sobo

ashish, Yes, mule route, dog route, donkey trail, conga line, etc. are all monikers for the easiest, most popular routes. And what Kurt said. Know how to use your map & compass and/or GPS. If you search the Mt. Rainier National Park's website, you can find a "cheat sheet" for magnetic and true compass bearings from the Paradise Lodge to Camp Muir which could come in very handy if you're caught in a white-out on the way. Along the way there is a wide snow slope where more than a few people have died when weather swept in on them. It's deceiving because it's so close to the lodge that on a clear day you could pick your car out in the parking lot. Similarly on Hood, the natural fall line will take you down and away to skier's right on the descent if you don't make a conscious effort to keep a slight trend to the left. Lotsa folks have ended up over in the Zig Zag Glacier area and got themselves into heap big trouble. And watch out for cornices on MSH. I think it was just last year, or maybe the year before, some guy walked up to the edge of the crater and in a fog/white-out, stepped right off the edge and fell several hundred feet into the crater. Don't be that guy... Pay attention on your ascent on the south side of Adams, and look behind you to see how things will look coming back down. Lots of people get "displaced" when descending Adams cuz it's a big wide mountain with lots of different ways to the bottom. My first trip up there 25 years ago, I got into the wrong drainage above the Crescent Glacier and ended up a lot further east than I should have been. However, I had paid attention on the way up, and realized that I wasn't seeing the same landmarks from the reversed orientation (of descent), and broke out the map and compass and performed a resection. That told me that I was way off route, and told me what I had to do to regain the proper descent route. It only cost me about an hour or so, but others have made similar mistakes wherein it cost them many days for us to find them (I'm in Mountain Rescue). And one more thing about Adams (although it applies to all mountains, but it seems to be specifically epidemic on Adams)... NEVER glissade with your crampons on, no matter how perfectly you think you'll be able to execute that unwise maneuver. We're constantly hauling people off Adams with spiral tib/fib fractures.

I don't have a dog in this (Rocky Butte) fight, but this proposal is yet another slippery slope from which we should stay well back, IMO, bill. Regulating climbing in a gym setting is one thing (reduces gym owner exposure to liability claims), regulating it in an outdoor, public setting is quite another. Even the rangers at MRNP won't tell someone that they can't climb there, even when it's painfully obvious that a particular individual shouldn't even consider starting up.

Well, Stephen, it's only "been a while" in the sense that I haven't been broadcasting about it lately. Been pretty busy with work, and mostly out of town, this whole summer. Not enough time for fun times...

The mule routes on Hood, Adams, MSH, and the lower flanks of Rainier (up to Muir) will all fit that bill for that timeframe. Crevasses and bergschrunds are minimal to non-existent on the mule routes on all of those peaks. Just watch the weather forecasts carefully as you get further into the fall season. Hood is climbable and easily accessible at any time of year. Put that toward the end of your trip, or make it a repeat if you get on it earlier.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat??? This is considered in poor taste and weak? I never woulda thunk it.

Hey kev, Mebbe you should consider doing a live aid concert for Rocky Butte. You know, to keep it open for climber-types... Jus' sayin'...

Always a pleasure to see your avatar around here again, C. I especially like the tushie ones... Now, to the issue at hand... the motion has been seconded Amended the motion, and I second the amendment. I know that under RONR, I can't second my own amendment, but gimme a break this one time. You'll see why as you read below. I agree that the two men should be charged with child endangerment, neglect of a child, or somesuch similar crime. Totally inept parenting and stupidity are in play here with these two "fathers." Yes, they are "fathers" in the procreative sense of the word, but by their example, they are definitley not "parents", IMHO. At least, not very intelligent ones... Be that as it may, they should NOT be charged for their rescue. Anybody familiar with me or who has been on this board long enough knows why I take and hold this position. If you don't, then visit the MRA website and click on the orange box at lower left of their home page. Follow (and read) all of the links to the various articles and position papers, then make your own, INFORMED, decision on this topic. I have... Pardon the macabre pun, but I believe charging for rescues is a slippery slope, from the edge of which we should stay well away.

The horror!!!

Bill, I whole-heartedly agree that WSNF.org is the way to fight this shite. I've been following Scott Silvers' (another "No Fee" advocate) advice for almost 15 years, ever since "Fee Demo" became "not Demo anymore". I'm not advocating civil unrest with my little discussion with the ranger, but just wanted folks to know that there is a way to circumvent the fee/ticket if they so choose to employ that form of a solution.

Little story to tell here... Last September, I was up at the Blue Lake TH with my GF at the time. We had been biking on the MVSTA trail earlier, and I wanted to take her up to see the Liberty Bell Group (she's not a climber). We pulled into the TH parking lot to see a large-ish female ranger ticketing vehicles. Playing like a simple touron, I asked her what she was doing. Her: "Writing tickets to these people that aren't displaying a parking pass." Me: "You have to have a pass to park here?" Her: "Yup, sure do. You can get them right here at the kiosk. Some people just won't." Me: "Oh, so the passes/fee envelopes are available right here at the parking lot?" Her: "Yup, sure are. You need to get yourself one if you're going to stay here, or I'll have to ticket you, too." Me: "What happens if I come here and there's no passes/fee envelopes at the kiosk? What then?" Her: "Well, if there's none here, then you don't have to pay the fee. We've got no way to know who's paid and who's not in that case." So the point here is, kype all of the passes/fee envelopes and hide them in your vehicle somewhere, and no one has to pay to park that weekend. You're a hero! Just toss the passes when you get home.

Yes, Andy, you are correct. I am referring to the Palisades that are on the west side of the Cascades, but NOT in MRNP, and are easily viewed from the USFS rest area along US-12 as it descends toward its intersection with SR-123.

See highlighting. I've seen that stuff across the river over there for years (the picture is most likely taken from the small USFS rest area a couple of miles below the crest of the Cascades on the west side). You will likely have to rap in and climb out, given that I hear an enormous roar of whitewater every time I stop and admire those cliffs. Although I haven't actually been to the bottom of the cliffs, it seems to me that you'd be starting the routes from an extremely moist and frothy belay... As OW says, it's a long ways to go for a bunch of mossy choss, and it will take (literally) thousands of trips to keep it clean. Does that make us Lazy climbers...?? Mebbe so...

From the comments section of KOIN, regarding this rescue I replied to yankee, the asshole...

Thanks, OW. Might explain why I have a set of these at home. I always try to keep my wine above the line...

No, it's not. OW got it right, it's Tim Curry. Dru's pic is of Curry as Dr. Frankenfurter, from Rocky Horror Picture Show

Not saying it stoked me, Carl, but rather that it was completely unexpected. I mean, this is 'Merica after all... Once I finish paying out the equity in the house to the ex by early next year, I will have much more disposable income available for such trips you suggest.

OMFG, this is great stuff! Way better than that silly City Park bolt thread that spawned this. Blue Ribbon: 5.13 nubbin tugging hotty - Classic! Best of Show: Hexes=Cougar Aphrodesiac and bro repellant. Honorable Mention: rope bunnies

My two week "expedition" is up and I just fled back home to WA last night. Just coming around now from the whirlwind tour... I did indeed make it to the North Unit - twice (once for work, the other for playtime). That place is even more awesomer than the South Unit. And yes I did encounter the band of wild horses and ponies in the South Unit last weekend. I didn't know about them ahead of time, and was surprised as all hell to run into such a thing. Truly majestic. Something else that I found pretty cool. You can buy beer (Fat Tire, no less!) from the store in the Bismarck Airport. And you can take it with you to the gate while you wait for your plane! Kinda nice surfing teh internets at the free WiFi stations with an ice cold brew in your hand. :brew: Me: "You mean I don't have to drink it here? I can take it to go?" Cashier: "Ee-yup! I just sell it. I'm not the Beer Police."

Hood and Adams are practically on top of each other, relatively speaking. If the roads are clear, you should be able to get from Timberline to the ranger station in Trout Lake in about 1.5 hours. Throw in some time to acquire your permit at the ranger station, get a condish report, and drive to the Cold Springs TH and the whole affair should easily take you less than 3 hours. Here's a little story for your entertainment and consideration... Before I moved out here from the East Coast 20+ years ago, I took a trip one summer between semesters to visit a former GF from college. She had graduated already and was living in Portland then. My plan was to come out for a visit, "renew old acquaintances", and climb Hood, my first time above 10,000 feet, together. She got overcome by the sulfur fumes in the Devil's Kitchen just below the Hogsback, so I left her to descend by herself while I went for the summit. I was successful, and was the only person up there on a bright, clear, Saturday morning in June (it was 1986 - you can be sure that won't happen anymore...) FYI, this was just a couple weeks or so after the tradegy with the students and teachers from the Oregon Episcopal School. Anyway, while on top, I looked to the north and saw Adams, although I didn't know what it was at the time. Upon descending, I caught up with Carol, and asked her what mountain it was that I had seen. She replied that it's Adams, and it's fairly close. I said that we should go climb it, too - today! So we wolfed down our packed lunch in the Timberline day lodge, motored her little VW Beetle over to the South Route TH, and embarked upon a climb of Adams that same afternoon. We camped at the Lunch Counter that evening (I brought too damned much shit to move very fast - hell, I didn't know anything about climbing volcanoes then), summitted the next morning, got lost on the descent below the LC, but recovered and were back down to her car by noon on Sunday. So the point of all this is, if you're up for it, you can do a two'fer of Hood and Adams in less than a day and a half, car-to-car, drive, car-to-car, if you're schedule-challenged and the weather cooperates (another reason to delay your climb until at least June). Shit, you could probably do it even faster than my fat lazy ol' ass did it back then.

Before leaving the trailhead, my partner realized he had forgotten his glacier glasses, so I loaned him my Drivers (the only other pair of sunglasses I had in my rig). He fashioned some ghetto side shields out of pieces of a McDonald's drink cup that was rolling around under the seats and some duct tape. After our successful summit via the North Lyman Glacier, he placed my sunlasses atop a large block of rock while we broke camp. It wasn't until we were back at my rig that he remembered he had left them there. This was about 1995 or '96, so I was just curious if you might have seen them recently...

Did you find my pair of Serengeti Drivers at the camp?

That was pretty funny. Nice find, Kurt! FYI, I did actually bring my passport this trip. Three weeks ago, my last flight out of SFO (a non-stop to my hometown) was cancelled. It took me a night on the airport floor, 3 different flights, and over 24 hours to get home. If I had had my passport with me, then I could have been re-booked through Vancouver, BC and been home the first night. So the take-away lesson here is to take my passport with me on any trip to a state that borders either Mexico or Canada. I'm ready now, Jack!

Runnings Fleet and Farm - good stuff! +1 on this. Spent this past weekend in there. Bison (or is it buffalo?? I don't remember which one is extinct...) all over the goddamned place, whitetails, a few bighorn sheep, a bazillion little snaffley critters (prairie dogs), cool hiking trails, the Little Missouri River. A great time - thanks for the rec, Kirk! Found it! The House of Booze, right next to the ACE hardware store! :brew: Subway around the corner of the building.

Nordwand Kitteh...

FLC, Please understand that with what I am about to say, I’m not trying to come off as an asshole or chestbeat. I’ve been on Mt. Washington in late December during several of its gnarly moments. The only similarity that you will find between your experience there and out here on the volcanoes is the wind and cold. The advice I'm about to impart to you comes from learning ice climbing in Huntington’s and Tuckerman’s Ravines over 25 years ago, climbing in the Cascades for the past 20+ years, and being intimately involved with Mt. Adams specifically through Mountain Rescue for the past 8 years. And with that as a preamble... Everything that RBP and Water has said is true. Spring conditions on Adams will have you skiing and/or slogging for miles and miles of additional effort. It will be intolerably boring. You’ll surely hate it... You should seriously consider pushing your dates back to late June/early July, or early June at the earliest. I would agree with you that Rainier may be too big of a bite to chew as your first volcano right off the bus, unless you’re going to hire a guide. We all do it without guides as they aren’t really necessary for us (I’ve never hired a guide, although I’ve climbed with them as friends), because we locals have the time to wait out shitty weather for the right window. From the sound of it, you won’t have this luxury. Lots of folks have been injured or even killed out here trying to force a climb through a crappy weather window because “we’re only here for a week or so.” Good weather windows for the volcanoes in spring are a crapshoot. You'll improve your chances for better weather the closer you get to the start of summer. I agree with RBP that Adams Glacier is more of a commitment than the Emmons or the DC on Rainier, IMHO. You and your party will definitely want to be dialed in with your crevasse extraction techniques. You will be quite alone on the north side of Adams that early in the season, if you stick to your spring itinerary. And now for some pros and cons of the routes you are considering... South Route While generally regarded as the most boring of all the Cascade volcano walk-ups, people still get lost, hurt, and killed on this route. Me and my buddies have hauled down all sorts of broken climbers from this route over the years. At other times, you can join in a volleyball game at the Lunch Counter or play Frisbee on the summit. Seriously! This would be my vote for your best chance of success and unbridled fun. It will be the easiest route to access the earliest, whenever that might be (June/July??). The road around to Killen Creek TH for the Adams Glacier, North Ridge, and other north side routes will be weeks behind the road to Cold Springs TH in melting out. The season for the South Route usually begins in very late May (hardier souls) to late June (the rest of us). Mazama Glacier While the Mazama may be “right next door” to the standard South Route approach, you are overlooking one major topographic feature... from about 7,500 feet to about 9,500 feet on the Mazama, you will be separated from your “bailout” to the South Route by the Devil’s Half Acre. It’s a steep cliff on climber’s left of the Mazama which, as someone new to glacier mountaineering, you would not want to have to climb and cross. The cliff is about 300-400 feet high, is made of shit rock, and effectively barricades you from accessing the South Route until you are at or even slightly above the South Route’s Lunch Counter, the standard camping area for a two-day ascent. So once you commit to the Mazama at Bird Creek Meadows, you’re essentially stuck with it until the Lunch Counter. You’ll have to deal with any crevasses you find where you find them. I would not go in there thinking that “I can always traverse over to the donkey trail.” That wouldn't be prudent... Adams Glacier, Adams Glacier Icefall, and Stormy Monday Couloir From your own description of your experience level, I would rule all of these routes out for now. The AG will be crevassed, the AG Icefall will be chunky and routefinding a bit of a test, and although the routefinding on SMC is straightforward, it’s in the same league of commitment as the others in this section. By your own accounting, I'd wait a while to get on these routes until after you've gotten more "face time" with our volcanoes. North Ridge I have never ascended this route, but have used it many times for descents from Adams Glacier, AG Icefall, N. Lyman Glacier, Lava Glacier, and Stormy Monday Couloir routes. I would not wish the ascent of this route upon my worst enemy. It is a hideous, tortuous, insufferable screefest of epic proportions, best avoided at all costs. However, if you’re into mountain goats (for whatever reason... ), they abound on this route. So with all of that, why all the jonesing for Adams? If you’re set on an early spring arrival, why not consider Mt. Hood? Lots of plusses here... The road to Timberline Lodge and the climber’s registration room is plowed year-round. You can sleep in the parking lot prior to departure to be fully rested. The approach hike is, like, 10 meters from the lot. Hood is a full 1,000 feet lower than Adams, and there is no crevasse danger whatsoever on the standard south side slog. Sure, sure, there’s the ‘schrund, but that’s easily crossed in early season or skirted on either side if it’s open and too wide to jump. You should take a serious look at Hood if your schedule can't be modified. Yes, it’s likely going to be more crowded than Adams, to be sure, but if you’ve got mid-week available to you for your climb, it’ll seem like you’re the only ones on the mountain by comparison to a weekend. You can even camp at Illumination Saddle if you’re set on camping at altitude. Good luck and climb safe. PS: Don’t glissade with your crampons on, and don’t let anybody else in your party do it either.