old screamer question

[G-spotter]

I belayed a guy who fell on a Screamer

It was mine before he fell, and his afterwards, even though only about half the stitching ripped

 

[catbirdseat]

That seems like a fair policy, actually. I think I'll adopt it as my own.

[Weekend_Climberz]

Or sell it to some dumb smuck.

 

That come back to bite you, you better believe it.

[Kraken]

I took a big fall on a screamer last season. It was attatched to a 10CM BD Express with the last two centimeters punching through the other end of the curtain. I was about 8 feet above it when my pick ripped out. The fall became very dynamic, as my belayer was pulled forward some 25 feet, but the screamer still fully extended.

 

When we retrieved the screw, the ice around it was so fractured my partner was able to essentially pull it out without even making a full backward rotation.

 

Those Zippers, while bulkier than the regular screamers, are the best in my opinion, as they lower the impact force by a potential two or three KN on the protection.

[catbirdseat]

I took a big fall on a screamer last season. It was attatched to a 10CM BD Express with the last two centimeters punching through the other end of the curtain.

Can anyone tell me why they make ice screws without extending the thread along the entire length of the screw? It must be fairly common for screws to punch through into air pockets and through curtains. If the screw is long, say 16 cm, and the curtain is 10 cm, and the thread are on the last 10 cm, you might have only 4 cm of threads in ice. The preferred solution would be to remove the long screw and replace it with a shorter one, but it would be entirely unnecessary if the threads went all the way to the head.

[eric8]

Would it not cost more to machine a 22cm screw is threads all the way? what about wieght difference?

[catbirdseat]

I can only assume that the reason that threads are 10 cm on all screws is cost of manufacture. I have no idea whether they are machined or cast. I figure it's the latter.

[G-spotter]

Threads add friction. Placing a 22cm with screws all the way to the hanger would be pumpy.

[mountainmatt]

If you question it, replace it. Or sell it to some dumb smuck.

 

Sell it to Arc.

[catbirdseat]

Threads add friction. Placing a 22cm with screws all the way to the hanger would be pumpy.

That's a lot of nonsense. Have you ever had any trouble turning a screw to remove it? I have not. Most of the friction comes from the teeth.

[G-spotter]

LOL. U should try some oldschool Russian Ti screws or turning out a snarg (that has threads all the way) before you mouth off

[Valhalla]

For what it is worth...I have some screamers (not ice screamers) that are six years old but have only been used about 30 times. Yesterday my buddy (180 lbs) was about 6 ft above a solidly placed 17cm screw, on a 9.5mm line, when his tools popped and he launched. The screamer's stitching ripped, but the screw didn't pull, bend or fracture the ice.

 

I agree that the replacement cost is a lot cheaper than health, and I have been planning swapping them out (especially as I was reading this thread). I was pretty happy to see them work as designed, absorb all that force, and a leave perfectly good 2" sling to clean.

Edited December 19, 2006 by Valhalla

[JosephH]

Guys get a grip! Eight years old? I'm still using Wild Things Air Voyagers from the '70s on occasion. I've fallen on a few dozen of them and Screamers as well over the years. In fact, some are half blown and sport taped back to preload state as they are still good for a go or two. I have many that are steeply pre-sliced with a razor to create very flat loading curves for delicate rp nests and #2 Crack'N Ups. The odds of the sling breaking after the stitching blows is pretty damn remote even on my oldest ones - it isn't going to happen. The odds of the stitching being dramatically out of spec is probably fair on those. More of an issue for ice no doubt, but eight years old? Come on. Hell, I'll buy them - how much? PM me...

 

Edit: Damn, just sent all my old Dyneema 8mm slings off to be tested, should have thrown an Air Voyager in there too...

[Peter_Puget]

I think Joseph was typing a bit fast. I am fairly sure that WT did not exist in the 70s. About 18 months ago I was climbing with a friend and commented on how I thought a sling tied to a cam seemed to be getting a bit old. My partner replied that he could remember exactly when he acquired the sling. It was in the Valley in ’77 – he took the sling off of xxxxx’s Jumar. As soon as I was on the ground again untied the sling and beat it with a rock. Climb safe.

[JosephH]

Peter, thanks, too tired when I did that one - that should be early-mid '80s. But points the same and I'd still buy these if you don't want them anymore...

[Peter_Puget]

There is a small chance I have some in my garage from the 80s. They are yours if you want them.

[JosephH]

Sure, I'm still using them and have a couple of new routes coming up that I'm guessing are going to eat a few...

[Peter_Puget]

Quick look turned up nothing but my garage is a mess. If they turn up I'll pm you.