Bug

I don't speak for Dawg. For me the issues are bolting willy-nilly in a wilderness. Using a power drill in the wilderness. The route is in. I would not get all bent out of shape knowing it will stay. But if it is used as a shining example of why we should do more of this sort of thing then I would say "clean up the whole mess". In short, when we stop bitching about it, some wanker with a power drill will think its OK to put another one right beside it and so forth.... That's when I will actively offer to help remove all bolts on Garfield.

"The Wilderness Act of 1964 institutionalized an idea, describing a wilderness as "an area where the earth and its community of life are untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain." By definition, then, it was a place where vehicles would not be allowed, where no permanent camps or structures could be made, where wildlife and its habitat would be kept in as primitive a condition as possible."" Excerpted from Wilderness America, a 1990 publication of The Wilderness Society.

Raindawg, Thank you for stimulating a genuine conversation on the merits of IB and it's wilderness status. The concept of wilderness is balked at by many but still manages to stir up support in the long run. Those who stand in its defense are often attacked on many levels as though they are responsible for taking something away. It is ironic that what is being taken away by those who balk can never be fully restored and what is preserved is there for all, over generations to come. Signed respectfully, Keith Schultz

I put some of those on my daughter's birthday cake Friday.

I have a degree in Religious Studies and took a lot of philosophy. Growing up, my reasons varied and changed. Sometimes to forget, sometimes to fit in, sometimes to get outside. All said and done, my reason is pure selfish pleasure. It's just really fun.

When I was in highschool I hooked up with a few guys who like to smoke pot and free solo. It was pretty cool. We did some big climbs and nearly died multiple times. But we had drugs already so this myth is busted. The trip up Como pks on LSD was the coolest. I climbed the east face up through fog and couldn't see the top or the bottom. When I finally pulled up on the summit it was a pocket of clear air with a wall of fog shooting straight up from the up draft up the West face. I stuck my hand out into the fog and wind and could channel streams of fog into my little clearing. Then the fog cleared and I found myself leaning over a sheer 600 ft face. Climbing and LSD are not a good idea. Look for something else.

I got started climbing with my older brothers and father by ridge running and accessing remote lakes. I got abused a lot less in the mountains than I did at home so this one rings true for me too.

I tried to hook up with women who would climb and fornicate. It never worked out. It inhibited climbing too much.

Damn Ivan. Get outside.

What I really want to know is why you wear a pink bikini?

def: http://www.cascadeclimbers.com I feel enlightened. In fact, I think I'm going to fart.

Yeah, and what's with those guys who did Girth Pillar, the Ice Cliff Couloir had already been done, without any of that whack and dangle shennanigans! According to Mike Priess, his route and IB overlap for 3 to 5 pitches, so really neither is a variation of the other, and we're talking about two different FA parties on adjacent routes. I completely understand the disappointment in having your adventure route overshadowed by an adjacent later sport route, but its not the same as having your bold line retrobolted by latecomers. Down at Smith, would you say that To Bolt Or Not To Be completely disrespects the line and style in which Sunshine Dihedral was put up? Crag vs Wilderness setting. Apples and oranges imo.

So you climb his routes than talk shit on the internet, NOW THAT PHUK'N WEAK!! Would you advocate having no standards? Unfortunately, these differences blow up into full blown fights. But the discussion needs to continue so we don't end up with shit nobody likes all over the place.

You guys got a clepto on the loose down there. Bummer.

I'm all for re-installing it but not for associating it with genius.

Likewise Stew. I hate belaying aid as it is too hard on the neck. But ping me if you are heading out to do some free climbing. Especially alpine.

Hummin the same tune.

Buy a hufferometer and enlighten us.

Please define "Spray".

Stewart and I ended up pulling into the parking lot about the same time. The flailing was horrific. I even forgot my reverso and almost forgot my fifi hooks. Other than that, I had two kitchen sinks and enough rope to go around the world twice. Left some booty on Sag.

Here we are in spray. Now we can say what we really think. It was as inevitable as Kevbone finding a turd and sniffing it. A dungbeetle's paradise. Where to begin,........ Aw fuckit, I'm going to Index to get dripped on and aid some slime.

Yup. I was climbing there befoer IB was started. Liked it just the way it was. There were several other climbers in the area that liked it too. They can enter this fray or not on their own volition. Most of the climbing I have done has been in new areas that I searched out and explored. I almost never carried a bolt kit and still climbed for months at a time. Sometimes solo other times random partners. Maybe if you tried this approach you would realize that we don't need to put all that work into routes like IB. I mean, its there and all and I don't criticize people for climbing it. But I do think it is worth noting that it is a questionable place for bolts and that there should not be any more routes like it in wilderness. Especially not on Garfield.

I once witnessed a lanky bulldike pass by a recently transformed he-to-she in a professional setting. Of all the times to have my mind reading skills underdeveloped...........

Yellow can too. Depends on the wind loading this weekend. Orange pretty much rules out muti-facet and wide ranging elevation trips at Snoqualmie pass for me. I'm pretty sure you are trolling but I put that out for general consumption. I am pretty conservative when it comes to avalanche danger.

Once again proving, It's all about you.