Off_White

Perfect Master (always wanted to do that route, now it's a deathtrap )

Thanks for the link Soulreaper, it explains so much. Yesterday I found myself driving around town muttering about Jeremy Fisher.

Stone Groove in Yosemite, November 1976. Yo yo ascent, nut placements made easier by pin scars. 3rd leader was the charm. It was hardly unheard of, and not the province of just a few elites.

Heh, Sky's musical references reminded me of the old Wierd Al tune: I'll Be Mellow When I'm Dead.

Well, for some of us who espouse a somewhat slower approach, the fact that we can't do it in a day does color our choices. I was a backpacker before I was a climber, so I've always liked that time spent out and about. Rock climbing pretty much shut down the backpacking stuff for a few years, and embracing alpine climbing was what put the two things together. Too much of the modern world is about hurry up, be productive, get it done: as if virtue belongs to the hyperactive. For me, there's just not enough idleness in my life, so I'd hate to strip it out of what I do for fun. That's not a diss to you fast folk, I understand your urges and am impressed by the speed of your outings. I can definitely see the value as part of a "training for the greater ranges" program too. What I purely don't understand is the intentional gearless bivies I've read some people undertaking. Some of my most unpleasant night's sleep has come from an unintentional bivy without gear, I couldn't imagine planning it for the sake of saving a couple pounds of sleeping bag in my pack. But hey, it takes a lot of colors to make a rainbow.

Pish CC, it's just that you're neglecting your old handle in favor of this new thing. You're pretty good too, you're just not keeping all your balls in play.

don't forget ExtremoMtnDude, I love that guy. ChrisT, if it helps, it's pronounced Hill-Air-E-Eyes. Try it in Scrabble sometime.

great post and research Jay.

Good report, shows the value of self knowledge and good decisions. I love a good story. I'm especially pleased to have your TR posted (and well received) in the wake of the fast sort, who have their own story to tell.

Okay, whatever you say. Mark, isn't it?

I don't think Ben was actually trying to be secretive in his exit, the new avatar is clearly linked to him elsewhere, but he was hoping to unveil a more circumspect side of himself. However, the cranky bits are attached to him, not some avatar, so he sounds like the same old guy. I doubt that he would be reticent to reveal his actual name if queried via PM. I don't know that most people know who you are Mr. CJZ, but again, you're not hard to find. For me it's one degree of separation, I know Kurt (AlpineK, who's really quite public behind his avatar), and Kurt knows you, so I know that you're both a real person and reachable if need be. From what I've read, I'd be surprised if you were upset about having your real name attached to your online persona. On the other hand, some folks are furious about having their real names linked to their strident online opinions. You know who you are, and I do too. This approach does tend to reduce the value of one's opinion to that of a pig fart in hell. The actual identity behind many vociferous posters is identifiable if one is a patient observer, and ultimately many of us do assume personal responsiblity for the poses we strike. I think Matt's point is that there is a difference between insider knowledge of members of the club and stepping up to say that "I'm Bill Coe (or Dave Schuldt, or Mike Layton, or David Parker, or Darin Berdinka, or Michael Stanton, etc) and this is what I think" in a manner that connects opinion with real world identity. It's easy to talk shit behind a screen that only your friends can penetrate, and quite another to fully own your own spray. This is of course offset by the entertainment offered by puppets manipulated by master sprayers like Dru or Olyclimber, whose oft unrecognized efforts hilariaze many of us. Then there's me, posting under a nickname that's perhaps more widely known in the real world than my banking name, not offering any email contact outside the confines of this board, yet hosting a weekly public event in my front yard. Not a week goes by that I don't shake my head and mutter to myself, "takes a lot of colors to make a rainbow."

Wait a minute, does this mean she shaves, but wears a merkin?

I think it's just that you're a proud nail, Rudy.

"We're A Happy Family" We're a happy family We're a happy family We're a happy family Me mom and daddy Siting here in Queens Eating refried beans We're in all the magazines Gulpin' down thorazines We ain't got no friends Our troubles never end No Christmas cards to send Daddy likes men Daddy's telling lies Baby's eating flies Mommy's on pills Baby's got the chills I'm friends with the President I'm friends with the Pope We're all making a fortune Selling Daddy's dope

Be patient youth, you'll get there. Sound and fury, signifying nothing, and all that.

Mike, the fact that the header on your post says [Re: Off White] makes me just a wee bit nervous.

Kamps looks to be paying the same amount of attention, regardless of where the bolts are. Personally, I just can't shake my old school upbringing: the leader must not fall. I've probably only taken a dozen leader falls in thirty some years -- it just doesn't feel right, and I can't let go of the idea that falling on a route is a failure. That's speaking strictly personally, I'm just fine with ya'll doing whatever, it's just about how I feel about myself.

Not to mention that YOUR inbox is overfull again, you catty bitch.

Archenemy said Those are the new North (SitOnMy)Face Easy-Access shorts. On sale for half off right now. I thought you were a randy sort, but you say that like it's a bad thing?

Don't say that about Minx, or she'll kick your ass!

Well Ben, bwrts, szy, whatever, your real world identity has not been a mystery to those in the know, but you should chastise your parents for their choice of middle names: Bill, Bob, and Tom exhibit a certain lack of imagination. I'm glad to have your voice still present, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for the kinder gentler avatar to manifest. I think the edge comes from you, not the moniker you choose. That's not a diss, btw.

Be aware that the 3/8" Rawl Bolt (now Powers Bolt due to buyout/merger) has an actual bolt diameter of 5/16" The sleeve (hence the diameter of the drilled hole) is 3/8". I don't know much about lengths in granite or rhino, but I'd think you would want one where the blue plastic collar is sandwiched in between the bottom expansion piece and an upper sleeve. I've seen some lengths where the plastic sleeve is right up at the end of the bolt, next to the washer and hex head. This would mean that the bearing surface of the bolt in the typical 3/8" hole hanger would be the plastic bit rather than the steel upper sleeve. In sandstone, my typical medium, I've tended to use 1/2x6, thinking of them not so much as bolts as rock pickets. A buddy gave me some 5/8x6, which yields a true 1/2" diameter bolt, which while very secure are a pain in the ass, since you have to bore out the hangers to accommodate the massive bolt diameter. For reference, the bolts on the bottom two pitches of Stellar Eclipse on Silver Star, in good granite, are 5/8x3 5 piece Rawl bolts. I consider that hideous overkill, even in an alpine environment, but it wasn't my call, but rather that of my belt-and-suspenders type partner.

right, because moss is beautiful.

Hah, have to do your own second ascent, eh? I know how that goes. I can't believe this route doesn't get any traffic. Nice pics, let's hear Longpause jabber and gibber about the now...

I don't think it's fair to accuse Pope of lying, the fault lies in his source of information. He just repeated hearsay that supports his bias and sense of outrage. He's hardly the only person on this board to have done that.