More North Cascades trivia

[Dru]

slothrop said:

Dru said:

Who or what is Mox anyway?

 

Twin Spires, next to Redoubt and Spickard.

 

well duh, but if even Beckey doesnt know where the name Mox comes from (WHICH IS WHAT I WAS ASKING!) it must be a full blown CASCADES MYSTERY

 

 

who invented the term "snafflehound" there is some trivia for ya!

[Crackbolter]

[Cpt.Caveman]

who invented the term "snafflehound" there is some trivia for ya!

 

Raffi Bedayn. Grand master of snaffles- god rest his soul.

 

I heard from some weird source his daughter did a climb of Pigeon Spire last summer. Twas a 1st climb of Raffi's

[HarryMajors]

"Mox Peaks" were named in 1942 by Rudo L. Fromme, then assistant supervisor of the Mt. Baker National Forest. The name was submitted to the U. S. Board on Geographic Names, and confirmed shortly thereafter (USBGN, Decisions Rendered between July 1, 1941 - June 30, 1943). The name was reconfirmed by the Board in 1970 (Decision List 7003). "Mox" (variants: moxt, mokst) is a Chinook Jargon term, meaning "two, pair, second, double, twin."

 

The name ultimately originated with Fred (and Helmut). Fromme read his "Twin Spires" article in the Dec. 1941 Mountaineer annual (pp. 31-32, along with Helmut's adjacent article on Cloudcap Peak -- a rare example of Helmy's writing), and Fromme subsequently introduced both names on Forest Service maps, but in Chinook Jargon form. The term "Seahpo" signifies "cap." Fred has been griping about these two names for years, oblivious to the fact that their ultimate derivation lies with him.

 

(CAG-3, p. 128 is incorrect when it states that "Mountaineers in the 1930s and 1940s applied the name Twin Spires." Fred and Hemly named them in July 1940, as Fred himself has written, "Unnamed on the maps, we dubbed them 'Twin Spires,' and placed them on our list of future first ascents": Dec. 1944 Appalachia, p. 209. Fred has not always been attentive to detail, for even his 1941 Mountaineer article on Twin Spires opens with an incorrect assertion.)

 

The infamous Southeast Twin Spire (8504') is one of the few peaks that Fred has been genuinely terrified of (Challenge, p. 95). The peak nearly killed him on June 22, 1941, during the descent, when a piano-size boulder of unstable Skagit Gneiss he was standing on began sliding down a steep gully. He has had a few other close encounters with mortality, but this particular incident, occurring so early in the formative stage of his climbing career, left an indelible impression upon him. At the time, he characterized it as "perhaps the most difficult ascent yet made in the state" (Dec. 1944 Appalachia, p. 209). Sixty years later (CAG-3, p. 128), Fred still felt that "the summit of the Southeast Spire is one of the most difficult to attain in the Cascade Range." The original register was left in a Crescent cinnamon can which, along with one of Lage Wernstedt's Prince Albert tobacco cans, must constitute one of the most historic register containers in the North Cascades.

 

The higher Southeast Spire is only infrequently climbed today; and would be even less so, were it not for the fact that is one of the state's "100 highest mountains," and thus on the tick-list of peak-baggers. Even then, peak-baggers approach the Southeast Spire with great reluctance, and usually leave it as one of the last peaks on their "list."

 

The rock on the Southeast Spire is notoriously unstable and treacherous. It consists of the "banded gneiss" phase of the Skagit Gneiss Complex. This metamorphic rock (unlike plutonic granitic rocks) is not uniform in character, for it is comprised of alternating layers of schist (probably derived from the older Cascade River Schist) and orthogneiss (derived from earlier igneous sills). To render this rock even worse for climbing, it has been "baked" by the subsequent intrusion of the Chilliwack Batholith. The resulting lithology on the Southeast Spire is a rock that actually consists of two different rocks, poorly bonded together, dipping or inclined steeply, and rendered hard and brittle (and resistant to erosion) by intense heat. (This heating process has similarly produced great indurated rock faces elsewhere in the Cascades that are resistant to erosion, as well as being unreliable, unpleasant, and unsafe to climb on, notable examples being the upper half of the East face of Three Fingers, and the three peaks of Index.)

 

The intimidating 2500-foot high East face of Southeast Mox is one of the "Last Great Problems" of the North Cascades, and should probably remain so. For years, this new route stood high on the list in Fred's "little black book." In early September 1968 he ventured up the isolated valley of Perry Creek with three other climbers. While Brad Fowler and Dave Leen made the second ascent of the Southeast Spire on Sept. 4 (via the Mox Glacier and the upper part of the regular route), Beckey and Dr. Mike Heath made the second attempt on the East face, only to turn back at a point less than half-way up the left/south side of the face. (At the onset of this particular trip, Fred managed to stuff his unrolled sleeping bag inside of his backpack, thus finding himself regrettably unable to accomodate the rope, iron, and other heavy equipment of the trip --- no need for clinking conversation-starters in so isolated a place as the Perry Creek "trail.")

 

Reports from climbers who have encountered the banded Skagit Gneiss on the Southeast Spire, and elsewhere, are not reassuring:

 

During a visit to the regular route on the Southeast Spire in August 1969, Craig Lingle observed that "Each hold required testing --- most pulled out like drawers. Pitons could not be solidly placed, and firm projections for runners did not exist --- all ledges were piled high with loose rock. It seemed that one had only to locate and pull out the keystone, and the entire mountain would collapse into a heap of smoking rubble. What, we wondered, was holding this precipitous pile of junk together?" (Sept. 1970 Summit, pp. 11-12).

 

With respect to the rock on the East face of the Southeast Spire, Dr. Heath informed me thirty years ago that "every crack you find -- and they're pretty scarce -- means that something's ready to peel off the mountain."

 

Fred, loath as usual to disclose beta on one of his "projects," wrote laconically in October 1968 that "I tried the big East face. No good -- bad rock & limit where cracks go. Too bad."

 

Here on cascadeclimbers.com, Drew Brayshaw has remarked that the rock of the Southeast Spire "is the famous Skagit Gneiss. Don't like a handhold? Just dig until you find a nice one. Throw your discards down to your belayer. It will give him something to do, as he won't be able to catch you if you fall" (Route Reports - North Cascades - Twin Spires/Mox Peaks, post #116071 on Dec. 17, 2002).

 

Judging from a view of the Southeast Spire from the North (CAG-3, p. 129), the as yet unclimbed east peak (8501') constitutes a huge separate block of Skagit Gneiss, in contact with, but yet detached from, both the main west summit (8504') and from the east face by two shear zones. There are a number of higher unclimbed peaks/points remaining in the North Cascades, but none as difficult, dangerous, inaccessible, and potentially deadly as point 8501. Most climbers on the Southeast Twin find the route normale harrowing enough, without having to add to one's difficulties by tackling the unclimbed east peak.

 

The best available published photograph of the 2500-foot East face (featuring the prominent banding) appears in the May 1960 issue of Summit, on page 21, with the route of the 1958 attempt marked with a dashed line --- a reference which CAG-3, p. 128 neglects to list (CAG is not infrequently negligent when it comes to expressly providing climbers with ideas and information pertaining to remaining unclimbed routes and potential first ascents in the North Cascades.) Both the lower one-third and the upper one-third of the face slope are less steeply inclined. (A smaller photo of the east face, with clarafications as to the location of the peak, appears in June 1960 Summit, pp. 22-23).

 

It is in the central one-third of the potential route (about 800 feet in height) where the real climbing problems lie, and this is where previous attempts on the face have been thwarted. The irony of the August 1958 attempt is that four climbers from Portland, Oregon, with minimal experience in the North Cascades, and who did not know just exactly where they were, or even which peak they were climbing ("clouds made it difficult to get a clear view of the summit route" p. 20), managed to reach a point on the right/north side of the East face some 200 to 300 feet higher than did Fred in 1968.

 

The 1958 Portland party observed that: "The lower half of the [East] face is steep, but the rock is strong, solid gneiss and is so well-banded many pitches that look impossible turn out to be staircases. Also there are quite a few handy ledges that allow easy traverses while looking for a route through the next band. We stopped abruptly at the 'big bulge.' The next 700 feet or so is probably all fifth and sixth class, and we did not feel qualified to make the attempt. However, the rock is so good, and there are so many piton cracks we spotted several routes, all of which should be feasible for a strong party. The final 700 feet to the summit [the east peak at 8501'] is probably a stroll, though there may be a pitch or two of climbing" (May 1960 Summit, p. 20).

 

There is an obvious discrepancy here in the evaluation of the climbing quality of the rock. The 1958 party does correctly describe the rock as being of banded gneiss. However, their attempt on the East face was confined to the lower right side, which slopes at less of an angle than does the left side where the Beckey attempt of 1968 took place. The 1958 route on the right-hand lower one-third of the face appears to have taken place in largely 4th class terrain, whereas the 1968 route on the left-hand lower one-third of the face appears to have more rapidly gained entry into 5th class territory.

 

There are routes of great difficulty, which should be climbed only once, and there are routes of such great danger and unfeasibility that they should never be climbed. The central 800 feet of the East face of the Southeast Twin Spire probably falls into this latter category. The Northwest Spire has already proven to be deadly. The Southeast Spire has an even greater potential.

[Dru]

wow! ive done met my master at the game of climbing trivia. i bow before your majesty!!!!

[Billygoat]

Harry is definitely in book writing form Dru. Your contributions here and at Bivouac are quite the body of work as well, albeit over time....

[Stefan]

PONCHO&LEFTY said:

Hinkhouse peak near Ingalls Peak. Named after Jimmy Hinkhouse founder of a sobriety based mountaineering group who died on Denali in '95.

 

The name is correct and the location is not correct. The location of Hinkhouse peak is State Crag in Beckey#3 (the highest point called Index. For those who do not know, the location is directly across from Liberty Bell across the highway. It takes approximately two hours to reach the top of this peak from the overlook. I believe the register on top of this peak was started in 1968 and had only seen 20 or so people sign it since I was there in 1998. Which is quite amazing since it is only 2 hours from a highway.

[forrest_m]

HarryMajors said:

(CAG is not infrequently negligent when it comes to expressly providing climbers with ideas and information pertaining to remaining unclimbed routes and potential first ascents in the North Cascades.)

 

harry, you're a master of understatement. great debut post, thanks for sharing your research.

[Lowell_Skoog]

We are privileged to have a historian of Harry Majors' standing in this forum. (Harry, look for a private message from me.) For those who may not know, Harry Majors conducted the North Cascades History Project sponsored by the University of Washington in the early 1970s. He interviewed many old-timers and compiled a wealth of material that is available in U.W. Special Collections. I've only reviewed a tiny bit of that material, but it's of great quality. A big welcome to you, Harry!

 

[HarryMajors]

Gentlemen,

 

Thank you for your kind words of welcome to cascadeclimbers.com. I have actually been lurking here for many months (actually over two years), but now feel that this is in very poor form, and that I should express a more visible support for this outstanding resource for the Northwest climbing community. The presence of an internet-based forum such as this, for the open publication, diffusion, and critical commentary of climbing information has profoundly changed the mountaineering scene. All of us are deeply indebted to Jon and Tim for their creation and maintenance of this forum. Any person with access to a computer can now instantaneously "publish" information. And any other person with access to a computer can immediately present critical or constructive commentary on that information. From time to time, I hope to "publish" information on cascadeclimbers.com that may possibly be of some interest and utility to a few individuals.

 

Dru --- You knowledge of the mountains of British Columbia is unsurpassed by that of any other person, and your website constitutes an unrivalled source of information pertaining to that region. I confess to virtually complete ignorance of anything north of the 49th Parallel, so this is a field in which I must readily defer to your supremacy. I particularly congratulate you on your knowledge of the explorations of David Thompson, whose lifetime geographical achievement exceeds even that of Lewis and Clark. Yet few persons are aware of his existence.

 

Forrest --- Congratulations on discovering and climbing the new route on Mt. Hardy. There are very few outstanding new routes on superlative rock still unclimbed in the North Cascades. You and Dan have brought to light one of the last remaining truly classic lines in this area. Good work!

 

Lowell --- Within the short space of two or three years, you have become one of the Northwest's most distinguished mountaineering historians. I am particularly pleased to see that you found the taped interview with Dwight Watson to be of use in your researches. Dwight was a very modest, shy, and self-effacing person, whose contribution to ski mountaineering in the Northwest unfortunately went unrecognized during his own lifetime. His memory deserves a better fate than oblivion, and I am certain that your researches and future publications will correct this situation. (Under separate cover I shall be sending a response to your private message.)

 

(A couple of minor corrections to the original post: paragraph 3 should read "Helmy", paragraph 5 should read "the fact that it is one", paragraph 13 should read "by traversing to the unclimbed east peak", and paragraph 14 should read "clarifications". Even we editors frequently slip up on spelling, grammar, typographical errors, and verbal infelicities.)

[slothrop]

I love it when a calm voice with something to say makes itself heard around here. Thanks for being here, Harry! I look forward to hearing more Cascades history from you.

 

Now back to spray...

[Dru]

Um.....

 

Bivouac.com is not my website any more than cc.com is

 

I am just a prolific sprayer

 

And what exactly is it I know about David Thompson, or was that someone else you have mistaken me for? then again I didn't think I had said what you quoted me saying about Skagit Gneiss either (until I looked up the post) so maybe you know me better than I do

[Attitude]

HarryMajors said:

Gentlemen,

 

I have actually been lurking here for many months (actually over two years), but now feel that this is in very poor form, and that I should express a more visible support for this outstanding resource for the Northwest climbing community....

Ha ha ha.

 

Obviously a troll.

[Dru]

harry said

Any person with access to a computer can now instantaneously "publish" information.

 

 

and some of it is even accurate!

[Stefan]

I hope I hear more from you Harry Majors on this website.

[Tod]

What an incredible post! Thank you Harry for taking the time to post what I feel is very interesting, and to many, very important imformation. I've been up in that area many times and my interest in it never seems to end.

 

Your presence is very welcome and I hope you are able to continue posting here at cc.com.

[Dru]

i am interested now, wonder if if anyone who was recently up on spickard took a photo of the east face of east mox?

 

as for significant "last great problems" the west and south faces of Hozomeen N peak are just as big as the e face of e Mox, and more accessible...and also have issues of rock quality like lack of any cracks for protection.

[Lowell_Skoog]

Re: SE Twin Spire, HarryMajors said:

The original register was left in a Crescent cinnamon can which, along with one of Lage Wernstedt's Prince Albert tobacco cans, must constitute one of the most historic register containers in the North Cascades.

 

I climbed both spires in July 1999. My memory is fuzzy, but I don't think the original register is still on the SE peak. Anybody else who's been up the peak remember?

 

Regarding historic registers, Don Goodman told me that he and his wife found a very fragile register dating from September 25, 1900 on the summit of North Star, near Bonanza. He speculated that it might be the oldest Cascade register still on a summit.

 

Another bit of trivia about Don (better watch my tongue since he probably reads this stuff ;-) is that he may be the only person crazy enough to have climbed the SE peak of Twin Spires TWICE.

 

I believe Steve Swenson may have made an attempt on the E face of Twin Spires in the 1970s. I can't remember where I got that impression. Also, "Dave Leen" is probably Doug Leen. I may have some more info about the peak, but I'll need to check my files at home.

[vegetablebelay]

I took a couple of pics of the E face of E Mox while over on Tombstone or nearby on the ridge. Don't know if they are close up enough to get much detail but I'll look for them tonight.

[vegetablebelay]

Ok, Thar she blows! It's also barely in the pic in the red Beckey spread of the Silver Lake area on pg 135.

[HarryMajors]

Dru --- Thank you for the clarification regarding bivouac.com. Your own contributions there have been so numerous and of such high quality, that I have been proceeding under the mistaken assumption that you were also involved in the administration of the site. I sincerely appreciate my error being brought to my attention. You have definitely confirmed the correctness of my asserting to be in "virtually complete ignorance of anything north of the 49th Parallel."

 

I nonetheless stand by my original statement that, in my view, "Your knowledge of the mountains of British Columbia is unsurpassed by that of any other person." And bivouac.com does indeed constitute "an unrivalled source of information pertaining to that region." From what I have seen of your posts during the past 2 years or so here at cc.com, you know your mountains, and you know them well.

 

With respect to your knowing about the achievements in exploration of Canada's greatest explorer, David Thompson --- Verifying that took a bit of time, as the post was not readily available through the cc.com search engine, and I could not immediately recall its location. I had originally planned on devoting the day to trying to find something that might be of some use to Lowell in connection with his research on the history of ski mountaineering in the Northwest, but the Thompson situation piqued my interest and curiosity, so I decided to spend the day selectively going through cc.com, post by post, and reply by reply.

 

My compliment to you on your knowledge of David Thompson was based on the following:

 

"You guys may have forgotten David Thompson but we haven't. What the hell we named a highway and a river after him. If you read Thompson's journals he reports that large hairy creatures, much bigger than men, threw rocks at his canoe as his expedition canoed down the upper Thompson River - near Squilax, . . . " (cascadeclimbers.com, Climber's Board -- Reading List, post #40862, dated Sept. 23, 2002)

 

My compliment to you still stands. I hold David Thompson in particularly high esteem, for I believe him to the single greatest explorer of the North American continent. Yet, his name is still virtually unknown, particularly in this country. Anyone who knows of David Thompson and his achievement stands high in my regard.

 

 

Lowell --- I may be wrong -- and I would be the first to admit so -- in fact, I would welcome being proven wrong, for it would then allow me to correct my records --- but I believe there were two Leens: Douglas Vernon Leen, and his brother David Leen. Doug graduated from the University of Washington in 1970 (he may have been a Geology major, as I was), and he was working as a Park Ranger at Grand Teton National Park in 1973. Doug did Liberty Bell (Serpentine Crack, first ascent, July 6, 1967), South Early Winter Spire (East Buttress Direct, first ascent, July 29, 1968), and Cathedral Peak (South Face, Sept. 28, 1968).

 

I have Dave Leen down for the second ascent of Southeast Mox/Twin Spire (Sept. 4, 1968), as well as an ascent of Liberty Ridge on July 21, 1968.

 

I do notice one discrepancy here: Dr. Mike Heath provided me with September 4, 1968 as the date of the second ascent of Southeast Mox/Twin Spire, whereas CAG-3 (p. 130) gives "September 5, 1968" as the date. Brad Fowler informed me that he could not recall the exact date, which leaves only "Dave" Leen and the register itself as the only other independent sources to confirm which of the two is the correct date. (The Crescent cinnamon can register-container was still on the summit as of the year 1968.)

 

Brad Fowler did mention to me that: "The whole peak is littered with large pieces of loose, sharp edged rock, like a bunch of axe heads waiting to fall."

 

This does illustrate why the history of climbing in the North Cascades is a particularly difficult topic to work with. Many of the first or otherwise noteworthy ascents during the past 30 or 40 years have been achieved by young individuals, frequently of college age. After graduation, many of them move to other parts of the state or country, or lose interest in climbing, and are difficult to contact. Often, only one member of the party may have written an account of the ascent for publication, and that constitutes the only recorded documentation of the climb.

 

With the advent of the internet, and in particular such extremely valuable sites as cascadeclimbers.com, this has now all changed. Multiple accounts of ascents are being written, they are being widely disseminated, and (hopefully) these records will eventually find permanent homes in libraries and their preservation thus be assured for posterity.

 

I do appreciate the correction. And I would like to thank you for bringing to my attention the instance of pre-1900 use of skis in the North Cascades, which I was entirely unaware of. Your research is of extraordinarily high quality, and I look forward to seeing it in print.

 

One last comment: The 1958 Portland party, during their attempt on the East face, mention the "big bulge" where their climbing efforts terminated. It is possible that the central third of this face may, in part, be overhanging. If this is the case, then a direct route on the East face of the Southeast Twin Spire, because of the overhang and the unstable nature of the rock, would present an extraordinarily severe problem. It is of interest to note that the route of the1958 attempt veered to the right/north and toward the northeast buttress (evidently to avoid the central third of the face); whereas the 1968 attempt was confined to the lower left/south half of the face. Neither party pursued a direct line of ascent, even on the lower one-third of the face.

 

(I am not using a spell-checker, so I do apologize in advance for any inaccuracies that may have slipped in. I should also like to make it clear to readers that I myself no longer climb; moreover, years ago, when I did climb, my expertise was mediocre, and my experience minimal.)

 

Again, climbers should be warned that this particular mountain has the potential for being an extraordinarily deadly peak. There are other, far safer and more enjoyable objectives, with much more classic lines and far superior rock, to climb in the North Cascades.

[Cpt.Caveman]

Again, climbers should be warned that this particular mountain has the potential for being an extraordinarily deadly peak. There are other, far safer and more enjoyable objectives, with much more classic lines and far superior rock, to climb in the North Cascades

 

So what- some times the gem is in disguise. Rumors of the Eiger (ogre) are that it's chossy. Could you personally and singlehandedly claim it non classic because of bad or difficult rock?

 

Just a simple thought.

[Dru]

ok so i did say that about david thompson... i read that in john green's book about the sasquatch when i was a little kid!

[Dru]

vegetablebelay said:

Ok, Thar she blows! It's also barely in the pic in the red Beckey spread of the Silver Lake area on pg 135.

 

yeah i know in the beckey but in your pic i cant see anything but sky. try cropping mox out or reducing the pic or the image quality there veggie!

[Cpt.Caveman]

vegetalbes email to me and I will post it uncropped.