sexual_chocolate Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Ummm yes that's right, some consider it immoral to fly, intentionally, airplanes into tall human inhabited buildings. Yes, that is correct. And since this is probably a war, a war on terror, has there ever been a war in all of history fought fair? Your earnest and honest simplicity is actually refreshing in some ways. I am a little puzzled though about how you manage to reconcile your seemingly loyal religious views, christian views I imagine, christian views based on the teachings of Jesus, and your seemingly cavalier take on torture, collateral damage (the death of innocents, god's children), etc. How does a fundamentalist christian deal with these seemingly incongruous views? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 and quit pretending Bush is the worsest, evilist president ever, Who is pretending? I know I am not…..nor is his approval rating….. I suppose you can pretend that he is a good president…… Kevbone...IMO, rejecting the demonization of a president and calling BS on claims that he's chiefly to blame for all the worlds problems is very different from pretending he's a good president. I'm not a huge fan to be honest, but I think it's not only unproductive but downright dangerous to blame him for everything that he's being blamed for. In doing so, we fail to ask honest questions that get to the root causes, and basically delay any real action for 2 to 3 years when we see that the problems persist despite who's in the oval office. It's the same issue I have with Gun Control. I have no desire to have a handgun, and I see the danger in dipshits owning one, but I also don't think that they are to blame for the upsurge of violence in this country. Perhaps we can spend another 10 year working on legislation to ban handguns....I don't think we'd see a big impact on violent crime....and then we'd realized that we've wasted 20 years failing to address the real root cause....poverty, absent fathers, glorification of violence in movies/TV/video games, etc..... The buck has to stop somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevbone Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Bush is the biggest terrorists of them all..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Ummm yes that's right, some consider it immoral to fly, intentionally, airplanes into tall human inhabited buildings. Yes, that is correct. And since this is probably a war, a war on terror, has there ever been a war in all of history fought fair? Your earnest and honest simplicity is actually refreshing in some ways. I am a little puzzled though about how you manage to reconcile your seemingly loyal religious views, christian views I imagine, christian views based on the teachings of Jesus, and your seemingly cavalier take on torture, collateral damage (the death of innocents, god's children), etc. How does a fundamentalist christian deal with these seemingly incongruous views? Its War. WWII the allies bombed whole cities. Was this wrong?? I don't think so. Is it terrible, I totally think so. Sometimes to stop brutality it takes total brutality. The language of the perpertrator must be spoken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 so Jesus would agree with this thinking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Bush is the biggest terrorists of them all..... you are a complete idiot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 so Jesus would agree with this thinking? my quess, but I'n not God. I would imagine he doesn't agree with much we do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 so Jesus would agree with this thinking? sigh....not so sure about that, but It's Friday afternoon..... To the extent that Jesus spoke to this, he seemed to condemn retaliation for the sake of retaliation....."turning the other cheek" and such. I don't seem to recall him being faced with a situation where one could make the argument that violence (whether preemptive or revenge) might serve to prevent further, more extensive violence, so it may be difficult to apply the WWJD card directly here - or at least back it up with any direct scriptural parallels. This might perhaps explain why, even within the Christian community, there doesn't seem to be clear consensus. To the extent that anybody can say with surety what our true motivations for this war are, one might be able to draw on the New Testament for answers. Unfortunately, I don't know that this is possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 (edited) so Jesus would agree with this thinking? Do I think he holds it against the people that did the bombing??? Not at all. Here are some quotes for Stonwall Jackson arguable one of the best generals ever for the US and a devote Christian who would not fight on Sunday's. Always mystify, mislead, and surprise the enemy, if possible; and when you strike and overcome him, never let up in the pursuit so long as your men have strength to follow; for an army routed, if hotly pursued, becomes panic-stricken, and can then be destroyed by half their number. The other rule is, never fight against heavy odds, if by any possible maneuvering you can hurl your own force on only a part, and that the weakest part, of your enemy and crush it. Such tactics will win every time, and a small army may thus destroy a large one in detail, and repeated victory will make it invincible.[31] —Jackson to General Imboden To move swiftly, strike vigorously, and secure all the fruits of victory, is the secret of successful war.[32] —Jackson, 1863 The only true rule for cavalry is to follow the enemy as long as he retreats.[33] —Jackson to Colonel Munford on June 13, 1862 War means fighting. The business of the soldier is to fight. Armies are not called out to dig trenches, to throw up breastworks, to live in camps, but to find the enemy and strike him; to invade his country, and do him all possible damage in the shortest possible time. This will involve great destruction of life and property while it lasts; but such a war will of necessity be of brief continuance, and so would be an economy of life and property in the end.[34] —Jackson Edited October 20, 2007 by Seahawks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JosephH Posted October 20, 2007 Author Share Posted October 20, 2007 It should also be noted that by declaring a "war" on terror the President in many ways lent legitimiacy to the actions of 9/11 terrorists by casting these criminals as enemy combatants. As simply terrorists, there was no doubt about the criminality of their actions; as enemy combatants engaged in a war who used such means as were at their disposal to attack a nation possessing overwhelmingly military superiority - he almost did them a favor. The use of the phrase "war on terror", the development of military tribunals, and the designation of terrorists as "enemy combatants" only serves to legitimize their "war" against us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 so Jesus would agree with this thinking? my quess, but I'n not God. I would imagine he doesn't agree with much we do. your guess is Jesus WOULD agree with this thinking? Hmmmm.... According to the teachings, god sent down his son Jesus because he didn't agree with what was going on; the people were to listen to his teachings, right? about peace, and loving your neighbor and all of that. I would think that a christian, especially a fundamentalist christian, would seriously consider the words of god and his prophet when making decisions about how his government should act, ESPECIALLY if he thinks that god doesn't agree with much that "we" are doing. Wouldn't that make sense? Or maybe I misread your religious convictions. I thought I remember you saying you were a christian, and god created the planet and us etc., (have you ever heard the teaching that says that the way to know god's will is to study the word of his son?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 nice thread drift, guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 so Jesus would agree with this thinking? my quess, but I'n not God. I would imagine he doesn't agree with much we do. your guess is Jesus WOULD agree with this thinking? Hmmmm.... According to the teachings, god sent down his son Jesus because he didn't agree with what was going on; the people were to listen to his teachings, right? about peace, and loving your neighbor and all of that. I would think that a christian, especially a fundamentalist christian, would seriously consider the words of god and his prophet when making decisions about how his government should act, ESPECIALLY if he thinks that god doesn't agree with much that "we" are doing. Wouldn't that make sense? Or maybe I misread your religious convictions. I thought I remember you saying you were a christian, and god created the planet and us etc., (have you ever heard the teaching that says that the way to know god's will is to study the word of his son?) Jews thought the same thing in Germany before WWII, look where it got them. There is a time for fighting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 so Jesus would agree with this thinking? my quess, but I'n not God. I would imagine he doesn't agree with much we do. your guess is Jesus WOULD agree with this thinking? Hmmmm.... According to the teachings, god sent down his son Jesus because he didn't agree with what was going on; the people were to listen to his teachings, right? about peace, and loving your neighbor and all of that. I would think that a christian, especially a fundamentalist christian, would seriously consider the words of god and his prophet when making decisions about how his government should act, ESPECIALLY if he thinks that god doesn't agree with much that "we" are doing. Wouldn't that make sense? Or maybe I misread your religious convictions. I thought I remember you saying you were a christian, and god created the planet and us etc., (have you ever heard the teaching that says that the way to know god's will is to study the word of his son?) I think you got it. Don't forget next time this Jesus you talk about as Love comes back he comes to conquer with a sword. Read a little in revalations. No more Mr. nice guy next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClimbingPanther Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 SC, apparently seahawks believes Jesus' teachings are to be followed only when it gets them somewhere. Practical, yes; Christian, well, not exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 SC, apparently seahawks believes Jesus' teachings are to be followed only when it gets them somewhere. Practical, yes; Christian, well, not exactly. LOL becuase I beleive war can be justified???? Ever read the old testiment??? Plently wars directed by God himself for his reasons. Nice try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 GOD LOVES YOU AND HE WANTS YOU TO DIE SEACAWK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaskadskyjKozak Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 GOD LOVES YOU AND HE WANTS YOU TO DIE SEACAWK. PLEASE BAN SEACAWK FOR A WHILE IT WOULD BE VERY NICE OF YOU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 (edited) GOD LOVES YOU AND HE WANTS YOU TO DIE SEACAWK. LOL you first. amazing talk about God and the haters fly out, must be that guilty conscience. Edited October 20, 2007 by Seahawks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olyclimber Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 NOT HATE'N BRAH...JUST STATING THE FACTS OF GODS LOVE FOR YOU. I AM HIS SPOKESMODEL SOMETIMES. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noliquidity Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 SC, apparently seahawks believes Jesus' teachings are to be followed only when it gets them somewhere. Practical, yes; Christian, well, not exactly. LOL becuase I beleive war can be justified???? Ever read the old testiment??? Plently wars directed by God himself for his reasons. Nice try. You wouldn't be one of those fundementalists that believe in bombing abortion clinics are you. Where have I heard of using violence against civilians to to fulfill an ideological principle before? I think if you moved to Saudi or Pakistan you'd fit right in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 GOD LOVES YOU AND HE WANTS YOU TO DIE SEACAWK. I see from the number of physicians that you think my condition dangerous, but I thank God, if it is His will, that I am ready to go. (General Jackson on his Death Bed) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawks Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 SC, apparently seahawks believes Jesus' teachings are to be followed only when it gets them somewhere. Practical, yes; Christian, well, not exactly. LOL becuase I beleive war can be justified???? Ever read the old testiment??? Plently wars directed by God himself for his reasons. Nice try. You wouldn't be one of those fundementalists that believe in bombing abortion clinics are you. Where have I heard of using violence against civilians to to fulfill an ideological principle before? I think if you moved to Saudi or Pakistan you'd fit right in. I don't beleive in abortion. Murder. Would I bomb someone, nope. I don't need to judge them. They someday will stand before God himself and give an account. I worry about myself, I have plenty explaining to do myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sexual_chocolate Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 I think you got it. Don't forget next time this Jesus you talk about as Love comes back he comes to conquer with a sword. Read a little in revalations. No more Mr. nice guy next time. Did you know Revelations was written by someone years after Jesus' death, and its inclusion within the new testament was highly controversial? It's akin to believing joseph smith was the latest to bring down the word of god. Seems to me that if one is a literalist christian, one lives in a heap of confusion; who do you choose to believe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noliquidity Posted October 20, 2007 Share Posted October 20, 2007 Dude, your scary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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