KaskadskyjKozak

just dumping data as you usually do is meaningless. Your new plot like the previous ones isn't addressing the increasing disparity in access to higher education between low and high income families that was discussed. The advantage in educated population we had relative to other nations is not only long gone, but is likely bound to get worse now that the middle class is broke, can't borrow anymore (which as you know helped many over the last few decades to get a college education) and now that your types refuse to fund public education appropriately. I am not very familiar with trade schools but I suspect that a greater fraction of the pop in Europe goes to trade schools than in the US and I don't think trade schools are post high school edu in Europe. As I already said, trade schools can be a reasonable option if they lead to stable and living wage work, which is increasingly doubtful in the little paradise you guys created. 1) Access to higher education in the US is comparable to other industrialized nations 2) Nowhere *near* 100% of folks in any country attends postsecondary education by the age of 34 You're not only not so great in your analytical skills, but as a supposed "scientist" you sure seem incapable of understanding the simplest bar-chart. Oh, yeah, you can always blame your lack of attention on the fact that your hair is on fire.

It's all about emotion. And then insulting the other side. Judging from the chart above, it looks like it's still about dodging questions about equality of access. Nonsense.

and in what utopia is there no need for people building houses, maintaining infrastructure, repairing plumbing, electricians, cleaning teeth, etc. and if an 18 year old has no idea what to do with himself, best to shuttle him off to college rather than work 2-3 years and have time to think about the former question before pursuing it- if you think otherwise you're a service tool.

+1. Everything is just fine the way it is! Conservatism at its finest. Sorry for spoiling this conversation by introducing data! Look at us! Down in the mud with...Sweden! Germany - uhhhh..Nevermind! Japan - Ditto! It's all about emotion. And then insulting the other side.

And Rob will be saying there is no problem? Status quo is just fine?

+1. Everything is just fine the way it is! Conservatism at its finest. Yeah, that's what everyone is saying. Great "analytical skills". Here's a clue - when people (or internet bots) are constantly harping on how their hair is on fire and the crisis is at hand signifies imminent disaster, the response will typically be to debunk that bullshit.

Could you be any more repugnant, or throw an even noisier temper-tantrum?

ummm, are you playing the (humorless) role of j_bot now?

Fixed that for 'ya

I would say it all depends on the young man or woman. If they had a particular inclination and skill set, were interested in some trade but thinking that for some reason the had to go to college to "succeed" - well then a bit of an analysis is in order. I know folks, including family, that in retrospect would have done a hell of a lot better getting trained in, say PT assistant or dental assistant; plumbing or engine repair - rather than the English and Labor Studies degrees they came out with - both from a financial and overall life benefit standpoint. Exactly. It depends. And maximizing salary is not everything in life.

I've seen stoners eat raw top ramen. That can't be good for you. :noway"

While I think that there should be more done to provide access to kids going the college I would argue just as much for impoved access to technical schools and apprenticeship programs. Shoot - my car mechanic has got to be the most well-read, well-educated person I know. AND he knows how to fix things, which most college grads seem to be afraid of. Plus, he works 4 days a week and likely matches or beats my salary. College is definately not the only alternative and certainly not the only way to develop critical thinking. Yes. Precisely.

Homeopathics! a very lucrative area of private education, as i understand it.

While I think that there should be more done to provide access to kids going the college I would argue just as much for impoved access to technical schools and apprenticeship programs. Shoot - my car mechanic has got to be the most well-read, well-educated person I know. AND he knows how to fix things, which most college grads seem to be afraid of. Plus, he works 4 days a week and likely matches or beats my salary. College is definately not the only alternative and certainly not the only way to develop critical thinking. Yes. Where is the head slamming into desk emoticon? What I love is how a thread about the Greek economy imploding, which in large part is due to excesses in government bloat, morphed into "US education is too expensive", then into "college is good". The next step of course is to make the connection from "college is good" to advocate funding through taxes everyone's college education, and ignore the excesses that this causes (which we already see mentioned in this thread), leading in the worst case to economic collapse - hello Greece! But hey, let's just spew a few banalities about corporate shills, freedumb, etc. and demonize the right-wing to ignore the real questions and problems.

I've heard pot can help the chronically morose learn to laugh. Sounds like medical marijuana has a future for j_bot!

SERVICE GOON!

Don't get me wrong, I'm psyched that those folks can get back to doing whatever it is they were doing and free up some resources better spent somewhere else. But after spending time in Los Angeles over the last couple years and seeing plenty of the homeless and destitute with joints to their lips instead of pints of MD 20/20, I'm skeptical about the broader impacts. Real good marijuana-infused baked goods down there though... Soma for the peeps!

No, no, no... the public needs to finance any and all educational choices, irrespective of what tangible benefit such an education may yield, and irrespective of the (rising) cost of the education. Don't address the cost issue at all. Make the rich pay. Great conclusions from our "educated" liberal cohort and their critical/thinking/analytic skills, no?

There is no such thing as "free".

BTW, I agree with you on the utility of General Ed. requirements beyond pure-tech. That's kind of why I chose to go here: linky rather than take the easy way out elsewhere on the same university campus.

Interesting. How did you "realize" that? I mean, did you know JayB when he was 20. I did. He lived one room over.

Of course all of Americas ills would be fixed if only everyone could go to college irrespective of aptitude or will. The result will be an enlightened populace of intellectuals who all can read, write, think critically, and, of course, vote dumbocrat! And everyone will make more money, live healthier, and not work at Walmart or McDonalds!

No, I think his claim is they didn't get a four degree because of bad parenting and access counts for nothing. One thing's for sure. Less access to higher education is definitely better for America. Cuz, you know, college doesn't really make you any smarter - not if you don't deserve it, anyway. No correlation or causality required. Hell yeah. Drop all admissions standards and just pay for tuition 100% with taxes. One size fits all for everyone!

"PS: The biggest hurdle I face in the engineering world is people who can't write or communicate worth a damn " I'm sure they're thrilled to communicate ideas with you.

which shouldn't be too difficult since no moron follows you around smearing your person at every turn. Insults take various form: for example they can be crude or not. Your not being crude doesn't mean you don't use insults and personal attacks. Commenting in this fashion without providing a demonstration of your claims once in a while is acceptable in my book but doing it at what seems every single appearance of yours on this board puts you in the same category as KKK. YOU dispatch more gratuitous insults than anyone else in this thread j-bot.