New Oregon Access Fund Rep?

[elaine]

I made this decision several months ago, and I was feeling that it was time to hand over the reigns to someone else.

 

Since May of 2003, I have been a Volunteer Regional Coordinator for the Access Fund here in Oregon. I've met many amazing folks along the way, and I have appreciated the support that so many of you have given me.

 

However, I am not leaving the world and the work of the Access Fund entirely. I've already talked with Keith Daellenbach ( Madrone Wall Pres. Committee) about staying on board and seeing that through for the long haul. I think there are other ways that I can be involved within the Portland and Oregon climbing communities.....More to come.

 

It is my intention to stay on until May 3, 2008. This is the date of the Annual Spring Thing at Smith Rock State Park.

I will do my best to recruit and help to find someone else. If anyone out there is interested in volunteering for the Access Fund, read below, or feel free to contact me through a PM.

 

I assume that Tony Holmes will still be a RC, and act as the Mt Hood and Columbia River Gorge liaison to the Access Fund.

 

Many thanks again to those that have supported me and who have been a resource. To those that doubted me, were nay-sayers, or said I had no business in this role, I hope you'll be a little kinder and a little less condescending to any new Regional Coordinator that steps up.

I've volunteered ( and will continue to volunteer) because of my love for climbing. The Access Fund has never paid me a dime (or a penny) for what I've done and. The thanks and support from many of you has been my reward.

 

See you all soon!

Warm Regards,

Kellie Rice

 

 

 

 

 

For anyone that is interested in volunteering for the Access Fund-

There actually is an application process with the Access Fund. I'll provide you with the contact information. They want to see commitment with their volunteers. I will also be willing to stay on as a mentor, providing the new RC('s) with contact info, the "how to's", "who to's", and the like.

 

I feel that more than one or two peopleare needed to deal with issues in the state of Oregon. I was handling a good chunk of the issues and events in the Portland area ( Rocky Butte, Madrone, Banff, climbing gym events, etc), down through the Willamette Valley and I-5 into Corvallis and Eugene, Roseburg, Medford, Ashland, Kalmath Falls in Southern Oregon, as well as events and issues in Central Oregon. I was also a contact point for others in Eastern Oregon.

 

I would welcome anyone from any region of the state to volunteer. Dividing up the region is something that the main Access Fund office in Colorado is willing to do.

 

Feel free to contact me!!

 

 

 

 

[billcoe]

Kellie, I have seen people who don't do a f*ing thing but complain. They try and tear down and bitch at those who are trying to be productive and work for something positive.

 

Speaking for myself, we should all step up: congratulate and support great folks like you who are trying to be positive and productive, and shun those who's sole contribution is to piss, moan and backbite those who are actually involved.

 

Thank you so much for your hard work, endless thankless hours and for everything you have done for all of us.

 

I hope they find someone half as committed and capable as you have proven yourself to be. You've been a great asset for the Access Fund. Good luck, and hope I see lots more of you in the future now that you will have more time to climb.

 

[kevbone]

I agree with Bill…..thanks for all your work Kellie! You will be missed.

[hemp22]

I agree too. We all owe a substantial debt of gratitude to you Kellie, and you'll be leaving a large pair of shoes to fill for anyone with the guts to take on that role.

 

Divvying up the state a little more does seem like a good idea. The Portland area is so far removed from the southern oregon crags, it'd seem overwhelming to try to tackle all of that. But you did so admirably.

 

So....now does this mean you'll have more time to get out climbing with us this summer?

[elaine]

Thanks, guys.

 

I learned that there was people that I would never reach about the work that the Access Fund does. Some people think that the Access Fund is pro bolts, and that was my intention in this position. It's always been completely the opposite with the AF's stand on bolts. I've never drilled a bolt in my life, nor do I plan to. The AF does not get involved in bolt wars. They support fixed pro for safety purposes, but they leave the "how" to the local climbers.

 

Hopefully this means some more climbing, but again, I'm not leaving the world and the work of the Access Fund entirely.....I've got something stirring in my brain

 

Much love!

Kellie

[Squall]

Thanks for the info guys

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

__________________________

Any new rock climbing techniques?? Share Share

 

[JosephH]

Speaking for "some people", when the AF's stated position is strictly in support of proportional representation, and the vast majority of locals are sport climbers, then by definition and intent the result is a 'tyranny of democracy' in the management local trad areas.

 

This AF stance was vocally stated on more than one occasion, by more than one AF rep, and to my knowledge has not waivered. That may work fine for Smith, Broughton, Ozone, and any of a host of other areas in the region, but it explicitly does not and will not work for Beacon. Pushing through such a generic policy at Beacon would be the equivalent of starting a bolt war without ever drilling a bolt oneself.

 

I've personally never doubted you, been a 'naysayer', and certainly never said or implied you shouldn't be in the role. Quite the contrary, I think you've done a great job in Oregon representing the interests of Oregon climbers. Believe me, I do understand Beacon is a difficult situation all the way around both in terms of it being in Washington and due to the keen mistrust and disinterest Beacon-locals have all things organized. Sorry we've not seen eye-to-eye on those matters, but as you say, sometimes you can't be all things to all people and you just have to do your best - even under difficult circumstances.

 

I think we've each been trying hard in that regard, we've both been volunteering our time and resources, and the stumbling block to my mind is entirely one of a clear policy divide and in no way personal.

[JayB]

Self-nomination for AF coordinator at Beacon....

[elaine]

You all can read the Access Fund's position statement on bolts and fixed protection at

 

http://www.accessfund.org/advo/stand.php

 

So Joseph, it seems to me that the issue that you have with bolting at Beacon Rock ( or maybe bolting in general) is really not an Access Fund issue, but an ethics issue. The Access Fund organization will never take a position on a specific area, and whether it will have bolts or not. If former or current Access Fund reps want to drill bolts, their actions as a route developer will be subject to the criticism or support from the people that use that area.

 

If anyone ever wishes to discuss the Access Fund's stand on anything, my personal contact info is for public viewing on the Access Fund's website.

 

Kellie Rice

Access Fund RC- Oregon

971-235-6169

[marcus]

Thanks for all the hard work, Kellie! As we all can see, working towards organizing climbers and their myriad voices into a cohesive lobby is no easy task. I for one appreciate that you have stepped forward to fill this challenging role for us as long as you have.

See ya at the crags!

[Raindawg]

You all can read the Access Fund's position statement on bolts and fixed protection at

 

http://www.accessfund.org/advo/stand.php

 

So Joseph, it seems to me that the issue that you have with bolting at Beacon Rock ( or maybe bolting in general) is really not an Access Fund issue, but an ethics issue. The Access Fund organization will never take a position on a specific area, and whether it will have bolts or not. If former or current Access Fund reps want to drill bolts, their actions as a route developer will be subject to the criticism or support from the people that use that area.

 

I just read the Access Fund's "statement". It is an issue:

 

"The Access Fund supports the ban on power drills in wilderness, and actively promotes the concept that bolts are a tool of last resort."

 

However, with sport climbing, bolts are the tool of first resort and, in fact, sport "climbing" can be defined by its dependence on bolts. So for consistency sake, the Access Fund should take a stance against sport-climbing or quit the charade...The "Leave No Trace" people are playing the same game:

superficially noble, and ultimately meaningless statements are made to accomodate everyone, no matter how environmentally or otherwise unethical.

 

[billcoe]

Best post in a long while goes to Marcus:

 

Thanks for all the hard work, Kellie! As we all can see, working towards organizing climbers and their myriad voices into a cohesive lobby is no easy task. I for one appreciate that you have stepped forward to fill this challenging role for us as long as you have.

See ya at the crags!

 

Even more remarkable in that she was working all those hours for free to try and help. I got to be with Kellie for a few of the cleanups and she was always a well organized joy to be around.

________________________________________________________________________

 

 

Well, Raindawg showed up, so it's a bolt thread now.

 

 

I just read the Access Fund's "statement". It is an issue:

 

"The Access Fund supports the ban on power drills in wilderness, and actively promotes the concept that bolts are a tool of last resort."

 

However, with sport climbing, bolts are the tool of first resort and, in fact, sport "climbing" can be defined by its dependence on bolts. So for consistency sake, the Access Fund should take a stance against sport-climbing or quit the charade...The "Leave No Trace" people are playing the same game:

superficially noble, and ultimately meaningless statements are made to accomodate everyone, no matter how environmentally or otherwise unethical.

 

I don't understand why an area that has no cracks can't have bolts according to you Raindawg? Maybe you just need to get out and climb some more. (climb at all?)

 

Imagine a 400' high cliff that is crackless. You are advocating no climbing there. You are fine with them cutting a huge swath through the forest, blasting rocks and bulldozing massive amounts of dirt for a new road that can be seen from the next planet over, but a small f*ucking bolt that you cannot even see from 40 meters away.....(insert head shaking in angry disbelieve wide mouthed at the stupidity of your attitude emoticon here)

 

I just don't get it. AT ALL.

[elaine]

Thanks, Bill.

 

I always welcome an open discussion about the AF organization.

 

To Raindawg, it may not be convenient to have a discussion ( and not a rant on line) with me in PDX about the Access Fund, but your local rep is in Seattle, and I am sure you can discuss with him your perceptions about the Access Fund.

 

If the Access Fund was anti-bolts, then they would not be sponsoring or supporting our various clean ups and providing grants for our many sport climbing areas; Frenches Dome, Meadow Crags, Rabbit Ears, Callahans, Broughtons, Smith Rock, Madrone Wall Preservation Committee.... Oh, yeah, and in the Summer of 2006, both Jason Keith and myself worked with the Attorney General in Medford and got some bogus bolting charges dropped. A climber in Southern Oregon was developing some routes at the Williamson River Cliffs ( USFS land and NOT Wilderness). He was fined for developing this sport area and drilling bolts. His fine from the USFS? "Developing a trail without a permit." The bolt line was considered the trail. He was set to go to trial and we were ready to head down there and testify on his behalf.

 

The Attorney General contacted the USFS and the charges & fines were found illegitimate and dropped.

 

This was your last statement that you posted about the Access Fund......... So for consistency sake, the Access Fund should take a stance against sport-climbing or quit the charade...The "Leave No Trace" people are playing the same game:

superficially noble, and ultimately meaningless statements are made to accomodate everyone, no matter how environmentally or otherwise unethical.

 

So is the AF really superficially noble and standing on meaningless statements???

[kevbone]

However, with sport climbing, bolts are the tool of first resort

 

Ignorance at it best

[Raindawg]

Thanks, Bill.

 

I always welcome an open discussion about the AF organization.

 

To Raindawg, it may not be convenient to have a discussion ( and not a rant on line) with me in PDX about the Access Fund, but your local rep is in Seattle, and I am sure you can discuss with him your perceptions about the Access Fund.

 

If the Access Fund was anti-bolts, then they would not be sponsoring or supporting our various clean ups and providing grants for our many sport climbing areas; Frenches Dome, Meadow Crags, Rabbit Ears, Callahans, Broughtons, Smith Rock, Madrone Wall Preservation Committee.... Oh, yeah, and in the Summer of 2006, both Jason Keith and myself worked with the Attorney General in Medford and got some bogus bolting charges dropped. A climber in Southern Oregon was developing some routes at the Williamson River Cliffs ( USFS land and NOT Wilderness). He was fined for developing this sport area and drilling bolts. His fine from the USFS? "Developing a trail without a permit." The bolt line was considered the trail. He was set to go to trial and we were ready to head down there and testify on his behalf.

 

The Attorney General contacted the USFS and the charges & fines were found illegitimate and dropped.

 

This was your last statement that you posted about the Access Fund......... So for consistency sake, the Access Fund should take a stance against sport-climbing or quit the charade...The "Leave No Trace" people are playing the same game:

superficially noble, and ultimately meaningless statements are made to accomodate everyone, no matter how environmentally or otherwise unethical.

 

So is the AF really superficially noble and standing on meaningless statements???

 

Hey Elaine.

I'm sure you're very nice and you've probably done some wonderful things for climbing. I'm also sure that you're probably not going to like many of my viewpoints, but I assure you that I'm not alone in these perspectives. (By the way, just for your information, I've been actively involved in climbing for almost 35 years now, so I'm not just an armchair philosopher...it's stuff I deeply care about, though others may disagree about its content..needless to say, my views aren't overwhelmingly popular, but that's how things often change.)

 

Here are a few clarifications or things to consider:

 

Groups like “Leave No Trace” want you to pack out your poo…but they’ll take no REAL stance against people leaving permanent bolt trails wherever they please. Why? I suspect that the majority of climbers today enjoy the convenience that sport-bolting provides, not matter what the implications. The manufacturers love it (and endorse the Access Fund and Leave No Trace) because the short-learning curve and immediate gratification of sport-climbing has opened up a huge market for the sale of climbing gear.

 

While the Access Fund’s statement about bolts as the tool of last resort might seem noble, (the assumption being that they recognize bolts for what they are: permanent alterations and installations), they can conceivably duck around the sport-climbing issue by:

 

a) claiming that bolts are a tool of last resort in sport-climbing because it’s the only form of protection available for such climbs. (Not necessarily so…a huge number of “sport-climbs” can be top-roped with minimal installation of permanent hardware.) Furthermore, not every blank face of rock needs to be climbed or bolted. Maybe the attitude promoted should be climb it green and clean or leave it alone.

 

b) limiting the intent of their statement to such circumstances as bolts near cracks which is obviously inappropriate.

 

The Access Fund works hard to keep some places open that arguably deserve to be shut-down until the mess is cleaned up. Perhaps there should be a parallel organization formed to inform land owners and managers about the impact of climbers. They would then have the option to ban bolts or otherwise set some rules about how they’d like to see their resources treated. A lot of climbers seem to think that they are “green” because they do things outdoors, pick up their gum wrappers and recycle their beer cans yet have no qualms about rap-bolting a wall and drilling their vertical trails wherever they please.

 

Speaking of vertical trails: regarding the Williamson River Cliffs case, I think in the future, the “developing a trail without a permit” should be expanded to include sport-route “development”. That guy got off on a technicality, but I think the Forest Service had the right idea in mind.

 

 

 

 

[elaine]

Like I said, I've always had my naysayers and doubters, as has the Access Fund.........And all I did was be a volunteer.....

 

Best wishes to you Raindawg!

[jon]

Don't let the grave robber get you down elaine. Thanks for all the hard work!

[billcoe]

I don't understand why an area that has no cracks can't have bolts according to you Raindawg? Maybe you just need to get out and climb some more. (climb at all?) Have you been to Toulomne Meadows at all?

 

Imagine a 400' high cliff that is crackless. You are advocating no climbing there. You are fine with them cutting a huge swath through the forest, blasting rocks and bulldozing massive amounts of dirt for a new road that can be seen from the next planet over, but a small f*ucking bolt that you cannot even see from 40 meters away.....(insert head shaking in angry disbelieve wide mouthed at the stupidity of your attitude emoticon here)

 

I still don't get it, and it is truly most likely that you cannot explain it away, so you don't address my issue.

 

(drifting off with the sound of lil Dawg warming up in the background, with 300 bolts in the basement next to her....raring to go)

 

 

Edited to add couple of lil Dawg pic's

 

[kevbone]

Bill. I think Don is advocating that in the event we come across a wall as you described that we simply top rope it and do not place lead bolts.

[billcoe]

Don topropes in Toulome, or Thailand, Broux and on 400' tall as yet unclimbed cliffs?

 

WTF? Does Don use some special 800' long rope?

[mattp]

Thanks you, Kellie, not only for your hard work over the past few years but also for your participation here.

 

At this point I think we have an opportunity to talk about how climbers of various stylistic inclinations may work together on access issues and I think that a new Oregon access fund local representative should be interested in working on issues of concern to a variety of climbers regardless of whether they see themselves in the "trad" or "sport" camp.

 

The recent history of climbing management at Beacon is, I think, instructive. As I understand it, the 1996 climbing management plan was then and has continued to receive the support of the Access Fund.

 

That plan called for very limited bolting at Beacon Rock and in fact any new bolts on the main face there were to be limited to carefully-considered situations, after review by the advisory committee and approval from the Park. This was based in large part on the predominant climbing tradition on the South Face and the desire of most of the “locals” involved in developing the plan. It was also recognized that the nature of the South Face really didn’t lend itself well to bolt-protected face climbs, from either a climbing quality or aesthetic standpoint.

 

As far as I know, the advisory committee has not been maintained but the general intent of that plan has been followed. Meanwhile, Joseph's group - the Beacon Rock Climbers Association - has worked closely with the State Parks and Fish and Wildlife on the Peregrine Falcon monitoring and there has been as far as I know little active involvement on the part of the Access Fund nor any real need for such.

 

There have been some "issues" there and many of us could grumble about who is stepping on whose toes or whether the falcons need all the space they are getting. We've seen a bit of that grumbling in this thread but, overall, it seems to me as if climbers and the Access Fund and State Parks have done well at Beacon.

 

Here's to whoever wants to step into your shoes and bring about more of the same.

 

[Raindawg]

Don topropes in Toulome and on 400' tall as yet unclimbed cliffs?

 

WTF? Does Don use some special 800' long rope?

 

FYI "billcoe":

In case you were wondering, I have plenty of responses to all of your comments but I have found our exchanges unproductive...so, you're basically on my "do not respond" list...[this message is an obvious exception in order to provide you with an explanation].

 

[billcoe]

FYI "billcoe":

In case you were wondering, I have plenty of responses to all of your comments but I have found our exchanges unproductive...so, you're basically on my "do not respond" list...[this message is an obvious exception in order to provide you with an explanation].

 

I was thinking something along the same lines. In fact, if you will stop posting I will stop read your crap.

[ivan]

you know you can't play well w/ others when you can't get along w/ bill - wtf? bill's the kinda guy that if you ran over his dog, he'd probably be apologetic about it ruining the paintjob on your car.

[mattp]

Hey Bill and Ivan:

I'm not sure Raindawg's rant has much to do with the topic at hand. As climbers more familiar with Beacon than I am, what do you guys think about the management plan I described above? What would you have Beacon climbers doing for access or falcons or relations with State Parks at Beacon? Did the Access Fund push through a generic bolting policy that is akin to starting a bolt war at Beacon?