Democrats in a nutshell

[scrambler]

 

A young woman was about to finish her first year of college. Like so many others her age, she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat and was a passionate advocate for the even distribution of all wealth. She felt deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican.

 

One day she was challenging her father on his beliefs, and his opposition to higher taxes for the rich & more welfare programs. In the middle of her heart-felt diatribe, echoing ideas from liberal professors at her school, he interrupted to ask her how she was doing in school.

 

She answered rather proudly that she had a 4.0 GPA, and that it was tough to maintain. She had to study all the time, never had time to go out and party like other people she knew. She didn't even have time for a boyfriend, and didn't really have many friends because she spent all her time studying.

 

Her father listened and then asked, "And how is your friend Mary?"

 

She replied, "Mary is another story" she continued, "she's barely making a 2.0 GPA - all she takes are easy classes, and she never studies. I'm afraid she's going to flunk out!" But to explain further she continued emotionally, "She's very popular on campus, and she's having a blast. She goes to all the parties, and

very often doesn't even show up for classes because she's too hung over. We're still friends, but we're SO different!"

 

Her father then said , "I know how you could help her..... Why don't you go to the Dean's office, and ask him to deduct one point off your 4.0 GPA, and give it to your friend who only has a 2.0." He continued, "That way, you will both have a 3.0 GPA, and certainly that would be a fair distribution of grades."

 

The daughter, visibly shocked by her father's suggestion angrily fired back:

 

"Are you crazy? I worked my butt off and sacrificed a lot for my good grades! Mary has done little or nothing - she played and partied all year. Why should SHE get the same grade as I do? That wouldn't be FAIR! "

 

The father slowly smiled and said, "Welcome to the Republican Party."

 

It’s a bit simplistic isn’t it? Similar to condensing Republican thought to one word: greed.

 

If things were as simple as this parable then we’d all be in one party. Besides, you could modify the story to reflect current happenings under the Bush administration where special interests, e.g., Halliburton, are skimming resources from both students (us), say, a college bookstore that charges a high markup for required school supplies. Or maybe, add a bit about a Physics department that is allotted an inordinate amount of money over other departments for pursuing pie-in-the-sky projects.

 

In principle, yes, I’d have to agree that the story depicts a picture of fundamental unfairness, but again, things are not as simple as that. You’d have to be a political simpleton to decide your allegiance based on this story.

 

Somewhere I read that political thought is a late development in most people’s experience. It requires an experiential understanding of the world coupled with higher thought to formulate a worldview, of how it is and how it should be. Anyone using less than that to cast a vote along a party line is being a mindless automaton subjected to the whims of the current political winds that are blowing.

Edited February 24, 2004 by scrambler

[tele_nut]

It’s a bit simplistic isn’t it?

 

>>>Sometimes simple is very precise. There is not always a need to over intellectualize basic truths.

 

If things were as simple as this parable then we’d all be in one party.

 

>>>>I highly doubt it. Even the Nazi's couldn't agree.

 

In principle, yes, I’d have to agree that the story depicts a picture of fundamental unfairness, but again, things are not as simple as that. You’d have to be a political simpleton to decide your allegiance based on this story. Somewhere I read that political thought is a late development in most people’s experience.

 

>>>History tells us otherwise. Political ruminations seem to be old as time itself. Tribe, clan, empire. Same thing,. Different sizes.

 

It requires an experiential understanding of the world coupled with higher thought to formulate a worldview, of how it is and how it should be. Anyone using less than that to cast a vote along a party line is being a mindless automaton subjected to the whims of the current political winds that are blowing.

 

>>>>So get out there and check things out. The world is waiting. And not just climbing destinations either.

 

[catbirdseat]

The thing to do to provide for the poor is to pay for education and training. Everyone benefits from that.

 

That's pretty idealistic. There are only so many positions that can be filled with trained professionals. Don't we need ditch diggers too? If a ditch digger wants to become a programmer would you feel good about your taxes being used to send them to school while you get buried beneath student loans or your family depletes their personal riches to support you? Personally I would rather pay for my own way and have my parents sitting on a beach somewhere than letting Uncle Sam carve another 2% of my paycheck to pay for someone else's tuition.

There are all sorts of jobs going unfilled because there aren't enough trained people. And you'll pay for poverty one way of the other in the form of illness, crime and the salaries of police officers.

[chucK]

Economics in a nutshell

 

ALL rich people are rich because they work their f*cking butts off for it.

 

ALL poor people are poor because they are lazy and shiftless.

[Alpinfox]

A young woman was about to finish her first year of college. Like so many others her age, she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat and was a passionate advocate for the even distribution of all wealth. She felt deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican.

 

One day she was challenging her father on his beliefs, and his opposition to higher taxes for the rich & more welfare programs. In the middle of her heart-felt diatribe, echoing ideas from liberal professors at her school, he interrupted to ask her how she was doing in school.

 

She answered rather proudly that she had a 4.0 GPA, and that it was tough to maintain. She had to study all the time, never had time to go out and party like other people she knew. She didn't even have time for a boyfriend, and didn't really have many friends because she spent all her time studying.

 

Her father listened and then asked, "And how is your friend Mary?"

 

She replied, "Mary is another story" she continued, "she's barely making a 2.0 GPA - all she takes are easy classes, and she never studies. I'm afraid she's going to flunk out!" But to explain further she continued emotionally, "She's very popular on campus, and she's having a blast. She goes to all the parties, and

very often doesn't even show up for classes because she's too hung over. We're still friends, but we're SO different!"

 

Her father then said , "I know how you could help her..... Why don't you go to the Dean's office, and ask him to deduct one point off your 4.0 GPA, and give it to your friend who only has a 2.0." He continued, "That way, you will both have a 3.0 GPA, and certainly that would be a fair distribution of grades."

 

The daughter, visibly shocked by her father's suggestion angrily fired back:

 

"Are you crazy? I worked my butt off and sacrificed a lot for my good grades! Mary has done little or nothing - she played and partied all year. Why should SHE get the same grade as I do? That wouldn't be FAIR! "

 

The father slowly smiled and said, "Welcome to the Republican Party."

 

 

This is a great parable except that our society doesn't function like a school. In school, everyone has an equal opportunity to get a certain grade. Every one has to work equally hard and be equally smart to get a 3.0 for example. Of course, some folks have to work while going to school, which makes it more difficult, but overall, school is a more equitable environment than the business world where a senior VP can work a six hour day, most of that time spent surfing the net, chatting with other VPs, or even having a "business meeting" on the golf course. For this he gets $600,000/year + bonuses. Meanwhile, the single mother who cleans the VP's office gets $20,000/year for a 40 hour week. No bonuses of course.

 

This is the inherent inequity and unfairness in the capitalistic system that the democratic idea of wealth redistribution through asymmetrical taxation seeks to remedy. In short, because capitalism is unfair, we have to impose "unfair" taxation to balance things out a bit.

Edited February 24, 2004 by Alpinfox

[Alpinfox]

Economics in a nutshell

 

ALL rich people are rich because they work their f*cking butts off for it.

 

ALL poor people are poor because they are lazy and shiftless.

 

This is bullshit.

[rbw1966]

What happened to the sarcasm meter?

[Alpinfox]

What happened to the sarcasm meter?

 

Oh, I guess mine is broken. I'll have to find a skilled laborer and pay them an appropriate wage and have mine serviced.

[Rainierwon]

Privilege in a nutshell:

GWB probably never worked for what he got...

[catbirdseat]

You have to allow for the person making the statement. From ChucK it's sarcasm. From GregW it's a statement of fact.

[chucK]

I think it is a pretty good parable in one respect. The vast majority of folks are more than willing to have other people sacrifice.

 

I must admit that if I were making 2 million $/year, or if I was slated to inherit a 2 million $ estate, I would probably grouse at the fact that the Kerry platform was going to exclude me from getting my 400$ refund back ( , well maybe not), or be pretty happy that the death tax was being repealled. Anyway, what I am saying is, is that I can't be too terribly righteous about people trying to defend their wealth.

 

HOWEVER, what really blows me away is how many middle class and poor people are all for the Repub way of redistributing the wealth away from themselves?! It's like going in to work at the factory and telling the bosses to disable that expensive safety equipment cause it's making it take too long for the hot water to come out of the tap in the executive washroom. "It's only fair, cleanliness is important for those suit guys."

 

 

Look folks. The money has got to come from somewhere. I don't see the Bush admin making a bunch of cuts. I see them running up a huge deficit. If the rich people are absolved from paying, you are going to get to pay. Your children are going to get to pay.

 

Protect your wealth. Don't sacfrifice it for the upper class.

Edited February 24, 2004 by chucK

[tele_nut]

Are you all like the "liberal web surfers gang' or something?

 

Rich people is one thing. Hard working people who happen to get successful is something else. Something tells me that most of you (us) are middle class.

[Blake]

So if that is the nut shell, then tele is the nut.

[Dustin_B]

A young woman was about to finish her first year of college. Like so many others her age, she considered herself to be a very liberal Democrat and was a passionate advocate for the even distribution of all wealth. She felt deeply ashamed that her father was a rather staunch Republican.

 

One day she was challenging her father on his beliefs, and his opposition to higher taxes for the rich & more welfare programs. In the middle of her heart-felt diatribe, echoing ideas from liberal professors at her school, he interrupted to ask her how she was doing in school.

 

She answered rather proudly that she had a 4.0 GPA, and that it was tough to maintain. She had to study all the time, never had time to go out and party like other people she knew. She didn't even have time for a boyfriend, and didn't really have many friends because she spent all her time studying.

 

Her father listened and then asked, "And how is your friend Mary?"

 

She replied, "Mary is another story" she continued, "she's barely making a 2.0 GPA - all she takes are easy classes, and she never studies. I'm afraid she's going to flunk out!" But to explain further she continued emotionally, "She's very popular on campus, and she's having a blast. She goes to all the parties, and

very often doesn't even show up for classes because she's too hung over. We're still friends, but we're SO different!"

 

Her father then said , "I know how you could help her..... Why don't you go to the Dean's office, and ask him to deduct one point off your 4.0 GPA, and give it to your friend who only has a 2.0." He continued, "That way, you will both have a 3.0 GPA, and certainly that would be a fair distribution of grades."

 

The daughter, visibly shocked by her father's suggestion angrily fired back:

 

"Are you crazy? I worked my butt off and sacrificed a lot for my good grades! Mary has done little or nothing - she played and partied all year. Why should SHE get the same grade as I do? That wouldn't be FAIR! "

 

The father slowly smiled and said, "Welcome to the Republican Party."

 

This is the best post I've read on cc.com in a long time. Thank you for that.

 

And mark my words:

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[Dustin_B]

At the expense of those less capable perhaps?

 

I work hard for my money, and the price for me coming incorrect in my profession is my life or my someone else's. Why should I have to subsidize the poor?

 

Exactly.

I worked my ass off in school so I could get a good job that lets me spray at work. Others who worked less hard in school now have to actually work and get paid less. Explain to me again how its fair that they get some of my money?

 

Go get a job you lazy hippie jobless dems. (directed at no one in particular)

[Ducknut]

Dustin

 

Why don't you get Cheney some greasy food, lets clog a few more blood vessels That man has a full body stent. Heart attack or stroke would be fine by me.

[willstrickland]

Cheney won't even be alive in '08, you better start grooming a young Republican governor.

[iain]

Go get a job you lazy hippie jobless dems. (directed at no one in particular)

Go tell that to the faces of the minimum wagers out there trying to raise a family and get back to us. Tell them they are a bunch of slackers who should work hard like your privileged ass who posts on chat boards all day.

[Rodchester]

And now if we could convince the Republicans to not only stay out of society's wallet, but also out of society's bedroom and keep their fucking morals to themselves, they might have a bunch more party members.

 

Why? The democrats regulate morality all the time. Look at the supreme court. Think of political correctness. Nothing more than telling someone they are wrong for the beliefs they may choose to vocalize. I for one am sick of that shit.

 

Are you upset because swinging swinging away from a degenerate society is less appealing to you?

 

 

I didn't comment on the Democrats....don't assume that becuase I raised an issue with the Rs that I am a D. And don't assume that I am an R either.

 

I agree that the Ds have plenty of problems...and totally agree on the PC thing. It is the same because it is a group mentality and I am an individual believing strongly in indivdual rights.

 

But the whole religious right thing scares away too many people like me that are more libertarian in our beliefs (not necessarily in the L party though).

 

As far as being a degenerate goes, that's for me to decide. If I want to swing away I can. You watch your own, and I'll watch mine. Don't tell me how to live. You sound almost PC there TeleNut.

[chucK]

Exactly.

I worked my ass off in school so I could get a good job that lets me spray at work. Others who worked less hard in school now have to actually work and get paid less. Explain to me again how its fair that they get some of my money?

 

Dustin,

You got that right, but it's not the poor who the Republicans are giving your hard-earned money to.

[Greg_W]

The thing to do to provide for the poor is to pay for education and training. Everyone benefits from that.

 

That's pretty idealistic. There are only so many positions that can be filled with trained professionals. Don't we need ditch diggers too? If a ditch digger wants to become a programmer would you feel good about your taxes being used to send them to school while you get buried beneath student loans or your family depletes their personal riches to support you? Personally I would rather pay for my own way and have my parents sitting on a beach somewhere than letting Uncle Sam carve another 2% of my paycheck to pay for someone else's tuition.

if "ditch digging" paid a wage that you didn't have to work 4 jobs to live the migrant workers would out of work

 

This is bullshit. Those union "ditchdiggers" are making pretty good coin.

[marylou]

Are you all like the "liberal web surfers gang' or something?

 

 

Uhh, the majority of us are in Seattle or PDX....that should tell you a little about how liberal we are as a general group.

 

Greg is one of our special kids. We try to be nice to him even though he thinks poor people are lazy.

[Greg_W]

Are you all like the "liberal web surfers gang' or something?

 

 

Uhh, the majority of us are in Seattle or PDX....that should tell you a little about how liberal we are as a general group.

 

Greg is one of our special kids. We try to be nice to him even though he thinks poor people are lazy.

 

I don't think all poor people are lazy. I think that many people who are poor, are that way due to choices that THEY have made about the direction of their lives. I don't see that I need to be punished because of my success and hard work just because someone decided to get drunk and knocked up at 16 and has no marketable skills because of it.

[minx]

Are you all like the "liberal web surfers gang' or something?

 

 

Uhh, the majority of us are in Seattle or PDX....that should tell you a little about how liberal we are as a general group.

 

Greg is one of our special kids. We try to be nice to him even though he thinks poor people are lazy.

 

I don't think all poor people are lazy. I think that many people who are poor, are that way due to choices that THEY have made about the direction of their lives. I don't see that I need to be punished because of my success and hard work just because someone decided to get drunk and knocked up at 16 and has no marketable skills because of it.

 

hey greg, you're right. but what should those folks do from this point forward? wave a magic wand and get marketable skills and maybe a nanny when they find that magic lamp?

[willstrickland]

I don't see that I need to be punished because of my success and hard work just because someone decided to get drunk and knocked up at 16 and has no marketable skills because of it.

 

Yet the right wingers are against legal abortion, public supplied birth control to teens, etc...hmmm