epb Posted December 9, 2001 Author Share Posted December 9, 2001 The very same guy who taught me to climb when I was 8 yelled at me 9 years later as I cruised past him and his group on a wall. Said I was setting a bad example. However, when I told him I got wehere I was today becuase of what I learned from him (he didn't recognize me), he didn't know what to say. (I think he was actually kind of proud ) We did whined up having a good laugh about it though. It was cool. The same route he once took me up 9 years ago I was now soloing withe ease. I'm actually suprise about the number of people soloing out there. I thought I was a minority. I don't know anyone that solos personally. From the sounds if it by all the replys, quite a few are into it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pope Posted December 9, 2001 Share Posted December 9, 2001 I used to really enjoy it, and I even did a few easy solos this summer. In my present situation, it seems a little selfish to be risking everything in the name of personal gratification while my family sits home waiting. I'm finding a lot of satisfaction with a rope, although it's definitely not as breezy and care-free as soloing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schlangeschmecker Posted December 9, 2001 Share Posted December 9, 2001 Ya, Amerikanischer climbers are in d' mountains slower den der Obermeister's morning bowel movement! Der Austrian's small finger ist larger den Amerikanischer climber's bicep, ya? Und ze Bier in die Vereinigten Stadten ist like dee piss in our Europische Toileten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason_Martin Posted December 9, 2001 Share Posted December 9, 2001 Just an opinion... But I think Lambone hit the nail on the head in his previous post. Being a little bit friendly goes a long way. When soloists come crusing by and act as if no one is as good as them... Yeah, people are going to get pissed. On the other hand if a soloist hangs back and has friendly conversations with the climbers in front of him, more often than not those climbers will allow him to pass. The Northwest does have a very large contigent of undertrained people "teaching" others how to climb. One of the things some of these groups "teach" most efficiently is how to be rude to those who are not in their party. If people were a little more cordial to one another in the mountains, I think some of the more serious issues between slow parties, fast parties, and soloists could be dealt with in a classier way, minus the ruffled feathers. Jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chucK Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 Hey Jason, I've been hiking/climbing in WA for like 12 years now, and I've never had trouble with anybody being a dick. My feather have never been quote: ruffled . Not once!! I infrequently get the pleasure to wait behind a quote: large contigent of undertrained people "teaching" others how to climb , but I've never experienced lack of cordiality. Dude, maybe it's you, or not. Either way, a an obvious solution to your problem would be to go climb somewhere else. Glad I could help. Later,Chuck So me 'n marty was up to climb the tooth one day in a March. We were trying to get up around a big cornice at that pass south of pineapple. I was climbing up on the right and just made it to a traverse across choss. These mounties come charging right up below me and I'm telling them about this rock that's just dislodged and balanced against my shins. They just stare up at me and don't get helmets out or nuthin'. And then the rock lets go, and I yell, and they back off after that. So then, marty comes up and he's trailing their rope. Well, we rig a toprope for the mounties, but they aren't able to climb directly up the cornice. They don't want to do the choss traverse as it wouldn't be protected by the toprope. So, they ended up leaving the rope there and hiking all the way around through the pass further East. Meanwhile, marty 'n me climb up the Tooth in sunshine. When we rap on down, it's right through the ascending mounties, and now it's snowing! These guys were top notch all the way! Never a scowl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Lambone: What could I do, call the Rock Cops?! Trust me I wanted to push him off, but he would have been falling onto my gear that I was also clipped to!!!!Mostly I was just gripped on a Yosemite 5.8 crack, and I didn't know what to think...it was my first route in Yosemite and I was totaly awstruck by the glory of the valley. The dude cruzed out on the face about ten feet left of me, just smiled and went right on by whisteling the Austrian National Anthem or something. The weird part was when I met up with him at the belay... He didn't speak english so I just scoweled at him. Everything he did from his anchor set up to his belay tecniques were totaly foriegn to me. He was more than twice my age and his equipment looked abut 4 times as old as mine. So no, I didn't say much about it. Hell, I was only fifteen, I was also dieing of thirst and he gave me some candy so I just let it go... That is just one story, one time a group of 5 Koreans thought they would join us for the night on Camp 6(room for 3) on the Nose. HAHAHAHA.... They even had portaledges, but just wanted to be on our ledge...they ended up giving us lots of smokes, so it was all good. Or there's that time that the Germans above us left a bag of shit tied to the belay... And that one time when the Spanish team stole our fuel and food out of Camp 1... The list goes on... American climbers may be slow, but I have never run into any that are rude vile theives. Am I a little bitter...what, does it show? [ 12-08-2001: Message edited by: Lambone ] You are just jealous. I think soloists have a right to pass. Get off of it. I like the dont touch me part Freak. I do solo once in a long while but not on difficult stuff and yes on traveled routes. I try to do them when they are not crowded. If soloists pass me I give them their space and respect that they are faster than me. The firs time I was passed was on Snow Creek Wall and I did not complain. Why should I? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 quote: Originally posted by schlangeschmecker: Ya, Amerikanischer climbers are in d' mountains slower den der Obermeister's morning bowel movement! Der Austrian's small finger ist larger den Amerikanischer climber's bicep, ya? Und ze Bier in die Vereinigten Stadten ist like dee piss in our Europische Toileten. You rule dude hahahahhah! I lived in Bavaria in the early 90s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstrickland Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 I think we're about a huge difference between rock routes and apline/snow/ice routes. In addition to all the junk raining on you, a soloist in crampons with axes falling through your team would be ugly, with a rope-chopping possibility. A soloist on rock, however will probably still put a serious hurting on you if they fall into you, but you might get away clean. I had similar expereinces to Lambone on my first trip to the valley. We were behind a slow party on Serenity/Sons and a German/Austrian pair invaded our belay and started clipping into our gear. I promptly clipped the guy to my daisy and unclipped his shit from our gear and told him to clip into something other than our gear or downclimb his ass back to his last piece. I was pissed to say the least. On the other hand, I've had the same deal happen when we were the slow party, a team simuling clipping into a couple of our pieces and the belay...their leader yelled from about a pitch away and asked if they could climb through and clip our gear in the belay anchor. "Sure man, just let me hit the next stance and place a piece before you get to me". They were through us and gone in about 5 minutes. Taking a new partner up Arches, a soloist was coming through with my partner, a fairly new leader, on the shapr end. The guy asked if he could pass, and I just warned him that the guy leading was a novice and let him get to a comfy stance first...no problem. Funny you mention Koreans, what year was that? I did the Lost Arrow tip with a Korean guy and gal in the summer of 2000, and they definitely had that labor division thing going on. Their third member (not climbing with us, shooting pics from the rim) was on the Nose a couple of years before that...apparently with a sizeable team, he ended up sleeping in the haulbag for a couple of nights...guy owns a gym in the burbs of Seoul, is the Korean Prana rep, maybe it was his party you guys saw. They were amazingly friendly, fed me in camp for four or five nights, loaded me up with Soju (a Korean liquor, basically 40 proof vodka flavored with a little plum, it even comes in little juice box style containers for travel!), even sent me a gift when they returned to Korea. Now how's that for hospitality compared to the French guy/gal team that I spent three hours teaching to clean pendulums in camp only to have the assholes cut line on me at the deli and act like they'd never even seen me before...punk ass bitches, I bet that puddle of piss I left in their tent while they were gone the next day was a fun discovery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RURP Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 I am RURP, former lurker who has briefly returned to base camp after a lifetime of Big Wall dedication. You, Lamebone, what is with this?: "at the time I WAS YOUNG and unaware of European tactics. That kind of behavior may be the norm in Europe, but this is our home turf, and they should play by our rules..This experience left a very bad taste in my mouth towards foriegn climbers." How old are you, Lambone? Twenty, Twenty-one, perhaps? You are still in Big Wall diapers. And I do not want to know what you put in your mouth, mister, but how about a few pleasant words to foreign guests? You said it was not an issue but you made sure we knew that it was Koreans and Austrians who irritated you. And I would guess you wouldn't know the Austrian national anthem if you heard it. Did it sound like this: “Ja, vi elsker dette landet, som det stiger frem,”? It did? Then they were from the Norway! If they were from Austria it goes like this, junior: “Land der Berge, Land am Strome, Land der Äcker, Land der Dome, Land der Hämmer, zukunftsreich! Heimat bist du großer Söhne, Volk, begnadet für das Schöne, Vielgerühmtes Österreich.” Did you like the song? Did you tap your foot to the rhythm against the haul-bag which you overpacked so it slowed you down? And you think they (foreigners) should "play by our rules"? By reading the posts on this web-site, there doesn't seem to be too many rules in American climbing that anyone agrees upon. Americans in general tend not to be great examples when they are abroad and go about as if they are still at home and know what's best, so now it's a taste of your own medicine. And by the way, be unjustifiably rude to a foreigner here and abroad and maybe you've just created the next anti-American hoodlum. And you, Schlangeschlurper or whatever...what is with the phony German thing? Are you trying to convince everyone that you took a couple of quarters of German in High School so that we'll think you're somewhat educated despite your rude comments? Is this like Lamebone's repeated attempts to remind of that he has been big-walling in the Himalaya? Back to sorting gear: RURP has a couple of walls to finish today before the sun sets. RURP HAS SPOKEN [ 12-10-2001: Message edited by: RURP ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 Hi RURP, I agree with you on some things. Who is Schlongslurper's real identity anyway Also don't climbers from the US do the same things when climbing on the large walls? I have read they do... Are not the Europeans and Asians some of the best alpinists in the world? Do we not hype our Americans up to be better than they are at times? Hmm... Marc Twight vs BUBU.. Not really a match is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeadam Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 Hmmm...Bubu-Twight versus unknown...unhearalded Canadian, American, Slovenian, Japanese,Gypsy climbing bums living in their trucks freezing all winter and totally against self promotion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 I'm not sure that I would be happy with someone clipping all my pro to pass me but things are a little different in Europe. Americans are used to having a lot of space while in Europe most people live in tight quarters where lack of personal space is the norm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Lambone: Hahaha...This is getting a bit off epbs original topic, but if you like boring El Cap stories by all means read on. Take note- I meen no offense towards Koreans, any other nationality or ethnic group for that matter... The whole scene involving the team behind us was unlike anything I had ever seen before in climbing. Like pope explained above these guys had a very structured team system. Each member had a specific job, and it was quite the corporate hierarchy. One guy (the ropegun) led every pitch, one guy (the bitch) hauled every pitch, one guy cleaned every pitch, and the oldest (the boss) barked orders at every one else. I never figured out exactly what the fifth guy did, maybe he was in charge of packing all their crap up, and they had about six haulbags worth of crap! I've allway thought that it seemed to be an interesting technique for getting a large team up a wall. From our point of view it was pretty entertaining! Of course, there was no way we were going to let them pass us, but every morning they would get up at about 5:00 and start getting ready. They'd yell up to wake us up and get moving. We call down profanities and around 8:00 or so we'd crawl out of or bags whip it out and give them a pissing contest! Regardless of our differences, we were all pretty damn happy to be up there together. Until they showed up at Camp 6... [ 12-08-2001: Message edited by: Lambone ] So I guess you are a bigot Iamboner? Just because these "foreigners" used a different style than yours means they are "entertaining". Is "entertaining" your own word for some other definition? Perhaps something like stupid or dumb? I guess so. I climb with someone that is Korean every once in a while. My guess is that he would find your story repulsive. You would not let them pass? What do you have some sort of ego problem? You yelled obscenities or racial remarks? What a friendly climber you portray yourself as but this is obvious you are just as much an jerk as the next guy posting here. "Differences" Does that mean different race or something? So you say also that the foreigners are rude thieves. Give me a break. There is more crime here than in Austria for example. Is it not true that Americans steal as well. What a stereotype you portray of climbers from other countries. [ 12-10-2001: Message edited by: Cobra ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtngrrrl Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 C'est vrai, RURP! Combien de fois les Américains faire le grimper dans d'autres parties du monde sans apprendre jamais Nepali, Français, Italien ou Allemand? LB, sounds like you have a little ethnocentric [Lame]bone to pick. Never run into "rude vile" American???!!! Putain! Sure don't have to go far to run into them around here... "We call down profanities and around 8:00 or so we'd crawl out of or bags whip it out and give them a pissing contest!" "I bet that puddle of piss I left in their tent while they were gone the next day was a fun discovery." Why ARE you so intent on telling us all your damn furriner stories if you meant no offense? As far as soloists, I say, pass on. Be careful. More power to you. I guess I don't think I have the right to LET or NOT LET someone pass. I don't own the rock. YOU don't own the rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 Lambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loserLambone is a loser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstrickland Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 Americans are notorious for being slow wankers, that's what...I mean it musta took me 30, 40 minutes to wank yesterday Was I bragging about pissing in their tent? Maybe, but the point was they got less than they deserved. You tell me how you'd feel when you spend 3 hours teaching someone you've never met at their request only to have them pull some shit like cutting in line. If I didn't know I'd get thrown in the Yosemite clink I'd have grabbed that fucker by his hair and dragged his frenchie ass to the back of the line... call me a biggot if you want, I've partnered with French, Germans,Brits, Irish, Koreans, Japanese, and Swiss and had a ropegun frenchie drag my ass up some stuff I'd otherwise never even attempt. I don't care if you're from france, cameroon, or tatooine for that matter, but invading belays and other euro tactics are something akin to me going to the Saxony region of Germany where only soft pro (knotted slings etc) is used and pounding pins, or using white chalk where only colored is permitted, etc, it may be your "way" but it ain't "THE way". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epb Posted December 10, 2001 Author Share Posted December 10, 2001 assumtions assumptions assumptions. Lambone = Bigot, cause he wouldn't let some drag ass korean team pass him. Screw that man. I wouldn't let any slow ass team get a head of me just cause they wake up at the butt crack of dawn, only to have to deal with them an hour later up on the wall. Regardless of their nationality of course. The only thing Lambone's post showed was that people suck! Americans Europeans Austrialians, we are all rude as fuck and in our own ways. People suck..you all suck, blah blah blah. Long live me and my shack in the woods. >> When soloists come crusing by and act as if no one is as good as them... Yeah, people are going to get pissed. << But arn't soloists better than every one else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
max Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 "bigot" "racist" Give me a break. These guys aren't. Look back through their posts (especially l.b's) and you'll eat your words (or else maybe YOU'LL just close your eyes! And even if someone does make generalizations about particular nationalities, isn't it possible they are GENERALLY true? Do we throw out statistics 'cause they're "not nice". "Those statisitcs make me feel bad... I want cuddly bear... WAAAAAA!" Give me a break. And even if they're not true, you can't say Americans don't get shit-on generalizations too. I say it's a rough world, buck up! If you can't handle some lip from somebody, you're probably not cut out to be a world traveler/climber. The idea of being able to climb el cap and not being able to handle being labeled/generalized/sterotyped is silly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Caveman Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 This thread is sillier than my posts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 I wasn't trying to pick on any Nationality in particular... The point of my stupid stories was that foreigners seem to be less respectful of their fellow climbers, or at least less respectful of Americans. Of course lots of Americans suck too, but I think we have less attitude than climbers from other parts of the world. Maybe I'm just being patriotic. That assumption is based on my experiences alone, and I am totaly open to debate. Thats why I brought it up, I'm curious about other opinions on the issue, and it seemed to fit the "crowd" topic. So you can call me a bigot or whatever, but at least I have an opinion. If your gunna dis on me, at least back your shit up... P.S. Thanks epb + max, and caveman...well I won't even go there. [ 12-10-2001: Message edited by: Lambone ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RURP Posted December 10, 2001 Share Posted December 10, 2001 This is RURP: That Lambone says: "rurp...What would you say to me If I was screaming at you at 5:00 in the morning?" RURP would say, "Thank you very much Mister Noisy Guy. It's another Big Wall day and my alarm clock must have not gone off an hour ago. Otherwise I would be two pitches above you right now. And by the way, I would share my tasty Big Wall breakfast with you but you might be allergic to kim chee and spaetlze." That is what I would say. RURP has spoken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epb Posted December 11, 2001 Author Share Posted December 11, 2001 You know what I'd say. "Good morning, thanks for the wake up call"...I did have to take a load off. Then I'd carry on and do so right above them, nice and proper like. I'd then crawl back into my sleeping bag and catch a few zzz's while those inconsiderate bastards spend a another hour cleaning the shit off their faces. Screw getting woken up by some pushy bastards below. I don't care how considerate and polite someone is...if they are stepping on my dick while smiling, it doesn't mean i'm gonna smile back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted December 11, 2001 Share Posted December 11, 2001 quote: Originally posted by mikeadam: Hmmm...Bubu-Twight versus unknown...unhearalded Canadian, American, Slovenian, Japanese,Gypsy climbing bums living in their trucks freezing all winter and totally against self promotion. I smoked a bowl with a slovenian japanese gypsy once. it was pure skunk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted December 11, 2001 Share Posted December 11, 2001 Yep, your right I'm just a rude bigot who has ethnocetric veiw points towards climbers who visit our National Parks...oh almost forgot, I'm also a hypocrite cause I am just as rude as any of the foreigners that I just dissed on...oh yeah and I am also ignorant about European nationalities and Eastern social customs. Thanks for reminding me of all that, I almost forgot. All I'm sayin is that of the few encounters I've had with forigners on climbing routes, almost all of them have been bad. That is a fact...if you don't like that I am stating this fact, then you can just suck it. Rurp, we wouldn't let them pass because they were a hell of alot slower than us, they just climbed well into the dark hours to catch up to us. We only saw them in the morning and by headlamp at night. We din't yell any racial slurs, we just told them to shut the fuck up and leave us alone. What would you say to me If I was screaming at you at 5:00 in the morning? And no, we did not piss on, or anywhere near them. [ 12-10-2001: Message edited by: Lambone ] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willstrickland Posted December 11, 2001 Share Posted December 11, 2001 Easy there Mtngorilla, I was the one with the piss-in-the-tent anecdote, Bone was pissing on the wall. Don't slam the dude for my remarks, in fact until you get fucked on a wall climb by some "furners" because they don't understand the game, don't be harshin on him at all. I seroiusly doubt he's a biggot or xenophobe, but the reality is in the Valley there are ALOT of foreign teams who don't belong on the climbs they are on. I don't have any desire for regulation...if you've got the balls have at it...but I've seen too many belay invasions, and general bungling directly attributable to the "new to the valley" factor. It doesn't even apply strictly to foreign people, I bungled my first season, but add the language barrier and it's more of an issue. Europeans are notorious for invading your belay, and no I don't own the route or the rock, but I also don't want you and your two buddies trying to share a 2ft x 2ft platform with me and clippping an extra 700lb to the anchor while I'm trying to belay and encourage my partner. Sorry for the hostile tone, but until you've experienced it, it's easy to criticize. I determine what makes me feel safe, having an extra half-ton on the anchors doesn't inspire confidence (ridiculous? three 200lb climbers, a 50 lb rack, 30lb more in ropes and another 30 in packs...that's over 700lb). Just my opinion, I could be wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.