Alpine_Tom Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 The ridge that joins Mt. Snoqualmie and Guye Peak is called Cave Ridge. I’d assumed that the name came from some old mining tunnel, since there was a lot of mining activity in the area, but a friend said that there are real, spelunking-type caves up there. Anyone here know anything about this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 tom, if you find out more...i'll go with you...and even go down in that dark dank hole first too! always lookin for a spelunking adventure in the cave poor state of washington! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 Erik, you want to "go down" w/ AlpineTom? Good thing you said "with" and not "on" have you checked out those lava tunnels by adams? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erik Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 been there, done that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yossarian Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 One of the deepest caves in the northwest is Newton cave (~600ft.) located on cave ridge. I haven't been up there yet but have a couple of trip reports and was planning to go sometime this summer. Descending the cave requires a couple of rappels and alot of crawling around on wet dirty rock. There are no stalagtites or 'mites in the cave, just filthy rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 Dru and Erik, There are more to the Mt. Adams lava tube caves than you might think. I have been to the ice caves many times (even went ice bouldering in them), but if you do some thrashing into the forest there are a lot of bigger and undeveloped caves. We even found a new one which required a little digging and crawling on our bellies to get into. The interior had a cool dome ceiling, and a perfectly flat sand floor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 Colin's new Secret Love Palace??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forrest_m Posted July 12, 2001 Share Posted July 12, 2001 from what i understand, the newton cave has only been "pushed" to its lowest point relatively recently, and only by a few people. from what i've been told, it entails 4 fairly long raps (with all the attendant hauling in of ropes to fix) and several more "nuisance rappels". the "hell hole" cave is not very extensive, but involves rapping in through a squeeze slot in through the roof of a bell shaped cavern. "cascade cave" is quite deep and has at least one *very* narrow squeeze but no required rope work. there's a lot of sinkholes and slots up there, but you'll know you're in a hole that goes somewhere if at or near the entrance you run into one of those national speological society signs. (if you go exploring, remember a) it's cold and wet down there regardless of the weather b)bring 3 sources of light and c) your body is narrowest with one hand over your head and the other along your side...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 Hey Dudes! Listen to Dwayner who knows about this one...Just cuz you might be big stud alpinists doesn't mean you know from: a) caving, b) river rafting. I've had a lot of close calls in my life but the closest I ever came to getting killed was being lost in a complex system of lava tubes in Hawaii. I used to think caving was a wus sport. And had done all kinds of them. Limestone, lava, fissure caves. Then I got over-confident and all of my mistakes caught up to me. We got lost in a very remote area with an extremely difficult to locate cave entrance and nobody knew we were even out there. We were down to one light and I thought it was all over. It would have been a slow, painful demise even after I would have eaten my buddy. (He had a heart condition so I know he'd have gone first.) We were miraculously saved by following a tiny stream of cold air which we could only feel due to the fact that we were sweating profusely from panic and humidity. The details are even weirder and more horrifying but I learned my lesson. (By the way, when I came out of that cave, cut up and beaten, I was white as a ghost and white hair started to appear in my moustache.) I can still have nightmares about this if I think about it too much. The lesson? Know what you're doing and tell someone responsible exactly where and which cave you're going into. (It sounds like the Mountaineer's gave me this advice, but in this case I believe it!) Yes, there are caves on Cave Ridge. They're hard to find but descriptions (and topos?) can be had in an also hard to find book called Caves of Washington. I heard rumors that some of the entrances were gated, the keys being held by local spelunking clubs or "Grottos" as they call themselves. Also some good caves down by Mt. St. Helens. Again, be damn careful. Go with a real caver or at least read a book telling you what to wear and bring, etc. I also thought that river rafting was a king-size wussy sport. (I still sort of do.) So one day many years ago, during icy cold spring meltoff, I had my climbing gear dumped off at the Peshastin Pinnicles while me and my buddy launched ourselves into the mighty Wenatchee in a two-man inflatable kayak. We were going to float down the river to Peshastin and go climbing for the day. We were no more than a quarter mile out of downtown Leavenworth when we were swimming for our lives in the icy cold river. Barely made it out. Puked water the rest of the day and wasn't sure if I was really still alive for a while. Very traumatic. Yup, I think many of us think because we have at least some sort of technical mastery in mountain pursuits that everything else is a pushover. Wrong! Dwayner didn't know from caving or rafting. So...be careful out there! - Dwayner P.S. I should tell you some of my paragliding stories sometime!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 Dude, you're a poser... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 You know what Iambone...I decided a month ago or so that I wasn't going to respond any longer to your inane personal slights because I found you to be a very immature and unreasonable fellow. Now I'm here in this caving discussion sharing what I feel to be some very personal and important anecdotal information that I hope will cause people to think twice before making the same very serious mistakes that almost cost me my life on two occasions. And you come out of the woodwork to call me a "poser"? (By the way, ignoramus, if you choose to use such words, the proper spelling is "poseur"). There's a lot of posturing and funny schtick on this list but it's usually easy to sort out the mischief from the reality. I feel very blessed to have been able to lead (and continue to lead) a very adventurous life (and if you knew me personally, you might be very surprised). I have a lot of fun things to share and a lot of serious things as well. So if you're pleased that you finally got another response out of me by making light of some heartfelt advice, well it's yours pal. Congratulations. Ain't you the achiever! Grow up, buddy! And I hope others on this list will let you know likewise. Good luck and best wishes for a happy life. I mean that. - Dwayner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yossarian Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 "I heard rumors that some of the entrances were gated, the keys being held by local spelunking clubs or "Grottos" as they call themselves." What kind of crap is this? I can see gating a cave to prevent children from falling in, but to hold exclusive rights to a natural feature on a mountain is absurd. Anyone know anything about these "Grottos" or their reasoning? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forrest_m Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 yossarian - cavers are in general a lot more secretive and clannish than climbers. part of it is that their resources are very limited and they have serious access issues. it is also very easy for non-technically trained folk to end up in situations over their head, so they try to keep a low profile. a lot of them also just get off on being one of the few people "in the know." who knows, maybe it's something to do with being underground, all those tunnels make people secretive... grottos are loosely organized clubs whose main purpose seems to be being a repository of accurate cave surveys. (caving still is in some ways like climbing was a century ago, "recreational" caving is not considered respectable without some quasi-scientific agenda such as surveying... besides, it's the only way to know whether you're setting new records and for cavers, "opening" new passage is like putting up a first ascent) anyway, as of last fall there are no gates on the 3 caves I mentioned in my earlier post, they are protected by being difficult to find... btw, i'd agree with dwayner that being a long-time climber, i expected caving to be no big deal, and found it to be really fuckin' scary. it can be very cool, but take it seriously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jman Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 quote: Originally posted by lambone: Dude, you're a poser... I would have to side with Dwayner on this one. If you're serious, grow up. If you're trying to be funny, put some more effort into your humor. Dwayner - I found your story very interesting and I appreciate your candor. I was condsidering checking out some of the caves, but a reality check is always wise: caving can be extremely dangerous (probably more so than climbing/mountaineering). And whatever you rap down, you must ascend - easy to misjudge the difficulty of exit. Anyway it does sound like fun. Thanks for sharing your experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 One time in the Canadian Rockies, hanging out in the ACC clubhouse, some friends of mine decided to go and explore "The Rat Hole" which is this neat cave you rap into located near Grotto Canyon, that has a preserved buffalo skeleton under a sinkhole in one chamber and other cool stuff. It being New years they set out wearing the required clothes for -30 celsius weather, at about 10 at night. I decided to stay by the fire and read old ANAM issues. Five hours later they returned but their nice one piece goretex suits were retired after that trip. ground in mud and large slashed rips from sharp limestone edges. moral of the story is, always wear shitty old clothes to explore caves, they will get trashed beyond belief. as for why cavers are so protective of their caves it is because the caves trash so easily. if you touch some cave formations with bare skin your skin oils will be enough to permanently stop them from growing. you have to be prety dedicated and a control freak to be good at caving, imho. tried it and it is fun but a bit too anal for me to enjoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jens Posted July 13, 2001 Share Posted July 13, 2001 Dwayner, The Hawaii cave story sounds familiar. If you are who I think you are, was that on an archaeological expedition? Keep up the good stories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted July 14, 2001 Share Posted July 14, 2001 Ahoy, Jens...yes, it was an archaeology thang. It was supposed to be this massive burial cave. I was just going to see if it was relatively intact because I was concerned about possible commercial development in the area. Some of the old Hawaiian kahuna priests would put curses (kapu) on such places and I've heard those stories for years. People falling in and breaking legs, disappearing etc. Don't particularly believe in that stuff but it makes you think. (heck! I'd of been gone a long time ago if all that Egyptian mummy curse stuff was real!!!) Anyway, here's the epilogue: I go over there (Kona Coast on the Big Island) at least once a year. I tried to relocate that cave of doom two years in a row and finally found it again and took compass bearings. About a year ago, a manager at a nearby resort who is an amateru historian and myself revisited the place and the two of us did a fairly thorough exploration...with about a mile of small diameter cord on a spool, and a pack with 8 big flashlights, and a guy waiting at the entrance, etc. Found one of the gloves I'd dropped during my previous incident...the place where we got lost wasn't all that far from the main entrance tunnel, but if it's pitch black, and you don't know where you are, you're doomed anyway. We wore lei's made of ti leaves during our exploration and left them at the entrance. It's suppose to be the respectful thing to do. Glad I went back to do it the right way. It closed the circle...now if only I could get rid of these recurring nightmares!!! have a great weekend! - Dwayner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 quote: Originally posted by Dwayner: You know what Iambone...I decided a month ago or so that I wasn't going to respond any longer to your inane personal slights because I found you to be a very immature and unreasonable fellow. Now I'm here in this caving discussion sharing what I feel to be some very personal and important anecdotal information that I hope will cause people to think twice before making the same very serious mistakes that almost cost me my life on two occasions. And you come out of the woodwork to call me a "poser"? (By the way, ignoramus, if you choose to use such words, the proper spelling is "poseur"). There's a lot of posturing and funny schtick on this list but it's usually easy to sort out the mischief from the reality. I feel very blessed to have been able to lead (and continue to lead) a very adventurous life (and if you knew me personally, you might be very surprised). I have a lot of fun things to share and a lot of serious things as well. So if you're pleased that you finally got another response out of me by making light of some heartfelt advice, well it's yours pal. Congratulations. Ain't you the achiever! Grow up, buddy! And I hope others on this list will let you know likewise. Good luck and best wishes for a happy life. I mean that. - Dwayner Lighten up old timer.. I just think its funny that when someone asks for some simple beta, you come back with your life story. And I think your warnings to "be carefull out there" are lame and condesending. I don't care how much bad ass stuff you've done, you're still a poser. So caving is dangerous, no shit sherlock. Its a deep dark nasty hole in the ground, with bats, and who knows what else. You thought the loose rock on the Tooth was bad... Come on man, we have all read a National Geographic or two, or at least looked at the pictures. We don't need a warning lable pinned on every risky sport by "the man himself". But really, I heard that Cpt. Caveman has some deep dark nasty holes that you can explore. Be carefull, and remember to use your protection!!!!! P.S. I don't give a shit is my spelling sucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 Thank you, Mr. Iambone, for so splendidly re-emphasizing my original statement in your own words. You don't have to like my style, you don't have to like my stories, you don't have to like the fact that people "older" than you (which are probably most climbers with significant experience) and have something to share, even if anecdotes. (I suppose you avoid all the "big-shot" slide lectures, too?) You are welcome to consider and disregard what you choose. What a country! How about this for a solution to your irritation, "young-timer": When you see the name "Dwayner" on a posting here, don't read it! Avoid it because it will only sour your day. Same thing with anybody else whose style you just don't prefer! - Professor Dwayner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jman Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 You go, Professor D!!!! Thanks. You made me laugh my butt off... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
specialed Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 Dwayner, your story sounds eerily like the Brady Bunch episode when they visited Hawaii, got lost in a cave, and discovered a voodoo tiki doll, while unmasking heinous criminal activity at the same time. And was that amateur historian you met named Higgins by any chance? - BTW, you and Lambone make me laugh my ass off too. [This message has been edited by specialed (edited 07-17-2001).] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 Special Ed,m'man. You be gettin feisty t'day! Your mocking attitude is beginning to sound like that li'l feller in the gym. Sorry, to disappoint you. The whole story is COMPLETELY true and if I added some of the other details (which are really bizarre!) I wouldn't blame you if you thought I was full of it. Now turn off the Brady Bunch and go out there....and...and do something exciting..go buy lunch or whatever. - Dwayner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayner Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 Apology accepted, Mr. Special, but not needed. You can buy me a beer tonight at that "pub" function. Also, trust me, there ain't no rivalry between me and that Iambone feller in the gym. For there to be rivalry, there has to be some basis for competition. And when it comes to sport climbing, clipping bolts and setting fake handholds into a plywood wall to create clever challenges, he know doubt has me beat! Don't know the guy. It's all together possible he could be a terrific dude! It's hard to tell just by the nature of his postings. Hard to tell sometimes who's being playful in a smart-ass way, and who has deep-seated feelings of animosity. Yet...another unsolved technical mystery of the information highway. Special Ed? One word....Googook-kaju! - Dwayner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 I am the Eggman. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pencil_Pusher Posted July 17, 2001 Share Posted July 17, 2001 I mistakingly thought caving was all fun and games too. Fulford Cave by Eagle, CO. First time didn't bring a helmet and got lost. Wandered aimlessly for a while before down climbing 4th to 5th shit to reach Boy Scout group below. Second time brought a helmet and got lost, by chance found the way out. Third time brought little "bread crumbs" and flashlight went dead... try finding your damned way out holding a friggin light stick in one hand. It was better than nothing, but not by much. You can turn off your light and wait 20 minutes and you still can't see your hand two inches in front of your face. My only advice is that every damn thing looks the same in there so do something about it. Good batteries and a secondary light that uses the same type of batteries. Oh, bring a woman too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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