Condition of Ice face on North Ridge of Forbidden?

[Juan]

Hey gnibmilc:

 

Were you with the three guys on a Mountaineers trip? Bob Davis and I climbed it in early or mid-Aug. 1998, I think. We ran into four Mountaineers and ended up joining ropes on the rappels over the ridge, and after freeing the stuck ropes for the group, they (you?) were kind enough to let us use some of your snow and ice pro on the face. We had relied on Jim Nelson's statement in Vol. I that the snow face was only 40 degrees, and stupidly brought no pickets or screws. Fred says 50 degrees and bring screws, but we went with Jim on that one.

 

I later encouraged Jim to change his description to reflect the fact that I think it is steeper, but can't remember if he did so in Vol. I, 2nd ed. Maybe Bob and I were just being chickens. What do others think?

 

Anyway, if that was your group, thanks again. That was a fun trip. I got some good pictures.

 

As for the debate on global warming, I can't say any of this any better than Lowell. Like him, I worry about the kids. I have three little boys, and in so many ways, worry about the world they will inherit and pass to their kids and grandkids and so on. I'm not a scientist (though I could play one on t.v.), but have read some convincing (to me) materials suggesting that global warming is happening, and happening fast, and we are indeed contributing. Time will tell.

 

Cheers all,

 

Sharp

[Skeezix]

You're not chicken. If it's in the right shape, no belay needed. It's steep but the angle doesn't change.

[Juan]

I think we placed (or rather borrowed) two screws and two pickets. Other than those four placements down low, no pro. We didn't belay anything -- just running belays through those placements, then roped simul-climbing. The ice at the bottom was interesting with aluminum crampons. So, is it steeper than 40 degrees?

 

Sharp

[pat_o]

Yes Juan...I certainly felt it was steeper. I didn't have an inclinometer(?) in August 3 years ago, but I was suprised by the angle. I did the good 'ol "axe plumb bob" drop nearing the top and it seemed to be @ 50+ degree. I felt it was a bigger face than Nelson let onto. By the way it was one of my favorite routes of the past five years!

Pat O'

[Juan]

Hey Pat:

 

That confirms what I thought, and echoes Fred's description. It is a great route for sure, whatever the angle. Top 20 for me I think. I wish I had been using slide film on that one, but did get some good prints. Glad you OR guys are getting up to taste some of our alpine candy.

 

Cheers,

 

John

[gnibmilc]

Juan,

 

That was us, the party of four Mountaineers. Interesting connection. I was the guy who tip toed out on the ice face and got some protection in. It seemed to me to be quite a bit steeper than 40 degrees, but, very good and fun and certainly a top ten climb in the range for me. Thanks for clearing the ropes! Almost vintage pictures? Post!!!!

The face looked much icier this year and looked to have much less snow on it for the same time of the year 6 years ago...but i don't know what are normal variations in snow pack/glacier size. i would guess that the angle of the slope varies year to year depending on the season and deposition.

with regard to warming, the only thing i'm sure of is that tax subsidies for SUVs isn't the right answer!

That was a great climb, and although at the time i wasn't keen about descending the west ridge, it was a very pleasing way to round out a semi-circumnavigation.

[Juan]

Hey:

 

I remember you tip-toeing out there. We felt really stupid not having any pro, and would have climbed it w/o pro since we were there, but it was really nice to have some stuff for that first exposed icy section. Recall that we had at least one aluminum-headed axe too. Duh. I agree that it looks really different this year. The pictures I have are not digital and I don't know how to scan them. If you have a mailing address I could make some copies if you want. I don't know if you guys are really visible or not, but it would show what you climbed when you climbed it, which has some value. Let's take this off line and you can send me your address. I'm at jsharp@windermere.com.

 

Cheers,

 

John

[Buckaroo]

"A problem for who? Climbers, thats it."

 

ha ha. Rising sea levels threaten all low lying costal habitation. Changing weather patterns and water shortages threaten farming that feeds billions worldwide.

 

"I just think that because we have had a few years of some warmer weather everyone wants to jump on some global warming doomsday forecast."

 

The current warming trend has existed since the initial consumption of fossil fuels, almost 100 years.

 

"its much too soon to predict this"

 

disagree, and when do you suggest we start trying?

 

"What happens if this warming trend is normal, this may be the next path the earth goes down, probably better than another ice age."

 

What happens if it's not normal and we ignore it?

 

"Unfortunatley we dont control this..."

 

"it seems as though you are declaring yourself an expert and have decided that global warming is caused by humans"

 

Petroleum reserves were formed over geological time during the Carboniferous period from 354 to 290 million years ago.

 

Man has consumed about half of all known and predicted petroleum reserves in a period of 100 years. So a form of solar energy that was accumulated and stored over millions of years has been released in only 100 years. All the greenhouse gases and some of the heat energy accumulated over millions of years has been released in a relative nano second.

 

"...and this is the problem people have, along with change people just cant accept it."

 

Damn straight, people just can't give up their wasteful consumer lifestyle and their gas wasting SUV.

 

" You might as well get over it,the earth will change, climate will change,and hopefully humans will be able to adapt quickly enough."

 

Can you say "dieoff"?

 

"If you want something to worry about why not worry about our water supply"

 

Directly releated to global warming.

[gotterdamerung]

AHEM...So does anyone have any info on the conditions of this face?

[Juan]

Buckaroo:

 

So well said. I wish I had your base of scientific knowledge.

 

Sharp

[Rad]

All these photos of Forbidden...and my eye is drawn to the striking NW rib.

 

It looks like a long rock route on a peak known for high quality rock.

 

Has anyone climbed this? Rock quality comments? Difficulty? It is sure in a spectacular and isolated (except at the summit) setting.

 

Any info appreciated...

 

Thanks,

[slothrop]

There's the NW Face route (1959) described in Beckey, which follows the central rib of the NW face. Then I think some Skoogs climbed two routes on the ribs running up the north side of the west ridge. There was some info posted here on those climbs a while back...

[Ziff]

I climbed the NW face route in 1996. It is not 20 pitches as Beckey says - we did it in 10 pitches. The top pitch has some large loose blocks but the climbing is easy. A very nice route in a remote setting. can be done in a day from the boston basin side if moving fast and simul-climbing - only 2 pitches above 5.6. We found the crux to be getting over Sharfin Col! Here you will find some loose rock!

[Rad]

Thanks.

Approach over Sharkfin col? Do you then go over or around the N ridge of Forbidden?

What about up the W ridge of Forbidden couloir and then rap/downclimb to the start of the route?

[Ben]

Sharkfin col isn't that bad if you know the trick. It took us about 5 hours from a bivy in Boston Basin to reach the route (probably futzed around for an hour crevasse wandering to gain access to the rock). I imagine you might be able to shave a little time off the approach if you went over the West ridge, but the walk around the N ridge is actually quite pleasant. Personally, I liked the route better than the E, W, and N ridges. Here are a few pics from our climb (a few years back): pics

[Rad]

Amazing photos, Ben. Very helpful.

I'll definitely put this route high on the list. The lower part looks a little like N Ridge of Stuart but with easier climbing.

Thanks