billcoe

Gavin or Jason: any overview maps or directions of the locations of the routes/formations you noted below??

Rob, I have all kinds of negative shit to say about Paul. Don't have time to list them, but if you buy me a beer:-) ........ However, he remains the only candidate addressing what I consider some the largest unaddressed major issues facing our country into the future. The relationship between citizens and government, our forigon policy, the government being able to pass laws abrogating the constitution and our history. Those were huge issues along those lines developing with the Bush administration that I thought Obama would do better at than Grandpa Simpson. Since McCain didn't address them in his campaign, and Barack is a constitutional scholar and was "community activist" and all, many of us most likely assumed he'd address some or all of them. He has not. In fact it appears that Obama has pressed his foot to the Bush big business/big government/totalitarianism craziness accelerator and is taking the country faster down the road to totalitarianism/fascism than Bush and his big business cronies. Frankly, it's disturbing that all of the candidates except Ron Paul accept this BS.

No. Although you can write to your congressman or someone who cares. Well, ask Pat how long the ACLU has been trying to get into court over the federal government "monitoring" ...lets call it what it is, warrantless surveillance, the recording of all phone calls in the US. All of your phone calls are recorded and checked. All. The internet is watched with equal zeal. Warrantless surveillance via computers, looking for the boogieman and the terrorists, criminals. If we aren't one I suppose we really shouldn't care if the feds hang out in your closet or your bedroom. Record our phone calls and read our email. Is that violation of privacy and generally accepted to be violating the constitution? Yes, pretty much by unanimous agreement. Is it still going on? I think so. Does the ACLU, with deep pockets and plentiful skilled lawyers have the right to take it to court to have it looked at and stopped? No. The courts say they do not have standing. You can have your politician do something about it. Last I heard, since the article I linked the ACLU had refiled the case and it had been tossed out again. http://archive.frontpagemag.com/readArticle.aspx?ARTID=27371 "The American Civil Liberties Union's Steven Shapiro is one of the best lawyers in the United States. Still, he was flat wrong when he told the New York Times that a federal appeals court's July 6 dismissal of the ACLU's challenge to the Bush administration's now-defunct Terrorist Surveillance Program "deprives Americans of any ability to challenge the illegal surveillance of their telephone calls and emails." No, no, no. The ruling by the Sixth U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals that the plaintiffs--the ACLU, the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), journalist Christopher Hitchens, et al.--do not have standing to sue does not deprive Americans of the ability to challenge the warrantless surveillance of al Qaeda's wartime communications into and out of the United States. It deprives them of the ability to challenge the program in court. They can challenge it through political channels--and already have done so successfully. Bowing to criticism, the administration eliminated the program, at least in its most controversial form, early this year." So the "program" was "eliminated" but the NSA still records every call. So it goes.

Now the "crazy fucker" is going off on the constitution again. How F**ing whack is that? We don't need no stinkeen constitution or no stinkeen liberty:-) That's no way to get elected boy! Crazy talk. http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/gop-presidential-primary/201335-rep-paul-says-defense-bill-assures-descent-into-totalitarianism "Rep. Paul says defense bill assures ‘descent into totalitarianism’ By Jonathan Easley - 12/26/11 09:25 AM ET GOP presidential candidate Ron Paul warned that the National Defense Authorization Act, which was passed by Congress this month, will accelerate the country’s “slip into tyranny” and virtually assures “our descent into totalitarianism.” “The founders wanted to set a high bar for the government to overcome in order to deprive an individual of life or liberty,” Paul, the libertarian congressman, said Monday in a weekly phone message to supporters. “To lower that bar is to endanger everyone. When the bar is low enough to include political enemies, our descent into totalitarianism is virtually assured. The Patriot Act, as bad as its violations against the Fourth Amendment was, was just one step down the slippery slope. The recently passed National Defense Authorization Act continues that slip into tyranny, and in fact, accelerates it significantly.” The NDAA is the nearly $670 billion defense spending bill that covers the military budget and funding for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. One controversial provision mandates the detention of terror suspects and reaffirms the administration’s authority to detain those suspected of having ties to terrorist organizations. “The Fifth Amendment is about much more than the right to remain silent in the face of government questioning,” Paul continued. “It contains very basic and very critical stipulations about the due process of law. The government cannot imprison a person for no reason and with no evidence presented and without access to legal council. The danger of the NDAA is its alarmingly vague, undefined criteria for who can be indefinitely detained by the U.S. government without trial.” “It is no longer limited to members of Al Qaeda or the Taliban, but anyone accused of substantially supporting such groups or associated forces,” Paul continued. “How closely associated, and what constitutes substantial support? What if it was discovered that someone who committed a terrorist act was once involved with a charity? Or suppose a political candidate? Are all donors of that candidate or supporters of that candidate now suspects and subject to indefinite detainment? Is that charity now an associated force?” The White House initially threatened to veto the NDAA because of the detainee language, saying it would tie the hands of law enforcement officials. But the administration dropped the veto threat before the bill passed the House, as the bill’s supporters argued that there were sufficient waivers. “The president’s widely expanded view of his own authority to detain Americans indefinitely even on American soil is for the first time in this legislation codified in law,” Paul said. “That should chill all of us to our cores.” “The Bill of Rights has no exceptions for really bad people or terrorists or even non-citizens. It is a key check on government power against any person. That is not a weakness in our legal system, it is the very strength of our legal system. The NDAA attempts to justify abridging the Bill of Rights on the theory that rights are suspended in a time of war, and the entire United States is a battlefield in the war on terror. This is a very dangerous development, indeed. Beware.” There's some wack crazy shit, eh? Next he'll be ranting on Guantanamo or borrowing huge sums to expand the continuous wars for empire? Wacky

I believe that used cams, in fact, Metolius U shaped cams specifically, consistently represent the best gear buy today. For some reason everyone thinks that the Camalots should sell used for about the price you can get them new, sometimes even more - while the Metolius cams, which are friggan awesome and also last forever, sell used for a steep discount. There isn't enough Mastercams to be reliably purchased so I'd exclude them form that statement, they are new enough to still sell at a premium when used. However, both the Metolius U stem - the 3 and 4 cams units, are very plentiful on the secondary market. Bought my kid some used gear for Christmas this year. Tossed him some of the 18 Wild Country Helium's that David Hiers sold which looked brand new ($4 each) that he'd advertised months back in the yard sale on this site. I also got the lad a set of used (old style, not the DAT) Metolius 4 cam units. The seller had said they were in "good condition": they weren't. He never mentioned any "falls". But I got a hell of a deal, and no one wanted them as they didn't have any slings. After I got them I simply sent them to Metolius for the factory to sew new slings on. $3 per sling is the charge. They also replaced 2 of the U shaped wires as well ($8.00 per unit) because they had bends inhibiting smooth functioning, most likely from falls over edges. The business end of the cams, the cams themselves, looked great, and they had featured prominently in the ebay sale photo. Wow, those beater things came back, clean, lubed, and all shiny polished and new looking. Literally brand new. The boy thought they were brand new, and was shocked that they were used and also at how cheap I'd gotten them for. Damned impressive. Metolius for the win! ...anyway, guess I'd better tell him not to fall on them now.

Maybe you have some better alternative that you'd like to share with us VV? ...and there's already a Ron Paul thread if you are thinking of making Rob (more) mental.... Waiting for the kids to wake up and whip out some breakfast, merry Christmas all!

https://oregonup.us/upweb/up/up_search.asp If you live in Oregon, the state has a list of unclaimed property ($), linked above. Just found both Brothers and my sister in law are due some scratch if they just file for it. Woot! Now that's a Merry Christmas! regards to all Chritmas?

Any of you? LOL! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2078131/Owner-huge-pot-plant-decorated-baubles-jailed-Christmas.html Hopeful the judge has the spirit of Christmas and is easy on him.

Yeah Bone, you're number 2! Read it slowly, second line. Pat, there will be always be space in my bug out room for someone with humor, you can come over and share the survival certificate when Iran is attacked by the Israelis (and we get drug in) this coming fall and things go toast. Bring 20 cases of dehydrated food. Ps, keep your car filled up so you can get here, ya really don't know when the party will actually start.

Head up with Jeff and have him point it all out. Last time I was up there I was looking at a thin crack line and was thinking, that should go and wondering what it was, so he explained that he'd cleaned it and we'd done it with me lead it couple months back. I'll just get you lost up there, go with him. He did one up there with Timetraveler that's positively worth doing (if it's dry, aiding it would be insanely out of the question wet). Timetraveler Buttress?

Pat was the guy on the couch that was funnier than hell.

The evidence seems to indicate that the voting machines in Ohio were rigged by the Bush people. Not saying Bush even knew of it, the man in charge of the rigging died under mysterious circumstances real real soon after he chose to go public with it. "Dead men tell no tales" LOL. True that. A quick google on that story, maybe not even the best links but these can get you started if you are interested. http://freepress.org/departments/display/19/2011/4239 http://jonathanturley.org/2011/07/26/dead-men-do-tell-tales-of-rigged-elections/ Got to love computers and computerized voting machines eh? I think we will see increased news stories and "leaked" disinformation about Paul increase as time goes on. If you can get independents like Rob and jb arguing your case you've got it made. You have to be a big money elite (like Obama) or they'll cut you down. Paul appears to not be supportive of the big money elite. Ergo....whack! He'll be presented as a grandma raping racist baby killer soon. "Do you still beat your wife?" kind of thing. "Prove it, ya liar". Get him on the defensive and then he'll bow out. It's politics baby, that's the way it rolls. You will get a big money elite for President. It just amazes me that some of you argue that republicans and dickheads or dems are asswipes, when they are in reality: identical ...with a few minor tweeks here or there.

LOL! Ujahn reminded me that this isn't limited to the elderly: he'd forgotten the rack a bit ago and had to go back to retrieve it. Despite having grey hair, he's still got 20 some years to catch up with me.... Someone else was telling me about forgetting the ropes, but I forgot who. Anyway, we all know that men get manlier as they age

Sorry if I wasn't in conversation mode. That wuz me wif jeff. I love climbing with Jeff so if I get invited, I feel pretty darned special:-) They are Frikkan awesome routes up there once you get off the deck. The first 100' of that North side always seems wet and slimy and has never appealed to me at all, but it gets dry up high as you know. You should go do either one of them once it closes, both are real good. Looks like you got a lot done out there that day! Holy crap. High mileage day Ivan. Afterwards...or in between routes I guess: Jeff and I climbed the 1901 route to the top. I'd never done it before and had no idea. Jeff has been up there cleaning off key sections, it's pretty darned good and a hoot because of the history.

Sweet stuff! I heard you bellowing down there, and Jim said you were down there someplace hanging after yer 2 solos but I never did see you. Looked warmer on our side and we were rapping down past iceckles! Wow!

Which vote do you say makes him unsuitable Rob? From: http://www.issues2000.org/Ron_Paul.htm Voting record on environment: Recycling consumes more energy than it saves. (Apr 2011) Neglected property rights during the industrial revolution. (Jan 2008) Property rights are the foundation of all rights. (Sep 2007) Scored 14% on Humane Society Scorecard on animal protection. (Jan 2007) Voted NO on $2 billion more for Cash for Clunkers program. (Jul 2009) Voted NO on protecting free-roaming horses and burros. (Jul 2009) Voted NO on environmental education grants for outdoor experiences. (Sep 2008) Voted NO on $9.7B for Amtrak improvements and operation thru 2013. (Jun 2008) Voted NO on increasing AMTRAK funding by adding $214M to $900M. (Jun 2006) Voted YES on barring website promoting Yucca Mountain nuclear waste dump. (May 2006) Voted NO on speeding up approval of forest thinning projects. (Nov 2003) Rated 5% by the LCV, indicating anti-environment votes. (Dec 2003) Give tax breaks for start-up farms for 10-year commitment. (Jan 2008) Make tax deduction permanent for conservation easements. (Mar 2009) Repeal requirements for compact fluorescent bulbs. (Jan 2011) Recycling consumes more energy than it saves The green movement has brought about all kinds of changes in the way we live. Some of the changes are not necessarily bad, but the good changes and conservation could have come without all the programs that actually have a negative economic and environmental impact. Certainly, recycling for the most part consumes more energy that it saves. Recycling aluminum makes economic sense, but that would happen even without the demand to recycle everything from paper to glass and plastic. Source: Liberty Defined, by Rep. Ron Paul, p.140 , Apr 19, 2011 Neglected property rights during the industrial revolution Q: Schwarzenegger has proposed that California be allowed to implement much tougher environmental regulations on emission requirements than apply to the rest of the country. Do you side with the governor or with the Bush administration? A: Yes, California should do what they want. When we’re dealing with the environment and greenhouse gases, [it’s] property rights. We neglected during the industrial revolution property rights, and governments and big corporations got together and colluded. Source: 2008 Republican debate at Reagan Library in Simi Valley , Jan 30, 2008 Property rights are the foundation of all rights We must stop special interests from violating property rights and literally driving families from their homes, farms and ranches. We also face another danger in regulatory takings: Through excess regulation, governments deprive property owners of significant value and use of their properties--all without paying “just compensation.” Property rights are the foundation of all rights in a free society. Without the right to own a printing press, for example, freedom of the press becomes meaningless Source: 2008 House campaign website, www.ronpaul2008.com, “Issues” , Sep 1, 2007 Scored 14% on Humane Society Scorecard on animal protection The Humane Society 109th Congress Scorecard on animal protection scored Paul 14 out of 100, based on: Paul voted against the Horse Slaughter Prevention Act (HR.503): To bar slaughtering horses for human consumption. Paul voted for the “poison pill” Amendment delaying implementation of HR.503. Paul did not vote on the BLM amendment on 5/19/2005: To bar slaughtering wild horses & burros. Paul voted against the Pets Evacuation and Transportation Standards (PETS) Act (HR.3858): To consider the needs of people with pets and service animals in disaster planning. Paul did not co-sponsor the Animal Fighting Prohibition Act (S.382): To criminalize dogfighting & cockfighting. Paul did not co-sponsor the Downed Animal Protection Act (HR.3931): to ban “downed” (unable to walk to slaughter) cattle, pigs & sheep in human food. Paul did not sign the Funding Letter of 4/28/2006, to the Agriculture Appropriations Subcommittee for animal protection. Source: Humane Society 109th Congress Scorecard, www.fund.org , Jan 31, 2007 Voted NO on $2 billion more for Cash for Clunkers program. Congressional Summary:Emergency supplemental appropriations of $2 billion for the Consumer Assistance to Recycle and Save (CARS) Program. Proponent's argument to vote Yes:Rep. OBEY (D, WI-7): The cash for clunkers program has proven even more wildly popular than its strongest supporters had predicted. Just last month, Congress passed the program, which provided up to $4,500 if you trade in your old gas guzzler for a new car that gets better mileage. That was done in the hopes of spurring some new car sales and encouraging people to be a little more environmentally friendly. We provided $1 billion in the supplemental to get it going, enough for about 250,000 sales--which was just about exhausted in one week. This bill transfers $2 billion from the Department of Energy's Innovative Technology Loan Guarantee program, which doesn't expect to award funding until late next year. Opponent's argument to vote No:Rep. LEWIS (R, CA-41): In the majority's haste to slam legislation with no time for consideration or amendments, we are now seeing the effects of such shortsighted martial law tactics. Senator Feinstein tried to negotiate some changes to improve the program but was told that it was this way or the highway. Not one hearing on the Cash for Clunkers program, not one hearing on how the first billion dollars has been spent, not one hearing on how much money the program will need to get through the fiscal year. Many of my colleagues will say, This is a great program, and it is necessary for the revitalization of the car industry. I'm not really going to argue with those goals. However, are we sure this program is working like it's supposed to? I don't think so. This program has only been up and running 1 week. If that is how the government is going to handle billion-dollar programs affecting all Americans, I ask, Whatever will we do if the administration takes control of our health care system? Reference: Cash for Clunkers bill; Bill H.R. 3435 ; vote number 2009-H682 on Jul 31, 2009 Voted NO on protecting free-roaming horses and burros. Congressional Summary: Ensure that acreage available for wild and free-roaming horses and burros is at least equal to the acreage where they were found in 1971 update the inventory of such horses and burros annually maintain a thriving natural ecological balance on lands where such horses and burros are found establish sanctuaries for such horses and burros research and implement enhanced fertility control for mares & stallions. Proponent's argument to vote Yes:Rep. NICK RAHALL (D, WV-3): Earlier this year, the BLM made a truly shocking announcement. This Federal agency announced future plans to destroy, i.e., slaughter, 30,000 healthy wild horses and burros entrusted to their care by the American people. How in the world can a Federal agency be considering massive slaughter of animals the law says they are supposed to be protecting? The bill before us gives the agency as many options as possible to avoid destroying these animals. Opponent's argument to vote No:Rep. DOC HASTINGS (R, WA-4): Across our Nation, Americans are struggling to pay their bills; 9.5% of Americans are out of work. With this backdrop, what is the response of this Democrat Congress to record unemployment and skyrocketing deficits? Their response is to create a $700 million welfare program for wild horses and burros. If the American people want an illustration of just how out of touch this Congress has become on spending, they need to look no further. In the last Congress, the House passed legislation to ban the commercial slaughter of wild horses and burros, that cost taxpayers less than $500,000 a year. Now we're looking at a bill that, again, bans slaughter of these animals but then proceeds to spend $700 million to create a new welfare program for wild horses. Republicans are focused on creating the jobs in this country, but this Democrat Congress seems to be more worried about wild burros and wild horses. Reference: Restore Our American Mustangs Act; Bill H.R.1018 ; vote number 2009-H577 on Jul 17, 2009 Voted NO on environmental education grants for outdoor experiences. Congressional Summary: Requires Environmental Education and Training program grantees to: ensure that environmental education programs and curricula advance the teaching of interdisciplinary courses that include strong field components; bring teachers into contact with working environmental professionals; encourage individuals traditionally underrepresented in environmental careers Proponent's argument to vote Yes:Rep. JOHN SARBANES (D, MD-3): This bill creates a new National Capacity Environmental Education grant program for which education associations apply competitively for grants that would fund model programs that get children into nature and really have them experiencing the environment. Rep. BUCK McKEON (R, CA-25): This bill incorporates scientifically-based and technology-driven teaching methods into environmental education. Unfortunately, the new National Capacity Environmental Education Program is duplicative of the existing environmental education program already being run by the EPA. Still, I do not intend to oppose its passage. Opponent's argument to vote No:Rep. MICHELE BACHMANN (R, MN-6): H.R. 3036 continues our Nation down the ill-fated road of shifting control of school curricula away from the parents and teachers and local school boards who best know what their children need into the hands of Federal Government and its one-size-fits-all approach. To best serve our children's educational needs, local school boards need flexibility to target resources where they are needed most. The needs of individual school districts are not homogenous and are most certainly not best understood by bureaucrats in Washington. This bill represents a step in the wrong direction. Forcing local school districts to direct scarce resources away from core curricula to serve a political agenda will only further suppress the academic performance of America's next generation. Reference: No Child Left Inside Act; Bill H.R.3036 ; vote number 2008-H614 on Sep 18, 2008 Voted NO on $9.7B for Amtrak improvements and operation thru 2013. Congressional Summary: Authorizes appropriations for FY2009-FY2013 for Amtrak capital and operating grants; Amtrak repayment of long-term debt and capital leases; and the rail cooperative research program. Authorizes grants for th Indeed, these achievements are occurring when there is a greater need than ever for alternatives to our congested highways and skies. To alleviate this congestion and strengthen our energy security, we need to invest in intercity passenger rail. Other Reference: Passenger Rail Investment and Improvement Act; Bill HR6003 ; vote number 2008-400 on Jun 11, 2008 Voted NO on increasing AMTRAK funding by adding $214M to $900M. Voting YES on this amendment would restore $214 million in funding for AMTRAK, bringing the total annual expenditure for AMTRAK to $1.114 billion. The chairman of the Railroad Subcommittee explained the increase as follows: Unlike aviation, highways and transit, there is no dedicated funding for investing in our Nation's passenger rail service. This amendment restores $214 million to the Amtrak account, taking it to $1.114 billion, which is still about $300 million less than we had during the course of last year's discussion. Last year the President sent up a budget of zero for Amtrak. We had an amendment process that we went through this time. This time we are up to $900 million in the bill [without this amendment]. But if you look at that $900 million, there is only $500 million for capital expenditures, out of which has to come a debt service of $280 million, which only leaves $220 million for the capital needs of this country for Amtrak, for passenger rail. There is nothing for operation, and I know that the response to that is going to be that there are some incentive grants in the bill. Opponents of the amendment say that it would increase funding for Amtrak by gutting and eliminating critical programs, including safety programs, resulting in reductions in force at several agencies. Reference: Department of Transportation appropriations; Bill HR 5576 Amendment 1008 ; vote number 2006-263 on Jun 13, 2006 Voted YES on barring website promoting Yucca Mountain nuclear waste dump. An amendment to prohibit funding the "Yucca Mountain Youth Zone" website. Voting YES indicates opposition to using Yucca Mountain as the national nuclear waste repository. The amendment's sponsor says: I would like to introduce the American people to the newest member of the Bush administration's energy policy team. His name is Yucca Mountain Johnny. He is the star of the Energy Department's Yucca Mountain Youth Zone Web site devoted to brainwashing school children into believing that burying the Nation's nuclear garbage 90 miles from Los Vegas is safe. The Web site features games and activities to make high level nuclear waste fun. High level nuclear waste is not fun. It is dangerous, and the Department of Energy should not be using taxpayer money for a propaganda tool. I would probably not be as upset with Joe Camel, excuse me, Yucca Mountain Johnny, if there was a more balanced approach on this Web site. It doesn't talk about the potential of accidents or being an inviting target for terrorists. It doesn't talk about the fact that Yucca Mountain is in a volcanic and seismic zone area. It doesn't say anything about the existence of safer and cheaper alternatives. Among Yucca Mountain Johnny's witty sayings, he says, "The worst mistake is never making one." Well, Yucca Mountain is a mistake. This Web site is a mistake. Yucca Mountain Johnny is a mistake, and to promote the proposed nuclear waste repository to our children under the guise of education is a big mistake. The amendment's opponents respond: To my knowledge, nobody has questioned the accuracy or truth of what is on the Web site. My guess is that most of the children that access this website use it for term papers and papers in their classrooms that they have to do on nuclear power. Whether you oppose or support the repository, we should at least want the facts out to our children and adults who wish to use that same Web site about just what exactly it is. Reference: Energy and water development appropriations bill; Bill HR 5427 Amendment 919 ; vote number 2006-200 on May 24, 2006 Voted NO on speeding up approval of forest thinning projects. Vote to adopt the conference report on the bill that would reduce and expedite (speed up) environmental and judicial reviews of forest thinning projects. The bill would authorize $760 million a year from fiscal 2004 to fiscal 2008. The Bureau of Land Management and the US Forest Service would have the authorization to remove vegetation that could cause or assist the spread of wildfires, disease or insect infestation. All forest thinning project would come after public meetings had been held. Forest thinning would be restricted to land that is within a 1.5 miles of at-risk communities , high-risk land that serves as a home for threatened and endangered species, high-risk land in the area of municipal water sources and and high-risk land that is specifically susceptible to disease or insect infestation. Reference: Healthy Forests Restoration Act; Bill HR 1904 ; vote number 2003-656 on Nov 21, 2003 Rated 5% by the LCV, indicating anti-environment votes. Paul scores 5% by the LCV on environmental issues The League of Conservation Voters (LCV) is the political voice of the national environmental movement and the only organization devoted full-time to shaping a pro-environment Congress and White House. We run tough and effective campaigns to defeat anti-environment candidates, and support those leaders who stand up for a clean, healthy future for America. Through our National Environmental Scorecard and Presidential Report Card we hold Congress and the Administration accountable for their actions on the environment. Through regional offices, we build coalitions, promote grassroots power, and train the next generation of environmental leaders. The 2003 National Environmental Scorecard provides objective, factual information about the environmental voting records of all Members of the first session of the 108th Congress. This Scorecard represents the consensus of experts from 20 respected environmental and conservation organizations who selected the key votes on which Members of Congress should be graded. LCV scores votes on the most important issues of the year, including environmental health and safety protections, resource conservation, and spending for environmental programs. Scores are calculated by dividing the number of pro-environment votes by the total number of votes scored. The votes included in this Scorecard presented Members of Congress with a real choice on protecting the environment and help distinguish which legislators are working for environmental protection. Except in rare circumstances, the Scorecard excludes consensus action on the environment and issues on which no recorded votes occurred. Source: LCV website 03n-LCV on Dec 31, 2003 Give tax breaks for start-up farms for 10-year commitment. Paul co-sponsored giving tax breaks for start-up farms for 10-year commitment This bill amends the Internal Revenue Code to exclude from gross income 100% of the gain, up to $500,000, from the sale of qualified farm property to a first-time farmer who certifies that such property will be used for farming purposes for 10 years. Allows a 50% exclusion for the sale of qualified farm property to any other person who certifies that such property will be used for farming purposes for 10 years. Allows a 25% exclusion for the sale of qualified farm property to any other person for any other use. Defines "qualified farm property" as real estate which is used for farming purposes for a specified three-year period and in which there was participation by the taxpayer or the taxpayer's family. Source: Beginning Farmers and Ranchers Act (H.R.5134) 08-HR5134 on Jan 23, 2008 Make tax deduction permanent for conservation easements. Paul signed H.R.1831 & S.812 Amends the Internal Revenue Code to make permanent the tax deduction for charitable contributions by individuals and corporations of real property interests for conservation purposes. Known in the Senate as the Rural Heritage Conservation Extension Act of 2009. Source: Conservation Easement Incentive Act 09-HR1831 on Mar 31, 2009 Repeal requirements for compact fluorescent bulbs. Paul co-sponsored Better Use of Light Bulbs Act Repeals provisions of the Energy Independence and Security Act of 2007 concerning lighting energy efficiency, including provisions that: prescribe energy efficiency standards for general service incandescent lamps, rough service lamps, and other designated lamps; direct the Secretary of Energy (DOE) to conduct an annual assessment of the market for general service lamps and compact fluorescent lamps; carry out a proactive national program of consumer awareness, information, and education about lamp labels and energy-efficient lighting choices; prohibit a manufacturer, distributor, retailer, or private labeler from distributing in commerce specified adapters for incandescent lamps; carry out a lighting technology research and development program; set forth minimum energy efficiency standards for incandescent reflector lamps; set forth requirements for the use of energy efficient lighting fixtures and bulbs in public building construction, alteration, and acquisition; and require metal halide lamp fixtures and energy efficiency labeling for designated consumer electronic products. Provides that the Energy Policy and Conservation Act shall be applied and administered as if such provisions had not been enacted.

Rob, I suspect we both want what we feel are best for this country. All of these guys have huge failings in my eyes, certainly Paul and Obama as well. But what are the critical issues for our country going forward? I'd think that strong financials are critical. Respect for the constitution is near the top as well. Those are mine. What I've found with Paul is that there is a lot of disinformation spread. If you google anything you have claimed, there is plenty of point/counterpoint you can read. The info is out there waist deep or deeper if you wish to go read it. Much like reading and believing everything one sees on Fox news, I'd suggest that you pull up what the man has said instead, from his mouth, or what he has actually voted on - instead of reading and believing the filtered things you see. You want to think someone is racist due to a newsletter that was written and edited by others had some untoward comments? Go read the comments directly, read what Paul has said. Or not. I have, don't believe Ron Paul is racist. Sorry. You might have forgotten that very charge was levied against Obama as well, ie. that Barack was a racist. Plenty of out of context things HE had said and done in that case were pitched by others to support that conclusion, in that case it was not what someone else had written like in Pauls case, but what Obama had said and done himself. I didn't believe that either. What are the important issues for our country? That we have expensive costs with military in 128 countries and a global expansionist policy abroad and creeping totalitarian control against citizens at home? I'll vote against that. Regards to you and yours Rob.

LOL, I wish I had any excuse Dane. Not even the first time I've spaced out a rack either. Last time was some Valley Giants and wide gear! In fact, that's been long enough that I've mentally forgotten the details of what went down, re-reading it I was like "HUH?!" http://cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/836841/Searchpage/1/Main/62673/Words/jasmine/Search/true/Re_Weedend_Rockclimbing_Pics#Post836841

Yes I will Steven, but Paul will be washed out soon in either case. To be president you have to lick big business and banking sac to get elected, otherwise, the goon squad will spread lies and disinformation on you. That's where this is at now, and I'd expect it to increase as it gets closer.

Bone, the Rocket Scince party there wants a President who can chose to kill American citizens without judicial review or due process, the one who gives tax breaks to the wealthy while running the country into the dirt ever faster financially, the one going for the win in Asscrackistan and supporting the corruption of the gov't there, the one who supports being able to peruse the war on terror with indefinite jail time via military tribunals against Americans rounded up by the Army inside of the US, the one keeping Guantanamo open with indefinite detentions and no due process to the loonies inside as we head towards ever bigger and bigger government and totalitarianism.... These kinds of "unimportant" things. Now that's change they can believe in! Of course, they'll still have the EPA until we run out of money and do into lockdown in a few short years if nothing changes. At least we know what they want I suppose.

You guys may be right and we need to accelerate our countries borrowing and get into debt even deeper. Barack is doing quite well at that, so I can see that he'd be your guy. I checked the debt clock this am and assuming you are both taxpayers it read that YOU, Rob: and You, Pat, each owed $134,345 for your portion to pay off the federal debt. It's now almost lunch and your share is at $134.348. http://www.usdebtclock.org/ Since this appears all but unstoppable, I can understand why you want to give up, let it keep rolling and just let the Fed and the big bankers pound sand up your ass. I suppose that later, you can figure out what you will tell your children about this. About why all the things you now profess to want to support will not be able to be supported due to lack of money. Maybe you have that speech prepared already, can you share it? Enjoy!

The gear whore thing could be an inherited gene. You might have to talk to the lad about that Dave, he high graded the rack and had his way with me last night:-) You know how some people have their kids borrowing their tools...? Seen below there. Although the boy gets a pro deal, he's broke so I bought him some used cams for Christmas Sent them back to Metolius for new slings ($3.00 each) and a few needed new wires ($6 I think) and as if they'd sprinkled pixie dust on Herman Cain and transformed him into Elvis, they startlingly made them functionally like brand new, shiny- pretty - the works.....A*frikkan*mazing. Wish I'd have a before/after shot. F*ing Metolius rules the planet!

Nice job Natasha!!!!

OMFG! Found it. Last night my boy asked me: "hey dad, wanna go to Smith?" I reply: Can't, gotta work". He says: "I'm getting paid to drive to Black Butte and do some work, gas is paid both ways, Jakes coming along and we want to get some routes in at Smith when we're there. I left all my stuff except for the harness and shoes back home can I borrow a couple of your ropes, a helmet and some draws to go to Smith. Maybe a few cams too......" "Sure" We head to the basement and I realize of my 8 lead ropes piled up inside of rope bags, I don't know which have middle marks and which don't. The boy assures me he knows how to find the middle but being the fretting dad I open and start checking anyway. 3rd rope bag I opened was a Metolius Rope Ranger Rope Bag, the one with the backpack straps, as I opened it up to look at the rope: doh

He can sum up his philosophy in a paragraph: "[The Washington Establishment] believes that if you have the freedom to keep what you earn and take care of yourself, you won't do it. They want to do it for you -- and they've been trying for the past 70 years, since the Great Depression. But we've learned that government can't do it, either." On an even more basic level, it would be nice to believe that people can take care of themselves without government help, but it just hasn't proved true in the past: Programs like Social Security and Medicare -- programs which run directly against America's Jeffersonian/libertarian tradition -- were necessary because people couldn't take care of themselves. The elderly, especially, had trouble paying medical bills after their working days ended. The American people, through our government, decided to make a very rudimentary deal: to make sure that our parents didn't starve or sleep in the streets or were unable to get medical care. There was nothing unconstitutional about that -- just as there's nothing unconstitutional about requiring people to have medical insurance now. The deal was made with the consent of the governed. In the real world, these are the most popular programs the government offers -- about 80% of the American people are happy with them. http://news.yahoo.com/12-days-till-iowa-ron-paul-not-politician-105500522.html Cue racist charges and race baiting posts....3...2...1...