Gun Control

[rob]

Hey Bill, I'm curious -- what do you think America should do to help reduce our high levels of gun violence?

[denalidave]

Hey Bill, I'm curious -- what do you think America should do to help reduce our high levels of gun violence?

Stricter gun registration and closing the loop holes for private sales would be a start but I think the bigger problem is addressing why our society is so obsessed with senseless killing and violence in general. I'm sure the constant barrage of glamorized killing and violence that permeates our culture has nothing to do with it. It's all because ARs are legal to buy. Personally, I think we need to take a step back and look at our society as a whole, rather than just pigeon hole all our problems on those "gun nuts". As long as we continue to glorify violence, we will continue to reap the consequences of people going postal, with, or without assault rifles and 30 round magazines. How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Then again, I'm just another uninformed idiot so maybe Bill can get it right.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

Hey Bill, I'm curious -- what do you think America should do to help reduce our high levels of gun violence?

Stricter gun registration and closing the loop holes for private sales would be a start but I think the bigger problem is addressing why our society is so obsessed with senseless killing and violence in general. I'm sure the constant barrage of glamorized killing and violence that permeates our culture has nothing to do with it. It's all because ARs are legal to buy. Personally, I think we need to take a step back and look at our society as a whole, rather than just pigeon hole all our problems on those "gun nuts". As long as we continue to glorify violence, we will continue to reap the consequences of people going postal, with, or without assault rifles and 30 round magazines. How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Then again, I'm just another uninformed idiot so maybe Bill can get it right.

 

Perhaps we could all emulate TTK's style of treating people. That would make a much better society, don't you think?

 

[denalidave]

Hey Bill, I'm curious -- what do you think America should do to help reduce our high levels of gun violence?

Stricter gun registration and closing the loop holes for private sales would be a start but I think the bigger problem is addressing why our society is so obsessed with senseless killing and violence in general. I'm sure the constant barrage of glamorized killing and violence that permeates our culture has nothing to do with it. It's all because ARs are legal to buy. Personally, I think we need to take a step back and look at our society as a whole, rather than just pigeon hole all our problems on those "gun nuts". As long as we continue to glorify violence, we will continue to reap the consequences of people going postal, with, or without assault rifles and 30 round magazines. How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Then again, I'm just another uninformed idiot so maybe Bill can get it right.

 

Perhaps we could all emulate TTK's style of treating people. That would make a much better society, don't you think?

Ya mean, belittle and demean any and everyone who does not agree with his trashmagesty? Let's all take a bow to THE KING OF THE ASSCANDLES. We're not worthy!!!

[pink]

Hey Bill, I'm curious -- what do you think America should do to help reduce our high levels of gun violence?

Stricter gun registration and closing the loop holes for private sales would be a start but I think the bigger problem is addressing why our society is so obsessed with senseless killing and violence in general. I'm sure the constant barrage of glamorized killing and violence that permeates our culture has nothing to do with it. It's all because ARs are legal to buy. Personally, I think we need to take a step back and look at our society as a whole, rather than just pigeon hole all our problems on those "gun nuts". As long as we continue to glorify violence, we will continue to reap the consequences of people going postal, with, or without assault rifles and 30 round magazines. How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Then again, I'm just another uninformed idiot so maybe Bill can get it right.

 

Perhaps we could all emulate TTK's style of treating people. That would make a much better society, don't you think?

 

[tvashtarkatena]

When you're done with USA Today and want some peer reviewed studies on gun violence:

 

Harvard School of Public Health studies on gun violence

 

No matter how you slice it, more guns = more violence.

 

Not hard.

[KaskadskyjKozak]

 

Ya mean, belittle and demean any and everyone who does not agree with his trashmagesty?

 

Yeah. Research proves that treating people like shit makes them less prone to going postal and going on a murder spree.

Right?

 

 

[rob]

How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Excellent points. But do you think people in Europe are not bullied and humiliated at a young age like they are in America? I think you're right that Americans in general are fairly selfish.

 

Do you think part of the problem may be the dumbing down of Americans? Hardly anyone reads anymore, and video media has become nothing more than short snippets, tiny sound bites, and almost zero in-depth analytic analysis. There is almost no context to anything anymore, and Americans are becoming woefully under-educated about even their own country's history and lack context for current events. America has a severe anti-intellectual problem -- I suspect a well-educated and enlightened citizenry would be less likely to shoot each other up.

 

I wonder how much TV Europeans watch compared to Americans?

[tvashtarkatena]

Don't sell yourself short, KKK. I only treat dumbshits like you with a wire brush. You kinda beg for it, and I like to oblige because I do love the language.

 

The vast majority of people in my life are smart and cool, however. It's a choice.

 

Mostly, though, I've provided sound journalism and science to support my arguments with a sprinkling of recreational embellishment as befits the general civility of this forum. Now, I realize practically no one's going to actually read any of it, but I've aggregated it for my own benefit. Linking it here is just for fun.

 

As a former Catholic, the title Pontif is a natural compliment.

 

 

Edited February 6, 2013 by tvashtarkatena

[JayB]

How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Excellent points. But do you think people in Europe are not bullied and humiliated at a young age like they are in America? I think you're right that Americans in general are fairly selfish.

 

Do you think part of the problem may be the dumbing down of Americans? Hardly anyone reads anymore, and video media has become nothing more than short snippets, tiny sound bites, and almost zero in-depth analytic analysis. There is almost no context to anything anymore, and Americans are becoming woefully under-educated about even their own country's history and lack context for current events. America has a severe anti-intellectual problem -- I suspect a well-educated and enlightened citizenry would be less likely to shoot each other up.

 

I wonder how much TV Europeans watch compared to Americans?

 

How do you personally reconcile the speculation above with the data below?

 

 

 

 

"Contrary to common perceptions, today both property and violent crimes (with the exception of homicides) are more widespread in Europe than in the US, while the opposite was true thirty years ago. We label this fact as the "reversal of misfortunes". We investigate what accounts for the reversal by studying the causal impact of demographic changes, incarceration, abortion, unemployment and immigration on crime. For this we use time series data (1970-2008) from seven European countries and the U.S. We find that the demographic structure of the population and the incarceration rate are important determinants of crime. Our results suggest that a tougher incarceration policy may be an effective way to contrast crime in Europe. Our analysis does not provide information on how incarceration policy should be made tougher nor does it provide an answer to the question whether a such a policy would also be efficient from a cost-benefit point of view. We leave this to future research"

http://www2.dse.unibo.it/zanella/papers/crime-EP.pdf

[denalidave]

How many of these nut jobs committing these attrocities were bullied and humiliated at a very young age? Alienating them from society because they don't "fit in". I think we, as mericans, are the most selfish and self serving people on the planet and we will continue down this destructive path so long as our hearts and minds are bowing to the blood sports that abound.

 

Excellent points. But do you think people in Europe are not bullied and humiliated at a young age like they are in America? I think you're right that Americans in general are fairly selfish.

 

Do you think part of the problem may be the dumbing down of Americans? Hardly anyone reads anymore, and video media has become nothing more than short snippets, tiny sound bites, and almost zero in-depth analytic analysis. There is almost no context to anything anymore, and Americans are becoming woefully under-educated about even their own country's history and lack context for current events. America has a severe anti-intellectual problem -- I suspect a well-educated and enlightened citizenry would be less likely to shoot each other up.

 

I wonder how much TV Europeans watch compared to Americans?

I think the whole blame it on guns is a scapegoat for the bigger issues of how f'd up our society is and how selfish our priorities have become. I'm not against stricter gun regulations but that is merely a band aid to keep guns away from the nut jobs. Unfortunately, there are already so many guns available it will be little more than putting a finger in the dam to keep the water from flooding us. Wouldn't it be more productive to get to the source of the reasons for so many nut jobs instead of focusing on the weapons they pick up?

[tvashtarkatena]

LOL. Look, 5% or so of the population of any society exhibits some level of psychopathy. Here, elsewhere, 10,000 years ago, today. If we had gasoline running in our rivers the whole place would be on fire, but instead we're awash in guns.

 

In addition, we've got the most productive violence creation machine on the planet - the War on Drugs. Primary supply nations suffer the most - Colombia, Mexico, but we've got our share of bang bang because of it.

 

We were the last 'civilized' nation to ban slavery. We fought a really, really violent civil war over it. That has left its cultural mark - an anti intellectual, hyper religious, and pro gun culture that has remained remarkably steadfast...until the Innernutz and its liquidity of information - particularly in the form of conversations just like this one, came along. Ignorance is becoming scarcer, and IQs are actually going up pretty fast. Bye bye, gun totin' Jebus.

 

It's not about TV. That's a fucking side show brought to you by the GOP with its mouth firmly secured around the NRA's gun selling cock. Yes, there are copy cats due to new media - there were in the days of print, too, but per capita gun violence, particular gun murders, is about what it was in the '50s. Prior to that, America was even MORE violent than it is today. The 1800s, a gun nutz paradise, was super violent. So save the 'video games must be the culprit' bullshit. The culprit is guns. Lots and lots of readily available to just about anyone guns.

 

There seems to have been a rash of mass gun murders lately. Whether that's a trend or not is an unresolved question, but the most lethal mass school murder in US history took place in...wait for it, 1924. This is a problem we've had long before TV and Grand Theft Auto.

 

My GF and I love Deadwood, the Wire, and a host of other violent (but well written and acted) TV. That hasn't exactly lead to us eating babies raw (Personally, I'd stuff and roast). Seriously, come fucking on.

 

If 'life of the mind violence' drove real life violence, there'd be no one left in Japan save a few teenage rape victims who got away. Ever read Japanese Manga? Do you guys ever go anywhere outside this country ever? That shit is beyond violent with a healthy side of kiddy porn - yet Japan remains one of the least violent societies on the planet.

 

Oh, and they love their video games, too.

 

The people who drive America's high levels of gun violence are folks like you, DD and Billcoe. Good little citizens who continue to believe that more guns = less violence and vote accordingly. People who purchase guns and thus keep the NRA and gun makers in business. You, yes you, are the faithful stewards of America's gun culture, with all its lies and tragic consequences. By supporting the gun industry with your dollars, you're like the shitheel LA dentist who enjoys tootin' the nose candy, never giving a thought about the chain of misery, from Colombia, through Mexico, through East LA, coke dollars perpetuate.

 

So don't look into your flatscreen for who's responsible - look in the mirror, assholes.

Edited February 6, 2013 by tvashtarkatena

[glassgowkiss]

Like someone said: " grow a pair". You don't need a gun to stop a psycho:

 

[video:youtube]4Y7i1ASCS5o

[denalidave]

I NEVER said more guns is the answer. I said banning certain guns won't get rid of the nut jobs. I don't own any AR type guns as I don't need one. I do own a few fire arms and will likely keep them forever. Fuck you too, asshole!

[tvashtarkatena]

Oh, and I can tell you from travelling to 35 countries that America isn't really any more 'selfish' than any place else. Yes, we consume more - as would India if they had the per capita bucks and largest imperial military the world has ever seen.

 

The world's most generous folks, IMO? Mexicans. Also one of the world's most violent. So much for that stupid theory. Mostly, I've been treated right when abroad no matter pretty much everywhere I've gone.

 

So keep making up stupid theories to obfuscate what we've known for decades, gun nutz.

 

Keep that love going as long as you can.

[denalidave]

Oh, and I can tell you from travelling to 35 countries that America isn't really any more 'selfish' than any place else. Yes, we consume more - as would India if they had the per capita bucks and largest imperial military the world has ever seen.

 

The world's most generous folks, IMO? Mexicans. Also one of the world's most violent. So much for that stupid theory. Mostly, I've been treated right when abroad no matter pretty much everywhere I've gone.

 

So keep making up stupid theories to obfuscate what we've known for decades, gun nutz.

 

Keep that love going as long as you can.

Once again, you KNOW it ALL don't cha. What a fucking douche bag.

 

I'm asking a question of how should we address the nut jobs, besides just new gun laws... I don't claim to know shit. Other than I can spot a fuk'n tool like you a mile a way. Your own sense of grandiosity is quite hilarious. You really do have a god complex, don't cha??? fuk'n tool!

[tvashtarkatena]

A Desert Eagle AND 44 magnum?

 

Holy shit you penis must be nonexistent, DD. When you bought them, did you think, even for a nanosecond, about the companies you were supporting and what they lobby for?

 

Nope. I would guess that thought's never even crossed your tiny walnut of a mind.

 

And when you're tired of them, you'll sell them - perpetuating the whole shit show. Destroy them? No, that thought wouldn't inch its way into the walnut either, would it?

 

If some meth head doesn't grab em first when you're not at home, that is.

 

 

Edited February 6, 2013 by tvashtarkatena

[glassgowkiss]

I NEVER said more guns is the answer. I said banning certain guns won't get rid of the nut jobs. I don't own any AR type guns as I don't need one. I do own a few fire arms and will likely keep them forever. Fuck you too, asshole!

It doesn't matter what you say, it matters what you do. Fact of the matter is you oppose regulation and support financially a death industry. You can spin it whichever way you like, but simple statement was already describing it: T-A=0

[JayB]

[denalidave]

A Desert Eagle AND 44 magnum?

 

Holy shit you penis must be nonexistent, DD. When you bought them, did you think, even for a nanosecond, about the companies you were supporting and what they lobby for?

 

Nope. I would guess that thought's never even crossed your tiny walnut of a mind.

 

Hmm, let me think about that one. I never bought any guns, rather I inherited them as a child. So, I guess now your calling my Dad a fucking asshole too. Fuck you, prick. I'm normally very respectful of people here but you are just so fucking full of yourself I can't help but flick a bugger your way. Once again, you don't know diddle squat about me or my beliefs. Keep on thinking your god, a legend in your own mind. What a dick.

 

As a matter of fact, the 44 mag that my dad bought when he was stationed in Alaska was for the weekends he would spend out in the bush fishing for days on end. Ya know, just in case a big old grizzly bear decided to eat him. He never needed it for that. However, there was the time before I was born and he was driving the family down some remote highway in Alaska when some "nut jobs" tried running the family wagon off the road for some sort of car jacking. Good thing the old Back Hawk was handy... The story goes that he got it about half way out the holster when the would be bad guys decided to move on down the road to find an easier victim. So yeah, guns can protect people too. Never owned a desert eagle.

[tvashtarkatena]

Supporting a death industry.

 

I think we've struck a meme, here. Not just a FB meme - this, more than anything, lies at the heart of why America continues to enjoy high levels of gun violence - law abiding, 'responsible' gun owners who vote at the ballot and with their dollars to keep the love going...and going...and going...

 

Thank you, DD and Billcoe, for showing off your extensive gun collections, and thus your committed level of support for Columbine, Newtown, the shooting at MRNP....

 

Welcome to the New Age of Real Personal Responsibility and 7 billion people, where your actions really do affect people far away who you'll never meet.

Edited February 6, 2013 by tvashtarkatena

[denalidave]

I NEVER said more guns is the answer. I said banning certain guns won't get rid of the nut jobs. I don't own any AR type guns as I don't need one. I do own a few fire arms and will likely keep them forever. Fuck you too, asshole!

It doesn't matter what you say, it matters what you do. Fact of the matter is you oppose regulation and support financially a death industry. You can spin it whichever way you like, but simple statement was already describing it: T-A=0

Again, twist my words to make me the bad guy. Did you not read I SUPPORT stricter gun regulations? I am simply stating we need to look beyond just banning certain guns and dig deeper into why people end up going postal, more so here than other "civilized" countries. I'm not immune to changing my mind on any given subject. I'm simply asking, what is the deeper issue we need to solve here?...

[tvashtarkatena]

A Desert Eagle AND 44 magnum?

 

Holy shit you penis must be nonexistent, DD. When you bought them, did you think, even for a nanosecond, about the companies you were supporting and what they lobby for?

 

Nope. I would guess that thought's never even crossed your tiny walnut of a mind.

 

Hmm, let me think about that one. I never bought any guns, rather I inherited them as a child. So, I guess now your calling my Dad a fucking asshole too. Fuck you, prick. I'm normally very respectful of people here but you are just so fucking full of yourself I can't help but flick a bugger your way. Once again, you don't know diddle squat about me or my beliefs. Keep on thinking your god, a legend in your own mind. What a dick.

 

As a matter of fact, the 44 mag that my dad bought when he was stationed in Alaska was for the weekends he would spend out in the bush fishing for days on end. Ya know, just in case a big old grizzly bear decided to eat him. He never needed it for that. However, there was the time before I was born and he was driving the family down some remote highway in Alaska when some "nut jobs" tried running the family wagon off the road for some sort of car jacking. Good thing the old Back Hawk was handy... The story goes that he got it about half way out the holster when the would be bad guys decided to move on down the road to find an easier victim. So yeah, guns can protect people too. Never owned a desert eagle.

 

Hiding behind Dear Old Dad, huh? What, he gave you a lifetime supply of ammo, too?

 

Talk to me when those weapons have been destroyed and thus taken out of circulation. Instead of (attempting to) teach your kids to perpetuate the problem, you know?

 

 

Edited February 6, 2013 by tvashtarkatena

[denalidave]

A Desert Eagle AND 44 magnum?

 

Holy shit you penis must be nonexistent, DD. When you bought them, did you think, even for a nanosecond, about the companies you were supporting and what they lobby for?

 

Nope. I would guess that thought's never even crossed your tiny walnut of a mind.

So, by that logic, your little bag o weed supports narco terrorists in Mexico. Of course, you have never bought a baggy that came anywhere but from the local peace and love hippy down on the corner. Your pot habit supports narco terrorists, your just as much a part of the problem as as the guys making and selling guns to the drug traffickers that bring you pot.

[denalidave]

A Desert Eagle AND 44 magnum?

 

Holy shit you penis must be nonexistent, DD. When you bought them, did you think, even for a nanosecond, about the companies you were supporting and what they lobby for?

 

Nope. I would guess that thought's never even crossed your tiny walnut of a mind.

 

Hmm, let me think about that one. I never bought any guns, rather I inherited them as a child. So, I guess now your calling my Dad a fucking asshole too. Fuck you, prick. I'm normally very respectful of people here but you are just so fucking full of yourself I can't help but flick a bugger your way. Once again, you don't know diddle squat about me or my beliefs. Keep on thinking your god, a legend in your own mind. What a dick.

 

As a matter of fact, the 44 mag that my dad bought when he was stationed in Alaska was for the weekends he would spend out in the bush fishing for days on end. Ya know, just in case a big old grizzly bear decided to eat him. He never needed it for that. However, there was the time before I was born and he was driving the family down some remote highway in Alaska when some "nut jobs" tried running the family wagon off the road for some sort of car jacking. Good thing the old Back Hawk was handy... The story goes that he got it about half way out the holster when the would be bad guys decided to move on down the road to find an easier victim. So yeah, guns can protect people too. Never owned a desert eagle.

 

Hiding behind Dear Old Dad, huh? What, he gave you a lifetime supply of ammo, too?

 

Talk to me when those weapons have been destroyed and thus taken out of circulation. Instead of (attempting to) teach your kids to perpetuate the problem, you know?

 

I don't hide from pussies like you.