Mt. Erie rock climbing access at risk

[Waydough]

***The ACFL Board meeting is tonight at 7:00 pm (see below for details). They are not recording the meeting, so comments need to be provided in writing if you want them to be kept by the city for consideration.

 

The city is now saying that they will also receive comments at the May 1 ACFL Board meeting.

 

Access to hiking trails and rock climbing routes on Mt. Erie (near Anacortes- WA) is going to be shut down, if the governing authority has its way. A small group of people is making plans to change how this area and others in the Anacortes City Forest Lands (ACFL) are managed. The only way to change this is by attending the April 3rd 7:00 pm ACFL Board meeting at the Fidalgo/Senior Center at 1701 22nd Street in Anacortes. This is the primary public meeting scheduled before the public comment period is over April 30 and before the draft plan is passed on to the Planning Dept. Attendance at this meeting by as many supporters and concerned citizens is crucial to show that local residents care about their continued access to this area. This process has been moving forward rather quickly with little public notification to date. I hope at least 100 people citizens attend and make their concerns known! See skagit alpine club web site skagitalpineclub.com for more info later today (Saturday) we hope. If anyone can help me figure out how to do an attached document I'll provide my two-page writeup that contains a better overview of the issue.

 

The Access Fund has been contacted for help with ideas on how to fight for access rights. Most local climbers and hikers/scramblers who would be interested in this issue probably do not know about the concern. I and a few others are trying to get the word out. Climbers have not been recognized as a user group in the city park system (Anacortes City Forest Lands) and need to be soon, otherwise our interests will be ignored.

 

Page 16 of the draft plan: "Existing scramble trails will be reviewed for approval or removal by the Forest Advisory Board. Climbing routes need approval from the Forest Advisory Board before construction." This may not sound scary unless you know understand two points: 1.) The ACFL Board and forest land manager want to change the primary purpose or goal of the ACFL from recreation use (today) to resource conservation (draft plan), and 2.) All trails not on the official ACFL trails map are considered illegal, off limits, and use of them is punishable by fine and jail time. ALL trails used to access ALL rock climbing routes and the routes themselves on Mt. Erie are, by the proposed definition, "illegal" trails, even though some have been in use for 40 or more years. Also, the Board and manager do not use nor understand the use of Mt.Erie for rock climbing and hiking.

 

Write the Parks Dept. manager Gary Robinson at gary@cityofanacortes.org if you are interested in Mt. Erie remaining a great place to climb in the future.

 

For questions please feel free to contact me (Wade) at bessettw@hotmail.com.

Edited April 3, 2008 by Waydough

[Trent]

I'll be there! Beers on me at the Brown afterward!

[olyclimber]

wow that would suck. i've had some fun times up there.

 

let me know if you don't hear from the A.F.

The WCC may also be able to help.

[jordansahls]

This is shitty! Someone call Dallas Kloke!

[Alpine_Tom]

Well, gosh, Mt. Erie being such an pristine gem of untrammelled wilderness I guess it makes sense. Imagine how much the experience of those who drive to the top to take photographs will be conserved. Plus, parking will be improved if those tiresome smelly climbers aren't taking up spots.

 

[octopuswithafez]

Hopefully the Mounties are on this as well, that's one of their main training field trips...

[fenderfour]

Boealps has been informed. We will be looking to send a few people to support.

[Joe_Poulton]

I can't be there, but i'm going to do some serious writing!

[mattp]

I hope to attend.

 

April 3rd 7:00 pm

ACFL Board meeting at the Fidalgo/Senior Center

at 1701 22nd Street in Anacortes. This is the primary public meeting scheduled before the public comment period is over April 30

[dmuja]

 

I sent a concise email to the ad listed above - hope it helps.

 

In this case, losing access to this area would be bad and really a loss for the climbing "heritage" of the state I think. Also it's in a rain shadow which is no small aspect to consider for climbers in western wa. And I must admit, although it is purty and has great views etc, its really more like climbing in a city park and thus I would not consider it a pristine wilderness per se. All in all, it doesn't make much sense to me to ban climbing there.

 

 

[mattp]

I spoke with a staff person with the City of Anacortes today. He says that some of the information posted here may be inaccurate in that there are no specific plans for the trails on Mount Erie at this time. It IS in their general plan, he says, to reduce trails and they MAY decide to reduce or reroute some of the trails on the south slope of Mt. Erie. However, he says, most of their management concerns have had to do with large instructional groups and recreational climbers are likely to see little change -- though he certainly indicated that nothing is certain at this point as the process is still under way.

 

Climbers are invited to attend the meeting this Thursday, and also to view the draft plan on the City of Anacortes website.

Anacortes Parks

 

I posted a little bit of information on the Washington Climbers Coalition site this afternoon. It is linked on the climbing area profile for Mount Erie.

Washington Climbers Coalition

 

[Maestro]

I sent a concise email to the ad listed above - hope it helps.

So did I, but I got a reply asking me to verify my e-mail address and when I tried to do that, it was refused and bounced back. Did anyone else have this problem? I don't think the City of Anacortes wants to hear from us!

[mattp]

I had no trouble confirming my email address and the guy replied to me.

[Maestro]

Hmmm, I tried to confirm twice and it came back both times. Maybe I've got cooties or something. I'll have to try again tomorrow. Meantime, what did he say?

[mattp]

I posted notes from my phone conversation on the WCC website. The guy at Anacortes parks responded to my e-mail to indicate my notes were "accurate."

 

My take-away is that there is potential for the kind of loss of access that started this thread, but it is not clear that is really a threat at this point. Climbers should get involved to make sure that our concerns are addressed in the planning process. As posted above, this week's meeting may be your best chance to participate though there may be other ways to comment or influence events.

 

A recent telephone call to John Lundsford, staff member at Anacortes Parks and Recreation, indicated that there may be some misinformation concerning the City's plans for Mt. Erie floating about and he indicated that there was thus far no specific plan to close any of the cliffs at Mount Erie though they do intend to undertake some management efforts that may include closing or moving certain trails.

 

Lundsford said that, historically, they have not done much in the way of management of climbing at Mount Erie but that they have received complaints, chiefly related to the use of the area by large instructional groups but also relating to trails, trash, erosion, and other climber-related impacts. These complaints have come from climbers as much as they have from non climbers. There is a working group that is going to contribute to the new plan, and there are some climbers in that working group. Lundsford did not comment on whether there may be some people in the community, the working group, or within City government who may wish to take a more restrictive approach toward management of rock climbing at Mount Erie in the future.

 

We at the Washington Climbers Coalition do not know much about the plannng process, but we generally support climbers who wish to get involved in discussions such as the current discussion over a management plan for Anacortes forest lands, including Mount Erie. We have enjoyed climbing there for decades, and hope to continue doing so.

 

For more information:

Anacortes Community Forest Lands

Copy of draft plan for download

 

Upcoming Meeting

The Forest Advisory Board, an advisory board to the City Council on use policies and management of the Anacortes City Forest Lands, meets the first Thursday of every month at 7:00 p.m. at the Fidalgo Center (1701 22nd Street). On Thursday, April 3, 2008, the new Forest Management Plan is on the agenda. Those interested in the matter are invited to attend.

[woodchips]

The few times I've climbed there, it's been pretty frustrating trying to find your way around. I'm sure this is a big part of the problem down there as people create "social trails" just stomping around trying to find various climbs. I think posting some signs and maps would go a along way towards remedying this. Also, the Kloke guidebook is not all that helpful to new climbers trying to locate stuff.

 

I plan on attending the meeting and suggesting that the City work with climbers to create some signs and maps.

 

 

[Joe_Poulton]

As far as being organized I like the idea of the last post to have maps and direction...but the reason I truly enjoy Erie is for the reason that their are no signs and no set trails. It adds to the adventure. My favorite climb their in my memory is the Snag Buttress primarly due to the fact that getting there is part of the fun. It's like bananna peel at Squamish. However, since the palce does get a lot of traffic control of the erosion is necessary.

[Alpine_Tom]

After my smart-ass comment above, it occurred to me that an issue for them might be a problem with kids using it as a place to hang out and drink, etc, and the parks folks wanting to control that, more than wanting to screw the climbers, who probably bring a fair amount of business (going into town for beers afterwards, etc.)

[rodeoclimber2]

FYI - Seattle Mounties gave up trying to jump through all the hoops placed by Anancortes Parks. We reorgainized our course to small groups of 10-12 and less than half the total class size of past years in part to appease Anacortes Parks. All to basically no avail. Every time we would figure out how to play their game, they would come up with a new set of rules - and they don't apply to everyone - mostly to high profile groups so far. So.....Leavenworth will be even more crowded than before. Even if you don't use Erie - this issue affects you.......

[Waydough]

I'm the one who started this post and just wanted to comment on what's been said here (everyone's comments) and add a few things.

 

For starters, I've been giving my perspective in writing because I expect to be held accountable for what I say. It is my feeling that the ACFL Board and land manager has not been as open with their ideas and intentions. All I care about with this issue is that the existing trails and rockclimbing routes on Mt. Erie remain available for recreational and instructional use in a reasonable manner.

 

Poster "mattp" commented about his discussion with an staff person for the Parks department. I assume this is Jonn Lundsford, the ACFL forest lands manager.

 

Jonn's comment that "...some of the information posted here may be inaccurate in that there are no specific plans for the trails on Mount Erie at this time." is interesting. It is easy to accuse someone of doing something wrong or lying, but the accusation is empty without saying what is wrong or what lie is said. The draft plan, existing 1991 plan, my volunteer time on the ACFL Mt.Erie working group at the request of the Board, and the several Board meetings I've attended have given me solid reason to expect that the Board and land manager plan to make a huge reduction to hiking and climbing on Mt. Erie. I'm not stupid and neither are they. They would likely throw a few bones in the form of a few high use climbiing walls and then "not approve" of the 85% of the other trails and rock climbing routes, like the upper wall, powerline wall, sunset slabs, and a few routes on snag Buttress. I think that

 

Jonn's comment that "It IS in their general plan, he says, to reduce trails and they MAY decide to reduce or reroute some of the trails on the south slope of Mt. Erie" is a primary issue and a good example of how the Board and land manager (Jonn) have described their plan for Mt. Erie. What's not clear from this statement is how far they will go and who makes those decisions. Neither the Board or Jonn use or are familiar with Mt.Erie. The Board members have no interests and for the most part capablility of even accessing this area. I will be proposing that the Board forms a Mt. Erie trails and rock climbing committee whose purpose is to address public concerns about this area and makes recommendations back to the Board. Mt. Erie has been develop slowly over the last 40 years by scramblers and rock climbers. Those who know and love this area are in the best position and have the strongest interests to protect it for themselves and others in the future.

 

Jonn's comment that "most of their management concerns have had to do with large instructional groups and recreational climbers are likely to see little change" is interesting. So, if that was the primary issue and they have resolved it by essentially banning groups from use due to the difficulty in getting approved through their "process", and since the Anacortes citizens do not want any change to the management of the ACFL (lack of public complaints to the city and also data directly from the September 2007 Parks department community telephone survey of 300 Anacortes households), they why do they feel they need to do anything? They, the Board and the land manager, are following their own desires, not the public's. They want to impose their desires on the ACFL, including Mt. Erie, and I don't think their desires are reasonable.

 

Mattp states that "though he certainly indicated that nothing is certain at this point as the process is still under way" is an important one. Right now is the time to assure that Mt. Erie remains open in entirety (current trails, scramble routes, and rock routes) and that any changes to be made are based on the community's desires and knowledge from those who know the area best. Yes, there is a chance that no major negative actions (the reduction of existing trails and routes) if people are silent and ask for nothing. But, I think that chance is slim and that big changes are in store and people who try to climb on Mt. Erie in the near and far futures will be the losers in this management plan if left alone to the Board and land manager now. Once lost, a thing like a climbing area, trails, or even individual walls/routes will be very hard or impossible to regain.

 

I'll be at the meeting and make my issues known. A few of you have emailed me directly with questions or comments. Several of you and many others I know have already written Gary (Parks department director; gary@cityofanacortes.org) to state your concerns - thank you for doing this.

 

Once the meeting is done I'll try to sum it up for CC's by Saturday night.

 

Wade

[Waydough]

Update:

 

The ACFL Board meeting last Thursday was well attended by supporters of keeping access open to rock climbing and scrambling routes on Mt. Erie About 70 members of the public attended, and 14 of those spoke out in support of this access issue. A person from the BoAlps and and another from the Washington Alpine Club were there and provided verbal comment (thanks guys!).

 

The ACFL Board, ACFL forest manager (Jonn), and Parks Director (Gary) say that they don't understand what this "Mt. Erie access" concern is based on. They have said that they don't have any plans to "eliminate" climbing on Mt. Erie. That's great, but it's important that the management plan states it in writing so that it guides the forest manager and Board on appropriate management of Mt. Erie in the near and far future. They are now reviewing the draft 2008 ACFL Management Plan language more closely to determine what the problem is (from the climber and scrambler perspective) and what could be changed (that's good). It is very important that they receive written comments that describe the problems with the specific pieces of language in the draft plan that make it a concern to people who like to rock climb and scramble on Mt. Erie. I'm up to over 4 pages of comments at the moment and will be submitting mine to the Parks Director and ACFL Board by the end of the week. I'll also provid it to CascadeClimbers.com and other groups (mattp) and anyone is free to read and use them. I hope that my comments will give some of you out there more solid understanding of why I began this forum topic. I hope that many people make specific written comments to give them some concrete understand and direction about the problem with this draft plan.

 

The ACFL Board and Parks Director needs comments in writing as soon as possible, but not later than April 30. The Board decided to allow more comments in person at their next meeting May 1.

 

If you have any questions for me please feel free to pm me (personal message, right?) Or just email me directly at bessettw@hotmaildotcom. Thanks!