5.15

[G-spotter]

Your sense is not common, and your everyday experience is both blinkered and parochial. Hence your numbers are simply ridiculous.

[JosephH]

Not at all.

[LostCamKenny]

a million bolts sounds like hyperbole to me but then joseph isn't the sort of guy who would let the facts get in the way of something he wants to believe.

[JosephH]

Bill, good write up. I agree with most of that.

 

Ozone is a perfect example of the rapid result of bolting at a close-in crag. Are there other crags out there? Sure, but for every one that gets bolted, more folks climb, and they in turn want new routes to climb after awhile, so word gets out and the cycle repeats itself. Guys like you attempting to stay ahead of the hordes surf the wake of that cycle by going further afield each time. It was pretty obvious what was going to happen at Ozone and so it gets down to either 'harvesting' those quiet, club-like development days and moving on or, once the deed is done, join the crowds.

 

I've just always suggested the 'whoosh' of development frenzy might just be rapidly trading away the very thing folks are there for when it's happening. That maybe a little balance in that could slow the pace and thus the cycle even though the underlying engine beneath the hood is the gyms versus the bolts alone.

 

As for bolt numbers in Oregon, o.k. let's call it 1k at Smith (probably another 250 in the entire Bend area), then throw in the PDX/Gorge/Mt Hood corridor, Eugene environs, Roseburg and points south, and Hells Canyon and it adds up pretty quick.

[kevbone]

 

Ozone is a perfect example of the rapid result of bolting at a close-in crag.

 

What is wrong with Ozone? When was the last time you climbed there JH?

[JosephH]

Ozone is a perfect example of the rapid result of bolting at a close-in crag.

What is wrong with Ozone? When was the last time you climbed there JH?

The twenty cars and your relentless promotion of it.

[kevbone]

Please tell me how twenty cars effects you since you dont even climb there.

[JosephH]

Please tell me how twenty cars effects you since you dont even climb there.

They're why I don't climb there, but I do appreciate them not being out at Beacon.

[kevbone]

thats cool, because we appreciate you not being at the zone.

[billcoe]

I tend to avoid Ozone as well for the same reason, but last time I was at Broughtons, which is even closer to PDX, there was only one other party at the entire crag. Nobody seems to climb some of those crack routes and they are sadly accumulating dirt. Needs more traffic.

 

Maybe they all moved on to the Ozone?

[Pete_H]

Interestingly enough that's one argument I've heard on the pro side of grid-bolting these obscure erstwhile chossheaps for the masses - is that it keeps the crowds away from other, better crags and spreads out usage / impact. I suppose that argument makes some sense.

[kevbone]

Last time I was at the zone. There was one other party. So busy...... Can ozone help it if it is some of the best climbing around?

[Pete_H]

If by best you mean overbolted shithole choss heap.

[kevbone]

If by best you mean overbolted shithole choss heap.

 

Yup!

[billcoe]

I tend to agree with you Pete. Frankly, I think that it's more the gyms that are pumping in masses of new folks, not the fact that there is more places to climb. They enter clipping bolts as JH says, but it is strange that a few miles from the city limits, in fact inside of the city limits themselves, you can get near solitude still.

 

I only went to the butte 4 or so times last year, which is inside of the city limits, but there were more folks there toproping than previous years. Perhaps of the 100 or so routes there, perhaps 4 to 6 had folks on them after work. I think I even saw 8 cars there once. One time, I could not get on the route I wanted to climb, and went elsewhere even.

 

I rarely see anyone on the best climbs there. Here's Blackberry, it's steep enough to stay nice and clean in between non-ascents.

This is my fat ass there last year Ujahn belaying down below there. Jeff Thomas photo. Man, sinker jams, great pro, INSIDE of the city limits. No waiting. No line. No climbers there. You can go bang out laps on Birds and White Rabbit, 3 awesome 5.10's, right there after work. Where are these crowds I keep hearing of?

 

Ain't here.

[billcoe]

I use to have more hair.

[billcoe]

I have noticed that crash pads have proliferated up on top though. The safety of landing on a pad has increased the amount of boulders too. But for myself, I'm happy to have the kids as company, they're usually great fun and offer lots of encouragement as you are getting discouraged getting your ass handed to you not being able to climb something you could lap in your bare feet up and down repetitively as a kid.

 

I love the company and am glad they are there.

[JosephH]

I can't believe you even bother with a rope on Blackberry. You should be forced to down-solo it blindfolded so that it would at least be a challenge.

 

I happen to like the lines out at the Butte and don't mind winching the occasional dishwasher or engine block out of the place, but I don't think the environs do it for most folks. And for some reason I don't mind other folks at the Butte, probably so that someone can tell the wife in case I do the slip-and-slide off the top.

[Pete_H]

I have noticed that crash pads have proliferated up on top though. The safety of landing on a pad has increased the amount of boulders too. But for myself, I'm happy to have the kids as company, they're usually great fun and offer lots of encouragement as you are getting discouraged getting your ass handed to you not being able to climb something you could lap in your bare feet up and down repetitively as a kid.

 

I love the company and am glad they are there.

 

 

Plus they probably have good pot.

[billcoe]

Man I wish I had a video of your Dishwasher Rube Goldberg, pully, climbing rope, car arrangement you set up to pull that dishwasher up the cliff and out. Or even just been there to stand and watch all slack jawed in awe and wonderment. Bet that's something one doesn't see but once in their life if that!!

[JosephH]

Thank god that maintenance guy from the school saw the commotion and offered to haul the stuff away - I was beginning to wonder how I was going to do it with the Camry or where I'd take it.

[LostCamKenny]

thats cool, because we they appreciate you not being at the zone.

when did you go climbing last, kev?

[hafilax]

What is the hardest face climb bolted on lead? I'm not talking scary but technically hardest.

[LostCamKenny]

What is the hardest face climb bolted on lead? I'm not talking scary but technically hardest.

I can't say that i know, locally, but the bachar/yerian was done as JB stood on hooks, runout 50 feet at times, and i think he hand drilled only five or six bolts - i think that's what i remember him saying... Don't now what that route's difficulty is but i know it's up there.

[hafilax]

11c sandbag is what I've read for the BY on the many threads at ST. If you pick the right path the BY is supposed to be a matter of endurance. The difficulty is in picking the line of knobs that won't break and dealing with the terrifying runouts of course.

 

There's got to be some harder than that. Any 13s in Smith put up on hooks?