Alpine_Tom

The one crevasse-accident experience I have had was on the Interglacier, in September, I think, about 8 or 9 years ago. We'd climbed up to Camp Shurman, four of us including two novices. We roped up all the way up, which is slow and tedious work with novices, and of course the Interglacier was full of unroped parties, and people talking about how it's a "dead" glacier so there's no crevasse danger. So, on the way down, we didn't rope up after clambering up off the Emmons. And, the leader, the most experienced and the one with the rope in his pack, punched into a completely hidden crevasse. He managed to catch himself with his armpits, and I extended my ice axe and drug him out. This was about 30 feet from the edge of the glacier, and we were quite conflicted about whether to rope up now, or just make a break for it. Now, this wasn't early season, it was late season, on a heavily travelled route. I don't remember whether we were actually following boot tracks or not, (I think we must have been.) I'm sure there were over fifty people up there that day alone. Because it was so narrow, he was able to catch himself. If it had been large enough that he couldn't have caught himself, it probably would have been open by then. (Maybe not.) It really got me serious about glacier safely. Keep the rope taut, and don't take chances. A "dead" glacier is just as dangerous as a "live" one (ever been stung by a dead bee?) And, if you're going to the trouble of bringing a rope, for God's sake, use it!

In the winter it's not tough at all -- once you get up to Cave Ridge, which can be pretty grueling. There's an awesome cornice that hangs off it on the e/s side.

How about "In the Zone" by Peter Potterfield? It's accounts of three mountaineering survival epics, including his own accident in the Cascades. Pretty engrossing reading.

My father-in-law had a VW Vanigan for years, and hated it: maintenance problems, underpowered, overpriced. Finally got rid of it and got a big Ford van conversion. (Not for backcountry, of course.) I'd have to agree with chris_w; my wife had a Subaru Justy 4wd, and I only needed the 4wd once, on all the forest service roads I took it on. Most of the time, my Escort wagon does just fine -- good mileage, enough room for two or three, and cheap. As reliable as a Japanese car.

quote: Originally posted by Dwayner: I finally read Lansing's "Endurance" book which was recommended to me years ago. It was THE greatest tale of ultimate toughness and outdoor survival I've read. Not to denegrate Shakelton's achievements (to me the most amazing aspect of that adventure is that not a SINGLE man died, in all of that) but the most dramatic tale of outdoor survival I've come across is a book called "The Long Walk." Four Polish POWs escaped from a concentration camp in Siberia. In winter. Walked south, through Siberia. Through the Gobi Desert, where at one point they went for, I think, four days with no water. Over the Himalayas. Three of them made it to India and survived, and the author went on to fight in WW2. Whenever I feel sorry for myself for being tired, hungry, and a long way to go yet, I think about them. This is not the Steven King book, but I'm at work, and don't have the author's name in front of me. As of a couple of years ago, it was still in print.

It strikes me that Twight has a lot in common with Bobbie Bensman (who had her own thread here a couple of months back.) They're both looking to make a living doing something they love, and the way you do that is by increasing your marketability, so the books and photo ops will enable you to finance your climbing.

omigod! It's code red!!!

My understanding is that you should proceed like RMI does: in groups of a dozen or more, a foot apart, slow-marching in step.

Check this month's Popular Photography, which has an article on this exact topic. (It's the one with the new Minolta Maxxim 5 on the cover)

quote: Originally posted by Brian Rybolt: (Just a question: would blowing up the Glenn Canyon Dam be an act of terrorism?) According to Lenin, "the purpose of terrorism is to terrorize." So, no. Blowing up the Glenn [sic] Canyon dam wouldn't be terrorism. Spiking trees might be considered terrorism.

I left work early on Friday to do a solo scramble up Chair Peak. I got to the Alpental parking lot a little after 4:00, and saw at least one car with a ticket on it. Apparently they’re still serious about the trail park passes up there. I hit the trail around 4:20, and took the route scrambling up from the Source Lake trail, though it appears from above that there’s a trail that follows the ridge over to Snow Lake. Inspired by Ray Jardin, I did the hike in on running shoes, which did cause a problem (see below.) I did the NE buttress route, which was beautiful; plenty of clean holds, no terrible exposure. FB calls it class 4, and that seems right to me. I got to the summit by 7:00 PM. (no doubt there are folks here who could do it in penny loafers, but I’m not one of them. I used my newly acquired rock shoes, thanks Rafael and the CC Yard Sale forum, and felt pretty comfortable with them.) I had been expecting that the SE ridge would be the way to assure success, since FB says it’s the easiest way up (and so does “Seattle Scrambles Guide”) But the NE Buttress looks so good, I did that instead, and descended the SE Route, partly because I thought it might be quicker, and to have a look at it. What a mess! It’s totally loaded up with garbage, you can’t move without setting off avalanches of loose rock. I can’t imagine climbing that, up or down! So, a beautiful day, a fun solo climb, but no summit register. (Have the North Cascades climbing rangers been operating this far south?) Two tragedies on the descent: I was wearing my Walkman (I know, I know!) and somehow it came off the gear loop of my pack, and it, with tape 32 of King County Library’s Books on Tape edition of War and Peace, went bouncing down the gully, probably all the way to Lake Melakwa. It’s a real problem, because I was just getting to the evacuation of Moscow after the battle of Borodino. Now I don’t know how it ends! (The good news is, Books on Tape is replacing it for me free!) Then, just as I got back to the trail, after scrambling down through that obnoxious band of brush and trees, as dark was falling, I set foot on the trail… and twisted my ankle on a rock! For a couple of seconds I was sure I was crippled, and would be eaten by cougars there, alone in the night. Then, after I got tired of gritting my teeth, I stood up and was able to walk out without any real problems. (By the next day it was swollen up nicely, however, and I was excused from helping some friends move.) That’s what happens when your guard is down. I’d been descending scree for half an hour in the gathering darkness with no problems, and had decided that once I got to the trail, I was home free. It was getting dark, around 9:00, and I just stopped watching my feet. You just can’t stop paying attention. Crowded climbs: once again, I had the mountain to myself. I passed a dozen or so people on the Snow Lake trail, and one person coming out on the Source Lake trail, but that was it. After that, the whole place belonged to me. Demonstrating once again that solitude isn’t all that hard to come by, even at Snoqualmie Pass, if you’re willing to venture ever so slightly from the weekend ritual. And, a couple friends went and climbed the same NE Buttress route Saturday, and were completely alone up there (of course, the Snow Lake and source lake trails were crowded.) [This message has been edited by Alpine Tom (edited 08-13-2001).]

Well, you can't get your car tabs renewed if you have unpaid parking tickets. I'd guess that the Feds would tell the State about these tickets, and the effect would be the same. Dave Parker: civil disobedience may be gratifying, but it doesn't change anything. Despite the unending high-profile publicity, did the WTO protests in Seattle change anything? Hell, it couldn't even get a cop who assaulted two innocent bystanders fired! The judge you appear before doesn't make the laws, Congress does, and you don't have the clout (unless you're Boise Cascade) to affect what happens there. As long as the alleged representatives of the outdoor community like the Mountaineers and REI are backing the trail pass system, we can just shut up and pay the money to subsidize logging. [This message has been edited by Alpine Tom (edited 08-10-2001).]

Eucerin is also good because it's unscented. And, it seems to work better on my hands than anything else I've tried. It doesn't leave that slimy feeling.

If you look here: http://www.nps.gov/noca/pphtml/feespermits.html you'll see that there are areas in the NCNP where they're requiring the trail pass. We were up by Heather Meadows last weekend, where they have rangers in a little booth selling the trail passes, and they told us that they need to get revenue this way, since they're not logging in the NP any more. That's how well informed the rangers are.

There was a discussion here earlier about whether you should take your dog climbing with you. One of the issues was snowblindness, something that's worried me for a while. Well, I asked our new vet, and he didn't know either, so he checked with a pet ophthalmologist (there apparently is such a thing) who assured him that it's not an issue for canines. So, you don't need to get Doggles if you want to take Fido up on the snowfields.

Our vet is Gregory Combs, at Lake Forest Park Animal Hospital (206-363-5656.) I don't know the name of the specialist he checked with. (I know the name of a good doggie dermatologist, though!) I have been trying for a while to logic this out without much success, since snowblindness is basically a sunburn of your retina (and that's why it goes away in a couple of days, just like a sunburn) it seems like a dog would have about the same danger as a human. OTOH, wolves and coyotes are out in the winter hunting, and if they were subject to snowblindness, they'd probably wouldn't survive. (My inlaws' dog with whom I go hiking a lot is part coyote, and he seems really visually oriented.) And, since Max never seems to have any problems during after a snow hike (he summited Glacier Peak in a day) I guess I'm inclined to go with the advice. That, along with the frustration of trying to get him to tolerate Doggles when I'm not around to train him with them. You're right, though, Holly, it's completely wrong to underestimate the style factor of Doggles! Especially in a cosmopolitan city like Vancouver. Is yours a Bernese Mountain Dog, by the way? [This message has been edited by Alpine Tom (edited 08-07-2001).]

This sordid tale reminds me of the Ambrose Bierce story about the deaf child who slept through the Battle of Shilo, and couldn’t understand why all these dead and dying solders laying around wouldn’t play with him. Ignorant, self-absorbed spoiled brats. It is, however, a useful reminder that for a lot of the world, there are lots more important issues than whether straight or bent ice tools are best for alpine use. Like, feeding your family, and avoiding the guns.

Sign me up.

Another precinct heard from... My .02 is that, the more you climb other mountains, the more you'll appreciate Rainier. Jogging around the neighborhood is nice and everything, but you'll do yourself a lot more good by going up to easy summits on weekends (or after work) McClellan Butte, Snoqualmie Peak, Kendall, Pilchuck, Pugh, etc etc. (For God's sake, don't waste your life on Mt. Si! Geez!) None of those are technically difficult, but they'll give you a feel and appreciation for altitude, what a mountain "feels like." Go down and hike up to Camp Muir, to get a feel for what it's like. Then, when you get up there, not only will your body be used to going up hills, but you'll know what you're seeing, and appreciating. Rainier was actually the second mountain I ever climbed (the first was Baker) and I don't think I saw it as much more than a big heap of snow and rock. There's so much more there to be aware of, and only by spending time in the hills can you really see them. And, I wouldn't haul around a 40-pound pack the whole time. Take a moderate pack, 10-15 pounds or so. No point in blowing out your knees. </essay> All that said, I'd guess September is likely to be frustrating. There'll be long crevasse end-runs, and your chances of summitting will probably not be great, even with the typically good weather of September. So, don't go counting on summitting, and don't look at a failure to summit as a failure. Go counting on having an experience that most people you know will never know, and will never really be able to appreciate.

It seems like what qualifies a "sport" is competition. Otherwise, how in God's name could you call bridge (a demonstration event in the next Olympics) or chess (which Sports Illustrated covered back in the Bobby Fisher days) or bass fishing, sports? If that's the case, than climbing is certainly NOT a sport, since climbing is not about competition. Except, of course, "sport climbing," as mentioned above. So what is it? How do we dignify it? You could call it a "pursuit" or "a way of life" if you wanted to be dramatic, or you could just say, "it's something I enjoy doing." [This message has been edited by Alpine Tom (edited 07-31-2001).]

I'll be there. I'll be the fat guy without the breath to wheeze "googoocachoo!" at you on the climb up to Paradise. You know, you really ought to do the entire course over several years. (Except maybe the first 50 miles or so, which is pretty boring.) The climb up to Cayuse pass is really the most pleasant part of the ride, everyone agrees.

I guess you could just take the Arnold Schwarzenegger approach -- jump up and down while watching yourself in the mirror. If it jiggles, it's fat.

I did it (with Alex) a few weeks ago, and was surprised by how quick it seemed to go. In my opinion, it's certainly more interesting than the Emmonds route. The Emmonds route just goes on and on and on... You'll need boots that you can frontpoint in. We just used ice axes, but I would have felt more comfortable with a 2nd tool. Adams Glacier trip report I did this climb with Alex Krawarik, June 30-July 1. Conditions are just about perfect, but will probably be deteriorating soon. A lot of people have been doing this route; a woman we ran into at the camp said that about eight climbers were on it on Saturday, including a couple of climbers we saw topping out around 2:00 PM. We only saw one other party of two on Sunday. We got to the Killen Creek trailhead around 11:00, and arrived at High Camp in about 2.5 hrs. The trail was snowfree until after the PC trail, and even then snow was only in patches. There is a huge number of campsites scattered around; probably a hundred people could be camped around there without impacting each other much (unless you’re like that bunch that was there hollering and shouting until midnight.) Interestingly, we ran into John Burroughs, the president of Cascade Designs, on Sunday, and he said that the Divide Creek trail starts higher and is a bit shorter access to the High Camp. The map appears to bear this out; I don’t know why everyone directs climbers to the Killen Creek trail. We left camp around 4:30 AM Sunday (Canada Day!) and were at the base of the climb in about an hour. The approach is pretty obvious, and there were boot tracks to follow, but there are a number of open crevasses on the approach; it might have the most objective danger on the climb. The glacier itself was in very good shape, very hard snow, icy towards the top. It’s a fairly constant 30-35 degree angle most of the way. It was easy to get around the obstacles on the way up. At the top are a couple of big crevasses, including a very impressive bergschrund with a 15’ thick snow bridge, but once that goes, the finish is going to be a challenge. Also, towards the top things are pretty icy, since it gets the afternoon sun there. Thanks to whoever those guys were who were on the route so late on Saturday; they left nice deep steps in the upper part of the route, which made things much easier for us. We topped out in around 6 hours; since it was my first time on Adams, I insisted on slogging the last half-mile or so to the true summit. Equipment notes: I wore my leathers and hinged crampons, which are totally unsuitable for this sort of route. In fact, I managed to get one crampon twisted sideways on my boot while sidestepping on the hard surface, something I’ve never had happen before. Alex had no problems at all with his plastic boots and aluminum crampons. We roped up, but didn’t set any pro. We just used ice axes; a second tool might have been convenient if you’re a worrier like me. We descended the North Ridge, which is in (comparatively) good shape. A number of parties had climbed it this weekend, including one group we met near the summit who’d come in to do the Lava Glacier headwall, but decided it was in bad shape (it looked pretty bad.) The N. Ridge seemed pretty twisty and crumbly, with plenty of exposure, where a slip on a loose bit of rock (and there's a LOT of loose rock!) could send you on a really long ride down onto the Lava Glacier. The route didn’t look very appealing to me, but Alex thought it might be worth doing, and there were sure a lot of people on it. Start VERY early, when everything is still frozen in place. There are several campsites near the bottom of the N. Ridge, it’d be worthwhile camping there to save some time. We descended with one party of three who’d camped at the bottom of the ridge, and they made the summit in 3 1/2 hours. [This message has been edited by Alpine Tom (edited 07-02-2001).] I pasted the trip report from an earlier cached version of the board for purposes of filing in the Trip Report Index on 2-4-04. --Off White

I think Lambone is on the right track. Their primary responsibility is safety. Given the kinds of people whom we all see out there if I was in their job I'd overstate the dangers, too. Sure, some rangers are jerks, just like some cops, and some baristas, are jerks. I doubt that people become NPS rangers beause they want to sit on the butts, and they SURE don't do it for the money. There was a report of a woman who hiked up halfdome (?) last year and called on her cell phone for a helicopter rescue because she was tired, and threatened to sue the ranger because they refused to send one. I'm sure any NPS ranger could tell you stories like that that they witnessed until you got tired of listening. I think we all got pretty worked up reading Pencil Pusher's story about Judd. I'm guessing folks like Juddd are a regular occurance for MRNP rangers. Imagine having to deal with Judds a couple of times a week, all summer.

Actually, quitting before a summit "because the conditions just didn't look safe" does a lot to reassure my wife. So, whenever I fail to summit, I report "it didn't look safe" whatever the real reason. That and a cellular phone, so I can call on the climb (when there's service) to let her know I'm fine and it was no big deal. It's my feeling that it's easier to be safe climbing than, say, driving to work, because you're in someplace relatively novel, so you're more likely to pay attention than driving down I-5 for the 900th time, late to work and annoyed at the jerk who just cut you off. Even cycling to work, like I do, you tend not to pay attention when you've ridden the route a lot. I get to work and realize I have no recollection of most of the ride; that never happens in the mountains. But I question some of those statistics too -- 1 in 5000 people die of the flu?