Fairweather

Israel can deal with it's own corruption. By many accounts, Arafat died with over $1B net worth. Money that was donated by the international community to help palestinians, not line his pockets.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9900E1D8153BF932A15752C0A9649C8B63 Published: January 21, 2002 As president, Bill Clinton labored to end the dispute between Israelis and Palestinians. Today, he came back here to bask in a warm Israeli welcome, to call on both sides to keep trying, and to place the blame for his peace initiative's failure squarely on Yasir Arafat, the Palestinian leader.

Most of those billions went into Arafat and Fatah member's private overseas bank accounts. Hamas was elected (in Gaza), basically, because they were not as corrupt as Fatah.

When I read the title to this thread, I thought it would be about the young UW History student who decided it would be fun to re live a little history on New Year's Eve.

Your regurgitation of anti-Semitic rage will, sadly, gather believers.

Remaining Israeli settlers were forcibly removed from Gaza in 2005/06 by Israel in exchange for peace. Guess it didn't work. And let's not forget the Israeli soldier kidnapped and held for over 2 years. No evidence or Hamas provocation? You're living in a whole 'nuther dimension. http://www.redorbit.com/news/general/214860/israel_moves_against_remaining_gaza_settlements/ http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/22/AR2005082200114.html

Exactly. Well said.

What's your fucking excuse? Ahh, yes. Another NAZI presents. Let's see: Prole, j_b, TTK, Fear and Greed...c'mon, I think there are a couple more in here... Fucking losers, all.

Not what I said, but Fear and Greed and TTK are. Careful who you associate with. Dude, I'm not sure where you swallowed your history, but it's waaaay off. They can if they want to. It's a free country, right? Israel basically agreed to the two-state solution brokered by Clinton--Yasser Arafat turned it down! If you're talking about "right-of-return" then it's a non-starter. Would you integrate with a group of people who--to this day--have sworn to kill you and your kind?

Bug, you seem often-reasonable, but just look at the title of this thread, and then ask yourself if you really want to be associated with the Jew-haters here.

Bullshit. Tell me when the country of "Palestine" ever existed. Offered a lasting peace they decided to continue the bloodshed. Their fault. Palestinians in the west bank (and Jordan, and elsewhere) seem to be getting along just fine--maybe because they didn't elect religiously fanatic terrorists to govern them.

You don't seem to mind the suffering of innocent Israelis. Fortunately, it looks like Obama has it right--pre election, anyway.[video:youtube]

I was wondering how long it would take our resident anti-Semites to ooze out of the woodwork. Israel has/had a right to self defense. What did they get in return for the Gaza pullout? A continuous barrage of rockets. Fuck the palestinians in Gaza. They voted in Hamas. They made their bed.

Natural climactic cycles aside, can you think of any non-atmospheric CO2 causes for this?

Take that attitude up Night N' Gale or Isodorth and see how accurate it is. Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...just let Darwin keep order please.

Aren't Jim and Prole the same two who were predicting/rejoicing over $20 gallon gas by the end of 2008? 'Nuf said.

On foot or mountain bike?

They (Dems) would be forced to hold a new election and risk losing the seat to a Republican. Additionally, Blago probably has a satchel full of mud grenades he could use to bury a lot of Democrats. I would recommend that he stay away from small aircraft for a while.

Energy savings through increasing efficiency and substitution is indeed an essential part of the equation toward sustainable energy consumption. I don't really believe in true altruism so most of my attempts aren't really out of the ordinary and were guided by finances and philosophy; most important changes needed modest investments that we are fortunate to be able to afford and are confident will eventually pay off. To tell the truth, it wasn't very hard because I have always despised most conspicuous consumption and non-durable goods. I strongly feel that quality of life is enhanced through quality and sobriety, which doesn't imply I am always sober. To be more specific yet brief, over the years we have increased the efficiency of our old house (new insulation, new windows, new appliances that I am concerned have little durability due to planned obsolescence, >90% energy efficient furnace coupled with a heat pump, for the big ticket changes). We regulate closely the temp of our home and put on a sweater before we turn up the heat, unplug electronics, etc ... In other areas, we got rid of all but one of our cars. We are left with a 35mpg, 10 years old japanese car that is shared by everyone in the household; we bike, take public transit, walk and have a zipcar membership for the times we need an extra vehicle. We try to buy local product to avoid susbidized long transport of goods, eat little red meat (once every few month perhaps) and pretty much prepare all food from scratch. Sorry, but that's not enough. And you have failed to even consider the input energy all of your replacement initiatives required. Words and feelings without real solutions amount to nothing. Based on your list I can't help but think you are more interested in building a pedestal upon which to stand and lecture others than in any real, meaningful environmental considerations. Dumb.

I don't think anyone can make the case that coal can be made 'clean', but, absent the global catastrophe j_b's dark soul yearns for daily, we aren't going to conserve our way out of that 49% chunk of pie. I don't know exactly what the solution is, but I suspect it might also represent economic salvation if the price is right--and if we get it done first.

Energy savings through increasing efficiency and substitution is indeed an essential part of the equation toward sustainable energy consumption. I don't really believe in true altruism so most of my attempts aren't really out of the ordinary and were guided by finances and philosophy; most important changes needed modest investments that we are fortunate to be able to afford and are confident will eventually pay off. To tell the truth, it wasn't very hard because I have always despised most conspicuous consumption and non-durable goods. I strongly feel that quality of life is enhanced through quality and sobriety, which doesn't imply I am always sober. To be more specific yet brief, over the years we have increased the efficiency of our old house (new insulation, new windows, new appliances that I am concerned have little durability due to planned obsolescence, >90% energy efficient furnace coupled with a heat pump, for the big ticket changes). We regulate closely the temp of our home and put on a sweater before we turn up the heat, unplug electronics, etc ... In other areas, we got rid of all but one of our cars. We are left with a 35mpg, 10 years old japanese car that is shared by everyone in the household; we bike, take public transit, walk and have a zipcar membership for the times we need an extra vehicle. We try to buy local product to avoid susbidized long transport of goods, eat little red meat (once every few month perhaps) and pretty much prepare all food from scratch. Sorry, but that's not enough. And you have failed to even consider the input energy all of your replacement initiatives required. Words and feelings without real solutions amount to nothing.

I implied no such thing, and your assumption is incorrect. What I did say was that you presented a complaint about the coal you use absent any viable alternative.

Originally written by a liberal columnist for the LA Times in May of 2007. http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-ehrenstein19mar19,0,5335087.story?coll=la-opinion-center

Even though the electricity from the Centrlaia plant was used primarily by Tacoma Public Utilities, I'm sure they also sold onto the grid that you've used your entire life. Trans Alta did this at your request. You are the rapist.

Maybe you could enlighten us all regarding the manner in which the Canadian and BC governments go about environmental impact assessments? Do they exist? Standards? Physical? Social? I honestly don't know--and I'll bet you don't either (without using your Google-Creds). Hopefully they aren't the same clusterfuck that they are down here--where small but vocal "environmental" groups speak in hushed tones to sympathetic land managers about unannounced public meetings then later claim to represent consensus.