A Woman's Place is on Top

[Bob_Clarke]

This day in mountaineering history - 1978; First women's Annapurna expedition summits.

 

The book is good. I'd love a T-shirt

[Dru]

How come there are no Avatars out there named Anna Purna?

[Bob_Clarke]

or Anna Purrs

[Dr_Flash_Amazing]

Yeah, or Kay Too, or, or, uh, Ever ... Est.

[Greg_W]

Didn't Willi Unsoeld name his daughter after Nanda Devi? I know it was one of the guys from the '63 Everest Expedition.

[Bob_Clarke]

Didn't she die on the FA try on Nanda Devi as well? DOH

[Greg_W]

Yes, John Roskelly wrote a book about the expedition; he was a member.

[iain]

Nanda Devi: The Tragic Expedition

 

a real soap opera.

[Figger_Eight]

Great reading though. That expedition turned out to be a cluster f*%#.

[iain]

Yeah, hell of a line they chose though. What a spectacular route, especially going in there pretty much cold as well. A true adventure.

[fern]

ropegun2002 you can still buy those shirts from Arlene Blum directly (she has a website) or through mountainwoman.com (a division of mountain gear).

 

I did not particularly enjoy the book but I have a lot of respect for the accomplishment.

[Terminal_Gravity]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ropegun2002:

This day in mountaineering history - 1978; First women's Annapurna expedition summits.

 

The book is good. I'd love a T-shirt

---

Didn't a bunch of those women die on that trip? I forget how many.

 

I was a punk kid in '77 and met about a half dozen of them at Stoney Point in Chatsworth. I completely missed the sexual conotations of their shirts at the time.

 

I gave some of them pointers on how to solve some of the boulder problems. They were trying to hone their rock skills, if I remember it right. (I'm sure I was high at the time) It was a wierd and troubling wake up call when I heard of their deaths.

[Alpine_Tom]

quote:

---

Originally posted by iain:

Yeah, hell of a line they chose though. What a spectacular route, especially going in there pretty much cold as well. A true adventure.

---

Robert Roper just published a sort of bio of Willi Unsoeld called "Fatal Mountaineer" that gives some really interesting insights into that expedition: why they chose such a tough line, the conflicts between amateur and professional climbers, and so on.

The sections on French philosophy made my eyes glaze over, tho.

[iain]

Unsoeld seems to have been a first class guy, too bad he left before I could appreciate him. And a local Oregon hardman to boot! A founding member of what became the Corvallis Mountain Rescue Unit. Probably some of the more seasoned guys on this board knew him I would guess.

[mattp]

The guy WAS awesome and he was very encouraging early in my climbing career. His climb with Tom Hornbein on Everest was one of the coolest things in climbing history and he was an incredible story teller and a master at group dynamics – so much so that he could steer a crowd in just about any direction he wanted. He had a throng of starry eyed followers we used to call "Willie Worshippers" and it was a little pathetic at times, but I never saw him take advantage of his power over his admirers and with groups of students he routinely set out to show them just how pathetic such blind adoration really was by setting up a situation where they would eventually figure out that he was assigning them a completely ridiculous task and that they had signed up for it without questioning him. While I thought his motives for this kind of thing were pretty unassailable, there were those who thought he was manipulative. Roskelly criticized him for being reckless in the mountains, and this may be so -- arguably he was responsible for his daughter's death and that of a student who died along with him on Mount Rainier because they might not have put theirselves in those situations had he not had that same power over people that created his cult following. But they guy was inspirational to a lot of people, and I can't say that if I follow some charismatic person up a mountain that it is their fault I'm there.

[pindude]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Alpine Tom:

quote:

---

Originally posted by iain:

Yeah, hell of a line they chose though. What a spectacular route, especially going in there pretty much cold as well. A true adventure.

---

Robert Roper just published a sort of bio of Willi Unsoeld called "Fatal Mountaineer" that gives some really interesting insights into that expedition: why they chose such a tough line, the conflicts between amateur and professional climbers, and so on.

The sections on French philosophy made my eyes glaze over, tho.

---

"Sort of bio" is right. Competency by the author was lacking, as the book is full of distortions and inaccuracies--more than I have ever seen in ANY mountaineering novel intended to be non-fiction. Myself being a writer, a collector of mountaineering lit, a climber, a Willi Unsoeld fan, knowing about the 1976 Nanda Devi expedition, and knowing a couple of the members on it, I was highly disappointed in this book. I found it very painful to read. Overall the book and subject were very poorly researched (bad preparation and bad writing go hand-in-hand), and many of Roper's "interesting insights" I found to be second-hand bullshit.

 

If you're thinking of reading Roper's Fatal Mountaineer, don't. Read instead Roskelley's first-hand account of the expedition that fills most pages of Roper's novel, Nanda Devi: The Tragic Expedition. And even though it has it's own shortcomings, a much, much better biography of Unsoeld is Lawrence Leamer's Ascent: The Spiritual and Physical Quest of Legendary Mountaineer Willi Unsoeld.

 

--Steve in Spokane

 

[ 10-15-2002, 09:11 PM: Message edited by: pindude ]

[Off_White]

I recently read Roper's book (note: no relation to Steve Roper, venerable Yosemite climber and early guidebook author) and didn't find it a total loss, but the things he got completely wrong about the parts I knew intimately did call all of his other facts into question. The two things I thing he got somewhat right was some of the nature of Unsoeld's character and the idea of 1976 being a time of change in the nature of Himalayan expedition climbing. Maybe it was just the number of Unsoeld's direct quotes and writings that got me, because I could hear them in Willi's voice, and it was wonderful to "hear" it again after all these years. Roper's posit on expeditions was that they were changing from the "gentlemen climbers working for the glory of the team" to a more stratified class system where the superstars work to place themselves in the right place to summit because success=sponsorship=making a living as a professional climber, and that this led to more "me" and less "us" with a lot of hurt feelings. I think you could also make a point that it was always that way, and it wasn't until that time that people would admit it in print. Galen Rowell's book about a failed K2 expedition, Throne Room of the Mountain King (I think thats the title) was a great expose of an expedition gone sour, featuring Big Lou in a starring role.

 

Its been a long time since I read Roskelly's book, and I see its out for another round with a fresh foreward, Roskelly reflecting on the past from the perspective of an older family guy now instead of 20 something hot boy upstart. I do think Roskelly was one of the best (if not THE best) American alpinists of his time, but even by his own admission interpersonal skills were not his forte. Its worth a read, but it is strictly Roskelly's side of the story.

 

I never read Leamer's book, so maybe I need to go back and give it a look-see. What I recall from the time it came out was how upset the Unsoeld family was about it, and that kind of put me off it back then.

[pindude]

Interesting to read your take on the book, Off White. Two things:

Rowell's book is "In the Throne Room of the Mountain Gods," FWIW. Yes, an excellent narrative of a mid-70s expedition, and a good juxtaposition to the Unsoeld Nanda Devi expedition. Certainly if they are a good twin-evil twin duo, Jim is the good and Lou the bad and the ugly.

 

In addition to my comments above about the lack of integrity of the author, it says a lot that he couldn't even spell Roskelley's name correctly throughout the novel.

 

Regarding your comment that Roskelley's book is "strictly (his) side of the story:" While Robert Roper constantly throws in his "insights" and suppositions without any logical reasoning or citations of sources, Roskelley's work is much more of a sound, journalistic effort. Roskelley continually gives others' sides of the story, gives reasons for his opinions, and is at times even critical of himself. I think you'll find it enlightening, especially after reading Roper's piece of garbage.

 

--pindude

[Off_White]

Thanks Pindude, I'll give Roskelly another read, its been a long time. I liked one review of Roper I saw last night: "take 1000 3x5 cards full of info, throw them up in the air, stack them as they fall, and you have Roper's book."