RobBob

The REAL DFA?

anybody else think that this thread sux?

I thought Lene Gammelgaard's book sucked, after figuring out what Dru alluded to, and also because she was a piss-poor writer. One book that sucked overall, My Old Man and the Sea (WAY too sappy), had one great telegraph message in it. Sent by son in Montevideo to father in the US: "Wallet stolen by mediocre whore. Please send money."

Dwayner, for some reason I'm reminded of being near the front row at a Stones concert some 20 years ago. Looking at Keith Richards up close, it dawned on my young brain for the first time that you really do have the freedom to just about do yourself in, and that nobody's gonna stop you but yourself. Keith looked so bad that it was a sobering experience for me. Contrary to the conspiracy-theorists here, there ain't no "Big Brother" in the US. You have the freedom to act like Eminem, etc. if that's what you want to do.

Y'know what is really symbolic about the UN presence? That pussified Carolina Blue on their helmets.

WTF is due process? Is that kinda like what Neville Chamberlain gave Hitler after the Anschluss?

reducing world emissions from IC engines in vehicles seems like it would be pretty high on everybody's list. I have to suspect anyone who knocks that idea without research is simply a Bush-basher.

Okay Mtngoat, you gave me a slippery answer. I did not suggest not protecting them. I am suggesting that we DEAL WITH their little colonialism problem by telling them that WE MAY WITHOLD ALL OR PART OF THE TWELVE BILLION DOLLARS THAT WE GIVE THEM EVERY YEAR if they don't cease and desist. It's just that simple. And immediately we gain some clout with the moderates in the Arab world.

I'm not gay but kd lang has a good voice. And it's kd lang, DFA. Like ee cummings.

Goat, You are often so practical. We need oil. Why is Israel so sacred that you can totally overlook its bullying colonialist activity, and instead insist that we protect it regardless of its behavior. Leave Palestine out of your answer, please, focusing only on your rationale for protecting Israel at all costs in the face of alienating a large part of the rest of the world.

How many of you have parents/spouses/others that don't like this pursuit? How do you deal with it?

You all are a bunch of lude-popping freaks and liars.

Goat, If I were president, I *think* I could work with Israel, which has its roots in terrorism *without going to that degree*...

thumbs-up freeclimb. I was gonna suggest Heart of the Sea, the real story of Moby Dick, and more! Also read Ship of Gold in the Deep Blue Sea.

Back on-topic, Greg, I thought South was a great book. You noted that so many of the men were eager to get back to the war...what I remember was something like a third were killed in it. I want to read The Long Walk. Thanks for the tip. Another good one like that is by Jacob Walther. I believe the title is The Story of a Napoleanic Footsoldier. Once you read about their retreat from Russia in winter, you will never forget it.

Maybe we need to start a Krakauer thread. Frankly, IMO he's a pretty damn good writer; his stuff is head and shoulders above most of the other climbing books I've read. I'd like to hear why Dru feels the way he does about Into Thin Air...I trust you as someone who has researched the facts. But frankly, from what I gleaned about the face-to-faces between Anatoly and JK, it just sounded to me like a Russian brow-beating delivered to probably an introverted writer. That don't mean shit, in-and-of itself. But I have no inside facts whatsoever---you guys probably know the facts better than me. Greg, I never heard about photographic proof of anything, what was it? Hey, after that let's start a thread about whether Bonatti was really vindicated or not. Still think JK is a good writer. Eiger Dreams, Club Denali, Into Thin Air were all good reading in my opinion.

bobinc, you sarcastic little peckerwood, you have a point. It's one I have been trying to make for months, but apparently no one here agrees. Why are the Saudis, Egyptians, assorted Kuwaitis (since they keep killing our citizens) against us? It's our blind, unilateral support of Israel! Now, from strictly a US strategic interest standpoint (forgetting the lobbying efforts of AIPAC and the other Israeli influence heaped on our politicians), does it make sense to factor the Arab world's viewpoint of Israeli occupation of its neighbor's land? Yes, I believe it does. Unless we show some objectivity and deal firmly with Israel (and tell them that the days of colonialism are long gone and get the fuck back to your original borders), then the entire Arab world will continue to believe that we are blindly biased. At this point I have to agree with them. We have sold our souls to AIPAC, and we are paying for it. So, bobinc, even if we dump chocolate bars on the civilians, they are still bound to hate us. What will we do? Kill every last Arab? Or do the right thing in dealing firmly with Israel, so that we can start some productive dialog with the most moderate of the Arabs?

For the record, while Reagan ran up the debt in part with an arms race, in doing so he caused the Soviet Union to fail.

trask it's true. Rumsfeld was hunched over there beside Powell, and it was just weird looking!

Secondary notes: My wife the staunch Democrat was jabbing me with her elbow every time she detected hypocracy (my arm is bruised). Must say that both our eyes were rolling at the reference to "treasured forests." How about the AIDS relief to Africa? Was that as big a surprise to the rest of you as it was to me? Years from now it may be one of his most important legacies.

Allison, your politics don't allow you to objectively evaluate a speech. You may have been the only person in America who noticed his eyebrows. And don't you think the point of the lines about torture were intended to scare people? Look, I voted for the man, but I think that along with doing some things right, he has committed a major blunder that compromises our ability to come out of the current Middle East mess the way we want. That is the seemingly-blind support of Israel as it continues its settlements. He has also allowed Wolfowitz and Rumsfeld to have too much power in decisionmaking. (Did anyone notice Rumsfeld licking his lips and looking like a lizard during the speech?) That being said, I thought his speech was effective and well-delivered. The characterization of Iraq's behavior since 1991 was excellently done. The overall tone was positive, and his references to the US's responsibility as the primary superpower to act instead of wait for others probably resonated with most people. He even got in an early potshot at John Edwards, when referring to the financial burden that trial lawyers are adding to the healthcare system. I give him an A for last night. (I must say that I cringed when hearing 'nucular' though.)

rbw, my dad gave me a sweet Browning auto when I was a kid that loads on the left side. I can hold a couple of shells in my trigger hand and reload without much movement. I have other guns too now, but that old gun still my first choice.

Dr. Flash Amazing, once again recoiling in self-defense...

not me, rbw. That would be DFA (in a backhanded way). Where's he been, anyway?

I'm hurt, Iain. That was the unkindest cut of all.