fleece lining in chin area) but its as warm. Id say that if you are not going to be encountering temps under about 10-15F this is the only jacket you need along with light baselayers, a powerstretch fleece pullover and a shell. Quote
stever Posted February 13, 2012 Posted February 13, 2012 how does the igniter compare to the MHW compressor? I noticed they no longer use PL1 in the compressor... Quote
bearbreeder Posted February 14, 2012 Posted February 14, 2012 (edited) ive been using this since the new year squishing steve ... and using the money i save for gas money instead ... bought mine for 19$ works as well as any of my other puffies i find at a fraction of the price http://oldnavy.gapcanada.ca/browse/product.do?cid=5286&vid=1&pid=862727&scid=862727003 Edited February 14, 2012 by bearbreeder Quote
billcoe Posted February 14, 2012 Posted February 14, 2012 Holy smokes Bearbreeder...who makes that and whats it stuffed with? I always leave my expensive jackets at home rather than take them along and go screw them up by using them. It's just a matter of time till that strategy bites me in the ass...... Quote
bearbreeder Posted February 15, 2012 Posted February 15, 2012 made by old navy with "frost free" synthetic stuffing ... i find it warmer than my atom lt except for the lack of a hood i honestly find it the same as any other fairly light synthetic puffy ... with this one for 19$ ... i dont care what happens to it ... ill save my $$$$ ones for where it matters ... Quote
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