"Vacation Alpinism" and Epics

[rbw1966]

I'm suggesting perhaps an extra kind word or a few more minutes of conversation, not "intervention" or "oversight". More like "Hi there. I see that you're from (insert distant location). Did you know that the weather around here has been super shitty, so you may want to change your plans?"

 

And who are you going to have this conversation with when you climb Mt. Hood? Its a self-registration process. Only time I have talked to a ranger before climbing in the cascades is on Mt. Adams and Mt. Rainier.

 

Personal responsibility.

 

Edited to add:

Edited December 13, 2006 by rbw1966

[chris]

Off White is completely right - how do you train your staff to "have a kind word" for "visiting climbers" who might not be "familiar with the conditions?" Worse yet, how do arrange the meeting? Do you require climbers to arrive at a ranger station to pick up a permit? Who is this conversation going to be with - a desk jockey, or a backocuntry ranger who happens to be in town after a patrol? Will the station remain open later at night and earlier in the morning, especially on the weekends? Requiring any kind of face-to-face meeting assumes 1) that the public land managers have the manpower and the personnel to provide accurate information 2) that public land managers have the budget to pay for this duty.

[Choada_Boy]

You guys are right. Forget I mentioned it. Proceed as normal.

[wfinley]

Requiring any kind of face-to-face meeting assumes 1) that the public land managers have the manpower and the personnel to provide accurate information 2) that public land managers have the budget to pay for this duty.

Yeah... like on Denali. Are you ready to shell out $500 to climb Mt Hood?

[BirdDog]

As my Dad always said "Being a climber is nothing more than someone putting one foot in front of the other. Being a mountaineer is knowing when to stop climbing and get home safely." Summit fever can be caught by anyone, local or tourist.

 

As far as face to face meetings - I have been stopped by climbing rangers on Rainier on several oocassions. The "meetings" were always courteous and friendly. They were just making sure I was equiped and knew what I was getting into; probably so they didn't have to rescue my sorry ass later.

[G-spotter]

There's something in the foreward of Dougherty's Alpine Guide about him deciding to write the guide after meeting a party that (I think) had just bailed off of Andromeda Strain, due to shitty conditions, and getting ready to go up on Emperor Ridge on Robson in even worse conditions because it was the only other climb in the Rockies that they knew of.

[jordop]

Hey, it's a tough call. I remember being pulled aside by a Rainier ranger to "have a little talk about glacier travel" after my buddy was being a dork and talking about skiing the Mowich face in a 24 hr push

[wfinley]

Hey, it's a tough call. I remember being pulled aside by a Rainier ranger to "have a little talk about glacier travel" after my buddy was being a dork and talking about skiing the Mowich face in a 24 hr push

 

The flip side to this is going into the Teton Ranger station and asking about routes. A couple summers ago we asked about conditions on Owen and the ranger was like "Awww - I usually just take sneakers up that... maybe an axe." We wore crampons the entire route!

 

As for Dougherty's guide - I have met many a person who went off their rocker complaining about Dougherty's time estimates. If he had humanitarian goals perhaps he should have considered how fat and slow american alpinist such as myself are.

[iain]

I wager Dougherty's book has caused more epics than it has prevented.

[wfinley]

I can attest to that.

[hawkeye69]

i may have come across a bit harsh in my first post. hood already has the requirements of a cell phone or locator unit. seems alright. plus as some guys already mentioned there aint no 24 hour ranger to talk to. plus, living in portland or seattle does not necessarily equal super alpinist. it does not exclude it, but does not necessarily show experience either.

 

IMHO some folks are taking guide books, web sites and all manner of stuff to literally, using it as verbatim gospel as to what their adventure will be. while this stuff is useful and great (and a thumbs up to TR's always), it is not ever a substitute for saving your own ass or being responsible for it.

 

the higher volcanic cascades seem to draw climbers in who may not fully appreciate the horrific weather that we can have, especially in winter. my guess is it aint too different from what one would find in patagonia known for some of the worse weather in the world. if you have not experienced that weather first hand, it is difficult to understand.

 

for this web site, perhaps one of you guys could put a sticky together about the potential weather. i know some of the books that talk about climbing rainier in winter discuss the horrific weather.

 

increased regulation is never the solution (IMHO).

[chris]

I'm right with you there, Hawkeye.

 

[Off_White]

I tried Rainier in the winter in 1979 just after I moved up here from California. It was, ummm, "educational." Ran into Yvon Chouinard in the Paradise lot who had just retreated from a ski attempt because there was too much snow.