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Dru

"SPURS ARE AID" rant from Will Gadd

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ditch tools and have spurs on your hands... wolverine.jpg

 

Are pagetops aid snaf.gif

Is a wolverine a snafflehound?

Unanswerable questions abound.

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WG,

 

my comment on downgrading had nothing to do with trying to bring down peoples achievements or bag on mixed climbing. I was simply trying to say, that with the tactics that people are using, instead of taking things away, just grade stiffer.

 

If someone is going to onsight M11 by hanging on their spurs every 8ft, then maybe it isn't m11? I think there is a difference between someone climbing a 5.11 and someone climbing a 5.11 hanging on every cam. Hanging on heel spurs I think is comparable to getting a knee bar. Some people do choose to skip knee bars, but the people using them aren't tagged as aid climbers.

 

Maybe I'll try and make it down to your show, wish I could meet you at the bar. yellaf.gif

 

Luke

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kneebar = "Colorado etrier" you never heard that one eh Distel yellaf.gif

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Hmm.. I don't agree about kneebars = spurs. Spurs are added by the human... Kneebars come with the route, and are sort of figured in to the grade (I thought) or at least the route description.

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But... If you think "spurs are aid" and shouldn't be used when climbing in the best style, then they're like pulling on gear. You don't downgrade routes to factor in pulling on gear.

 

I'm very happy to see mixed climbing moving away from all the stuff that made it more like aiding. Didn't really seem to be in the spirit of going leashless - leashes were aid but hooks on your feet weren't.

 

It's all about honesty and style. I'm amazed when people say they "led" a route when in fact they rested or even pulled on a bunch of gear. I think I've even read this definition in a guidebook. I always thought leading implied no rests no falls. Try for the best style and the most fun but be honest about what you did.

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aid_hat_mesh.jpg

yellaf.gifyellaf.gifyellaf.gifthumbs_up.gif

 

Timm@y should add that hat to the cc.com apparel at that online shop. A must have if I have ever seen one.

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Hey Will (or someone else with the info),

When you know the time/location/charge for your slideshow at UW, please make a post in the "Events" forum.

 

thumbs_up.gifwave.gif

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I'm doing a spray-session (also called a slide show) at UW on the 15th of April, I'll buy the first round for any post-show discussions.

 

best,

 

wg

 

Might want to be careful with that kind of invitation and this group...yelrotflmao.gifbigdrink.gifbigdrink.gif

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"this is the best fucking thread i have ever read"

-That's not saying much.

 

Anyway, i think the point is that spurs allow you to hang on gear which in my book = A0. Hanging on your tools & frontpoints is also hanging on your gear BUT it sure as shit isn't resting on it.

 

So the question really is: when does a mixed line become aiding a rock climb?

I guess it's when someone frees it w/o tools&poons.

 

Either way it's fun to do. The only way i can see it mattering to anyone is if you're gonna claim some hard ascent that someone else would care about or publish. I don't see any of us coming to that point in our climbing careeers anytime soon so STFU and climb.

 

And now to taunt you with climbs in the canadian rockies that may or may not have been climbed.

136bloodsnorer_10-med.jpg

136bloodsnorer_11-med.jpg

136sorcerer2-med.jpg

God i love the internet. flame flame away! rockband.gif

Edited by michael_layton

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Hey Will (or someone else with the info),

When you know the time/location/charge for your slideshow at UW, please make a post in the "Events" forum.

 

thumbs_up.gifwave.gif

 

I'll post something in the next few days. Sooner if you can divert my eyeballs from staring at the beautiful contour lines on the map of Jostedalsbreen in front of me.

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There is nothing wrong with style comparisons.

 

But to make a rating based upon a piece of gear or furnished addition that has been in place for a while and designed and used by many of the users (especially the so called elite users and innovaters or pioneers) and trying to downgrade it or change the case make it easily the culprit and problem when one talks about climbing most of the time in regards to M ratings IMHO. BTW I climbed an m4 once onsight on lead so I proclaim myself an expert on decisions here. smirk.gif

 

It's 5.10 to climb this crack (some crack) with shoes, chalk, ropes, cams, chocks, and etc for latest gear available right? If somoene chooses to sit start the crack without shoes, ropes, cams, etc doesn't change the rating.

 

I think the evolution of reverse evolution of what has already happened might be something here....

 

Is it trad mixed if you dont use spurs on m9? Is this a new definition of trad climbing or sit starting or sandbagging or is it just what we see?

 

BTW I dont have spurs or horses and prefer to frontpoint up easy ice.

 

Latah

 

PS This website is slow for me right now........ Not sure if my post is making it in there..

Edited by Cpt.Caveman

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The show rocked! AND, I do believe WG actually did buy us some beer smile.gif Where were you all? He got off way easy... A bunch of serious young college kids, they hardly consumed _any_ beer... I wouldn't recommend making that offer at PC...

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said he wanted a horse... and had a slide with horses. and then _didn't_ get on the whole rant... That was cool of him. kind of made his feelings known without getting excessive about it.

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Back in the days before sticky rubber shoes, 5.8 was damned hard in Keds. Now even I can lead 5.8 (sort of); that doesn't mean you need to downgrade 5.8 to 5.4 or something (4.8?); everyone is just aware that 5.8 isn't all that difficult, and 5.10 is "moderate."

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