Bug

I need to get out and try to get some gear in the snow. I will ski up to the base of Chair pk on the East ridge and check out conditions. May climb or not. If there is some ice to play on, I will do so though I am not planning on a rope at this time. If someone REALLY wants to climb Chair with a rope I could be game if there is any ice built up on it. Probablilty is low. I am not into a long dry tool experience with no pro. The cornice at the top of the East ridge coming off of Chair should have some safe places to dig a snow cave or two. Bring your favorite party beverage.

Eventually, everything will be regulated and taxed. Overpopulation is the real problem. Acceptance is lame. Rebellion will be squashed. We will all die in prison for owning an ice ax.

Phil, You have ventured into a discussion you are not qualified to persist in. These people on the mountain are well qualified climbers with all the skills needed to get through this alive if anyone can. Climbing with any electronic device is adding weight and it is the weight of a device that may or may not work in extreme conditions. You can argue all you want about how to keep it warm and dry and functional, but until you have been in a nasty storm like they are in, you will not know what priorities determine what you choose to spend valuable calories on. For instance, did you know that putting snow in a water bottle and trying to melt it with body heat is going to cost you more in calories than the marginal benefits of hydrating? But even that is missing some of the valid points put forth here regarding the style of climbing chosen by experienced climbers. Statistically, the style used by these climbers on Hood has been far more successeful than the style used by most accident victims on Mt Hood. The fact that someone got hurt is a known risk and a choice made by each climber who steps out the door. If I get hurt or killed in the mountains, my loved ones will know that the quality of the life I lived was very high by MY standards. To have lived a different life, never having been in the face of potential catastrophy and pulling through by using carefully aquired skills, presence of mind, and sheer perserverance, would be a prison sentence. My hope is that these men will pull through with minimal injury and loss of quality of life. But if they do not fair well, anyone who knew them, or know any of us who consider ourselves "experienced climbers", should know that this was a possibility that not only was worth the risk but defined the path our lives have taken. We would be drab shadows of who we are today had we not found this path. This says nothing about what other people choose. As for the rescuers on Mt Hood, they are proceeding with great care and will not risk more than their experience condones. They are choosing their own path in this endeavor. And again, if it were me they were searching for, I would want them to know that they should be careful to the extreme. My choice was not intended to lure them into danger. My path is not theirs. My relatives know me. They may be disappointed that more is not done but when all is said and done, they will deeply respect the effort made by all. This effort is exagerrated by the news coverage in terms of realative cost and time. The statistics have been posted repeatedly on this board showing that far more hunters, hikers, and snowmobilers find themselves in need of rescue than climbers. It is almost always during a storm. The danger to the recuers is only partially diminished by not being above tree line. A storm at any elevation means avalanche danger, Hypothermia, air travel restrictions, and all the communications problems you encounter in mountains and valleys. Let it rest. You have asked your question and it has been debated. At this point, you either get it or you don't. The families of these men are watching this board. My guess is that, they get it. The men they are worried about have their respect and support. We need to be respectful toward them now* more than ever.

Just pay off Vinny.

This has very interesting implications for the condom industry.

More info and pics. Comeon Norm, write up a lengthy review. You will thank yourself later.

That pic is sobering. The last time I was up there was 27 years ago. It was August and there were only three or four other parties up there.

No. I was just there. It's Squamish Chief. They're getting ready for the 2010 Olympics.

OK here's the lecture; Raineer is big and bad. There are crevasses on every route and you cannot predict where they will be based on someone else's experience unless you go up there on the same day or right after. The weather can turn ugly fast and give you conditions you would expect in far more exotic places. People freeze to death hanging in crevasses waiting to get pulled out. They are cold cracks in Ice. Willy Usoeld died on the easiest route up there. Don't underestimate it. I envy you going up there for the first time. You will have a blast and be humbled. It passes as you move upward. But looking up from 10k on that first trip is awesome. Take the ropes and pickets and pulleys and make everyone on the team learn how to use them. It will probably be the only time you do but it will save a lot of time if a gaper eats you. Time in a crevass is deadly. Keep your wits. move efficiently and know your plan all the way through. The alternative is nasty.

I didn't really know Todd but I hung around a campfire with him and the motley winter gang at JT a few times. I don't think I would call this trash since this kind of thing was usually the topic being discussed.

Thanks Pope. I love stories like that.

This is a climber's board so take a rope with you for all suggestions you get here. March is early so be ready for deep snow in the Cascades. That is OK if you are ready for it. Snowshoes or skiis will probably be needed for any week long adventure if you are moving 5 miles a day plus or minus. Don't wear cotton as it sucks the heat out of you. Capaliene or Molino wool or one of the newer synthetics are a must next to the skin as the temps drop in the evening and you are all sweaty. The Enchantments loop might be nice but my Flordian girlfriend wouldn't do Asgard pass by herself in the summer much less in the snow. But you could still go up and down the Snow creek trail safely (Asgard pass is at one end, snow creek is at the other). There is no place else. Just kidding. The Enchantments are my favorites for backpacking (and climbing).

Throwing a dozen testoterone ridden climbers into a single room to debate sensibly is more dangerous than throwing a molotav coctail into the room. Unless there is a bong on the table.

But if they do the Emmons route it will be too windy................

Some people climb Rainier just about anytime but this is not a good time if it is a new experience.

Todd used to be the first one up in JT. He'd be doing laps on the ski tracks. Always a kick. RIP.

Total bummer.

I've know three people who were accidentally shot as kids by their friends while playing with guns, one through the chest at point blank range; all smart kids with good parents who obviously thought the same damn thing. The statistics here, as compared to incidents of protecting your home from invaders, are grim. Good luck with that. Hope you've got your guns well hidden and locked, but then, you wouldn't be ready when the invading hordes beat down your door, would you? I also hope you're planning on using a shotgun...so you don't wind up shooting someone else's kid (another common occurance). I keep my kids locked up and my guns loaded, cocked, and ready on the coffee table. Drop by sometime. Oh wait, that's not a threat. We can shoot starlings together.

I left Montana because the rock was too unstable. Take that 200' hand crack immediately around the corner to the right of the sw butt on np. All you have to do is get around the 3000# loose flake at the top. Don't take a belayer you like. And that route on Shoshone was done in Fire's and had to be cleaned. Even the classic Ballard-Evringham route has guano ledge where no man is safe. Those dive-bombing swallows will paste you with malice. It leaves you on a very uncomfortable ledge while they don't even use the front porch size ledge under their colony. Yeah. Go to City of Rocks in Idaho. You don't have to hike anywhere either.

Don't drink it if you can't see if there's floaters or not.

Starlings are evil. That's why I own a pellet rifle. A few years ago, my daughter's kindergarten teacher informed us that my daughter said; "Daddy has a gun but he only uses it to kill monster birds and bad people."

Nice. I wish I could climb it for the first time again. Try Orbit next.

Photos work if it is easy to get the same angle when you are looking for the route or crag. If it is a jumble and you can mark clear landmarks then I think drawings work best. I like the drawings for Icicle for instancec. City of rocks would be better with photos because it is spread out. Part of JT should be photos but there should be drawings to back them up. Long canyons tend to lend themselve well to photos. Just my .02.

Well I'm more into goats anyway.

I think she's hot. So is Mythos girl.