IceIceBaby Posted March 2, 2002 Share Posted March 2, 2002 The Wildthings Icesac I own the 1996 Icesac and I have to say it is the most durable functional and comfortable frameless pack I ever ware. however few days ago, I had the chance the examine up and close the 1999 Icesac, and I was shocked to see such a drop in quality.The 1996 model:The fabric on mine very stiff waterproof 500 weights Cordura, with 1000 weight Cordura bottom extending to the half front of the pack. The draw cord is threaded through a tunnel that reinforced with a PVC outlet, The extension sleeve is half the size of the new model. The haul loop is raised and there is one more raised loop on the bottom of it (daisy chain fashion). The inside frame/bivy pad is housed in zippered pocket. The waist belt and the shoulders pads are molded dual properties close cell foam, that never flattened even after carrying 50lb with it, over many weeks. The Wildthings logo is embossed stitched to the front of the pack. All the pack stitching are taped over, doubled and bartacked in the high stress areas. 3 compression straps and two rope retainer straps one on each side Weight 3.04lbThe 1999 model:the fabric on the newer model is very supple and flimsy none waterproof 250 pack cloth, and 500 pack cloth bottom extending to the half front of the pack. the draw cord is threaded through brass grommets. the extension sleeve is twice the size if mine. the haul loop on the front is flat, smaller and no added little loop. the inside frame/bivy pad housing pocket is hooded no zipper. the waist belt and shoulders pads are regular closed cell pad that compressed over one trip. on the pack the logo is taped and sawn on all stitches are not doubled and reinforced. 2 compression straps no rope retainer. Very flimsily made very different quality looking pack. Weight 2.14lb the 1999 pack condition:six holes on top of the pack from ware and rubbing of tools the pack is looking almost brand new had been used only once.the 1996 pack condition:extensive use over six years in rock, ice and alpine climbing. numerous hauling of the pack with rock gear, Ice tools, ice axes, ice screws, pitons, skis attached to it or in it, unlivable abuse and the pack looks almost bran new, with no holes and not even a sign of ware anywhere on the pack.conclusion:Wildthings use to make phenomenal packs that won the hard core climbers community and gave the reputation of incredible packs.Today reality is:The packs are mediocre at best with very poor quality and very inflated price ($200 for a new one I paid in 1996 $140 for a much different and better Icesac) taking the average gullible climber for a ride, on their past achievement. maybe if Marie O Meunier Bouchard (Titoune) president of Wildthings (Jon Bouchard wife) will go back to the roots (her father was one of the alps legends (cant say like father like son)) we can see improvement and not a greedy and conniving business woman that once use to mind the climbers needs and pocket. Remember how and who got you there in the first place [ 03-02-2002: Message edited by: IceIceBaby ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pope Posted March 2, 2002 Share Posted March 2, 2002 Sorry to hear. I purchased one in about '86 or '87. It too was built like a brick shithouse, but it had a cotton-blend fabric on the back panel so that you could wear it very comfortably without a shirt. The back panel eventually rotted out, but it lasted more than ten years, back when I was climbing more than I worked. I got a '96 model the year I got married, and based on its durability (not to mention new limits on my free time), I'm predicting it will last a couple of decades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted March 8, 2002 Author Share Posted March 8, 2002 My essay conclusion yield this great promise quote: Hi Neri You are absolutely right!The new fabric VX21 is not durable enough for the bottom of Icesacs or Rocsacs as a single layer.It does not take the abuse it should.We have reordered the laminated ballistic and will try some VX 51 reinforced with spectra to make these two packs. They should be ready by the middle of April.We have also redone the hip belt and it now works the way it should and is removable as well.We tried to do the right thing and make the packs even lighter but we failed. And I feel very bad about it. We did not try to save money; all we wanted is to shed a few ounces.I am not a greedy conniving businesswoman. I listened to bad advice; I wish John were still here to help With that sort of design problems. We should not have tried to fix something that was not broken.Hope we can make fix our mistakes and make it up to you somehow.Thank you for your understanding. All the best Titoune Pres. Wild Things My Apologies for a harsh language.way to go And safe to say thank you from all the climbing community [ 03-08-2002: Message edited by: IceIceBaby ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted November 1, 2002 Author Share Posted November 1, 2002 The problem is they sold the company and now everything they do turn to shit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ade Posted November 6, 2002 Share Posted November 6, 2002 Any full featured alpine pack weighing much less than 3lb is going to run into durability issues. Sounds like WildThings took "light is right" a wee bit too far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt_clipper Posted November 14, 2002 Share Posted November 14, 2002 What does "fully featured" mean? In my experience, most gizmos are useless. Compression flaps, frames in daypacks, hipbelts for lids, tool tubes, excessive padding, hypalon crampon patches, etc come to mind. Hell, just the the Golite Gust. Many experienced alpinists say it is as durable as most others, but it weighs 19oz! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ade Posted November 15, 2002 Share Posted November 15, 2002 I don't mean all the useless additional shit, "full featured" was probably a bad choice of words. Â The bottom end of the weight spectrum for alpine packs seems to be about 3lb if you look at packs with no gizmos; sack, lid pocket, minimal hip belt and back padding. You can cut it still further by ditching the lid etc. My Pod weighs 2lb 14oz (with lid), it's made of cordura and built to last but without any gizmos so it's light. Â I've not used a Gust but check out this Alpine sacks review. Seems to me it's certainly an option but you have to be a bit careful with it and know it's limitations and what you're using it for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt_clipper Posted November 15, 2002 Share Posted November 15, 2002 Limitations? I own a Arc'teryx Khamsin 62. At new it weighed 4lb. Ways to cut weight: cut off some of the daisy-chain webbing on the lid. Cut off the lid hipbelt, and the foam padding in the lid. Moving down: cut off the crampon patch, who needs it? Why not strap crampons on with the points facing out? (I'haven't done this yet). Cut off the excess webbing on the hipbelt and shoulder straps. The hipbelt is almost too large for me, so I have two feet of unused webbing hanging around. In the end, it it probably less durable than the Golite, as the K62's fabric is lighter. I sewed myself a daypack out of 8oz fabric (tuff stuff). It holds about 2500 cubic inches, and weighs about a pound. So most commercial packs, especially daypacks, are overbuilt, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted November 18, 2002 Share Posted November 18, 2002 Don't cut the hip belt webbing too short. I find that in winter you need the extra length, both to get a good grip on the straps while wearing mittens and to allow for your own extra bundled up girth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt_clipper Posted November 20, 2002 Share Posted November 20, 2002 Yeah, but isn't a foot of webbing slightly excessive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryland_moore Posted November 20, 2002 Share Posted November 20, 2002 IIB, you are the 3rd guy with the same avatar. Neither of us is black, but the fact that you don't even climb and live in cement world makes your case even worse. Go boulder in the park and get some clean air once in a while. I think all of those homeless farts, trash, and smog is getting in you goggles. Actually, maybe all of that pollution has permanently stained your skin! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted November 20, 2002 Author Share Posted November 20, 2002 You soo territorial…or is it a jungle fever that I can feel all the way to NYC… U should find some other Avatar since you don’t have any connection once or ever through your handle name I propose that YOU drop this avatar and leave it to username that fit the description better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegetablebelay Posted November 20, 2002 Share Posted November 20, 2002 Let's get it on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wdietsch Posted November 20, 2002 Share Posted November 20, 2002 quote: Originally posted by Dru: Have I got a pack for you. 70 liters and only weighs one pound, $125. So its made out of crepe paper and balsa wood, with suspension of dental floss, duct tape for closure and no padding or lid, but hey, iTS THE LIGHTEST ONE ON THE MARKET!!! So LIGHT YOU CAN CARRY SIX OF EM AT ONCE!!!! Â New for next year, toothbrushes with the lightening holes in the shaft pre-drilled, $35.00 Get a bunch as Stocking Stuffers! Â Dru ... you are one fu**'in funny Canadian ... here's to ya' Â [ 11-20-2002, 02:58 PM: Message edited by: wdietsch ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryland_moore Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 U should find some other Avatar since you don’t have any connection once or ever through your handle name I propose that YOU drop this avatar and leave it to username that fit the description better  I do have a connection.....that little fucker stole my ski goggles! If you see him, tell him I want my goggles, my bike, my money, and my jacket back! It's kinda like a WANTED poster for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_a Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 I've had an ice sack for three years, used it just about every weekend since I got it. Its made from the older beefier fabric. I've got several holes in the bottom of the pack and have torn off several compression straps, the top lid straps, and both ski slots (repeatedly)...always felt the pack was the best thing out there so I've either sent it to Wild Things or Rainy Pass to get fixed. Glad to hear that the newest model is returning to the better fabric...I figure I'm gonna have to retire mine after this ski season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt_clipper Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 Dru, I admit I won't buy the golite jackets, they are way too flimsy. However, we was talking about PACKS here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted November 21, 2002 Author Share Posted November 21, 2002 quote: Originally posted by ryland moore: I do have a connection.....that little fucker stole my ski goggles! If you see him, tell him I want my goggles, my bike, my money, and my jacket back! It's kinda like a WANTED poster for me. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I almost choked on my tea when I saw your reply…. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott_J Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 I had the "new" icesac that rylan is peaking of. I sent it back to wildthings and asked for a replacement with a beefer fabric. They told me that a new better model was on the drawing board and did indeed send me the new and improved as of August of this year. I offered to pay the difference for the new model plus shipping. they were absolutely outstanding and sent me the pack at no cost to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryland_moore Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 IceIceBaby get a new avatar, this one's taken. Even Sisu thought you were me! If you have a name like that then maybe you should get an avatar to match? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 whichever one of you is really black should get that avatar otherwise its like Michael Jackson in reverse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceIceBaby Posted November 21, 2002 Author Share Posted November 21, 2002 Ma avatar was the baby face I was looking for …sorry but vanilla ice not my theng (if u know me you’ll understand…. ma avatar will stay !!!!! Goddem this is bad trip from the 80’s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 And onm the subject of GoLite if you are gonna buy GoLite stuff just give the money to me instead. I will buy beer with it and then at least one of us will get some real benefit from spending the money. that stuff is trash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iain Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 I think their disposable backpacking concept is really catching on though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt_clipper Posted November 21, 2002 Share Posted November 21, 2002 Have you tried their stuff? Their packs seem durable enough, the fabric they use in the Gust is at least as durable as the stuff used in the Arc'teryx K62. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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