Noobs at 38

[RuMR]

fuck...you fishin'????? Damn, this hook hurts my lip...

[KaskadskyjKozak]

fuck...you fishin'????? Damn, this hook hurts my lip...

 

I think that's the chancre sore you got from Trash.

 

[mattp]

Hey Mattp: told you!

Yup. But he means it in a good way.

[RuMR]

ba$tard...

[mattp]

Now he doesn't.

[mattp]

ba$tard...

 

Can we return to talking about newbies and climbing at popular beginner crags now?

[Rad]

Matt,

 

I have climbed with you and hope to again. I think we are on the same page here.

 

I suspect that the examples of bad habits you and I provided are just proxies for us to determine whether our partner has two key things: sound judgment (not just from a book), and habits that prevent what I call the 'fatal moment of inattention'. Most accidents boil down to a failure of one or both of these things.

 

When I tie in with a partner I am literally trusting that person with my life. Ask yourself if there is any other aspect of your life where you do that. I think that's pretty cool, and it's something that intensifies the bonds between climbers.

[RuMR]

ba$tard...

 

Can we return to talking about newbies and climbing at popular beginner crags now?

Darwin already covered that, i believe... Edited May 20, 2008 by RuMR

[mattp]

Rad,

I'd tie in with you any time, too. I wasn't really debating your premise so much as adding my "it's all situation" twist. Some climbers who employ best practices all the time but lack judgment can be REALLY scary.

[chucK]

When I tie in with a partner I am literally trusting that person with my life. Ask yourself if there is any other aspect of your life where you do that.

 

Any time you ride as a passenger in a car on the freeway, in an airplane, or in a boat a mile from shore.

 

 

 

[KaskadskyjKozak]

When I tie in with a partner I am literally trusting that person with my life. Ask yourself if there is any other aspect of your life where you do that.

 

Any time you ride as a passenger in a car on the freeway, in an airplane, or in a boat a mile from shore.

 

 

 

good point!

[mattp]

When I tie in with a partner I am literally trusting that person with my life. Ask yourself if there is any other aspect of your life where you do that. I think that's pretty cool, and it's something that intensifies the bonds between climbers.

 

I agree that the bond we share as climbers can be unique and indeed special (if you know what I mean by special), but in another way you trust your life to other people all the time: like when you drive on a public road, for example. Is it just the adrenaline ingredient that makes us focus on this trust aspect so much? I'm not sure.

[Bug]

One story about a partner of mine that could have killed us both.

We were on an adventure climb in Blodgett and I had run a full rope up a pitch and was down to 3 peices. None of them fit well but one was at least manky. My last good piece was to the side about 4 feet, just out of my reach. Ricky came up to that piece and I told him to stop there and hand me a few more peices as my anchor was mank. He chose to ignore this request, pulled the only bomber piece left, and traversed over to me unscathed. It took me about 1/100th of a second to locate the right piece on his harness and plug it into a crack. It was when he looked at my manky anchor that he understood. We climbed together for many years after. Our communications were better.

But you cannot always plan for everything.

So part of that "special bond" is knowing each other's tone and habits.

[mattp]

Yes, it is probably the getting to know each other part that comes with talking about and physically demonstrating how you are trusting your lives with each other that makes us feel it is not normal. In most other aspects of life, like the driving/boating/flying examples ChucK cited, we are just as much reliant upon somebody else for safety but we don't talk a lot about it and there isn't the same complex interaction.

[spotly]

I once saw a leader place his last piece about 20 feet below a ledge then finish off that easy 20 feet (5.3ish) and traverse 50 feet left without placing another piece. The 2nd reached the last piece, which he pulled. But, because the leader had traversed without placing a piece, the rope no longer followed the easy line up - instead, the 2nd was forced to climb some hideous crack that was obviously at his limit. To make matters worse, if he'd have fallen (which he nearly did), the rope, which was barely caught on a bump on the ledge above, would have popped loose resulting in a 45 foot fall, either decking or swinging into a corner system. Scarey stuff for him and a visually supported lesson for me....protect the frickin traverse! Since the ledge was an easy walk, I think a belay from directly above the 2nd would have been the best choice in that case though.

[miladugga]

OK, so here's how it goes for me when I try to be "helpful." I'm at X38, we did rock, with a guy I met at the rock gym, first time outside together but he seems to know what he's doing. A couple of young guys show up and start doing a 5.9 next to us, perfectly competent, but I notice one of them rappels off just one bolt. I think about this thread for awhile then strike up a conversation, turns out it's his second time out. I politely suggest he use two anchors when he lowers off, and he says yeah, his partner told him that too, so I back right off. Lo and behold, 5 minutes later my new partner is setting up to rap down and HE DROPS THE ROPE!!! Turns out he thought he tied a loop and clipped it before untying, but apparently didn't, and doesn't usually tie a knot after passing the rope through the anchors.(!?)I'm surprised, he can't reach the rope which has stopped at the clip 10 feet below, and I have to ask the "noobs" I had just straightened out if they would pretty please either traverse over from their climb and hand my partner the rope or belay me up to him. They were considerate enough to get our rope, and nice enough not to tell us we should be careful not to drop it again. Sheesh!

[JoshK]

With regard to running rope over webbing w/o a biner - wouldn't this be a matter of common sense, for even a non-climber? Even before I had climbed, knowing the concept of friction would have been enough to make me think twice.

 

The handful of times I've given advice it has been happily welcomed - probably because i'm a fellow noob. thankfully a noob that can tie knots...i think... :

 

As for driving on public roads, ugh...my rule is trust nobody. actually scratch that. i trust that the housemom on the cell phone in the benz suv/minivan will swerve at me at any moment so i protect the traverse away from her and in to another lane.