sexual_chocolate

Page top, with 666?

I think he was just waiting 'round for a PAGE TOP!

Well?

Do you see collective bargaining and unionization as integral within a capitalist society?

Hitler disarmed the German population, let's not forget.

quote: Originally posted by Greg W: I don't know what you mean by "playing the Communism boogeyman paper tiger", but it keeps coming up because this belief system is the basis for the ideologies of many of the liberal politicians in this country. Communism is a small step from Socialism (which is a small step from fascism). The reason people are afraid of socialism is that they recognize that there is a loss of personal freedom inherent to this system. The liberal elite is afraid of unfettered capitalism because they can't regulate it and sate their lust for power. Greg W Goldang, I'm startin' to wonder what we're discussing here. Are we talkin' 'bout labor unions, or are we talkin' 'bout Commies? Are we talkin' 'bout Collective Bargaining, or are we talkin' 'bout Socialism? Minimum Wage, or Fascism? Worker's Rights, or the Liberal Elite's Lust for Power? 40 Hour Work Week, or the Tyranny of the Left? Do you equate these ideas in the way I've arranged them? Sometimes I get the feeling you do, but I realize I could be Wrong.... Do you think the ideas (realities) mentioned above constitute necessary governmental intervention in the business sector? [ 11-26-2002, 11:07 AM: Message edited by: sexual chocolate ]

Yes. And I realize that its content indicated a certain level of uncertainty. The previous source I read from was less ambiguous, but I can't say where I read it. Was I convinced at that time? Yes. Am I convinced now? Obviously this link couldn't perform that function, but from everything I've gathered, I'd have to say the motive was there, the attempt was there, and, inadvertent or not, the effect was there.

quote: Originally posted by Jake: Hey sexualchocolate, I'm interested in this smallpox in the blanket business. Do you know where can I read up on this? Hey Jake; Where I originally came across information pertaining to this subject, I cannot recall, but after doing a Google search, here is one link. It's an interesting thread, academic in nature, but there is also much more info out there. I didn't search more out.

quote: Originally posted by JayB: It's amazing to me to witness some folks on left -who I agree with a lot of the time and on many issues - passionately decrying something like this accounting business at Halliburton in one breath, then shrugging off the 50 million souls snuffed out under Stalin and Mao in the next. Capitalism will never be perfect, but it's a hell of a lot better than anything else out there. I'm curious as to who shrugs off the 50 mil souls snuffed out (can souls be snuffed out?) by Mao and Stalin? I've heard some rabid Stalinists defend him, and certainly some Leninist/Marxists defend Mao, but hardly a commonly held leftist viewpoint, huh? Also, arguing about Communism vs. Capitalism seems kinda archaic, if you ask me. The size of the conceptual chunks in this argument prevent any type of insightful analysis. It's not just Capitalism vs. Communism, since NEITHER exist in any form approaching purity (although we have swung towards the former in a rather out of control manner). And, since Capitalism has evils, as you seem to indicate, can we not identify those evils and address them (instead of letting the business elite define the scope of the arguments), and perhaps come up with solutions? This seems kinda logical. And while we're at it, stop playing the "Communism" boogeyman paper tiger when discussing solutions. The only people afraid of socialism are the business elite, and the ones they have brainwashed!

Hey Jake, I was alluding to the blankets. The blankets that contained small-pox. Passed out to the Natives. With full knowledge of what would happen. And yes, it WAS genocide. The entire war on the Natives was genocide, carried out more effectively than Saddam's own war against the Kurds. I still do not believe that any administration has fully atoned for these sins of the past. Perhaps neither has the US public.

Hey! Che wasn't really a government leader, first of all! And secondly, why would you not like him? He was quite sincere, caring, willing to die for a cause that he believed entirely in- helping the impoverished. In some ways, I think Che was much more an American than most American politicians, in that he embodied principles that this country was (supposedly) founded on; helping the poor, fighting for justice, equal rights for all, etc etc!

I think Shintoism was transformed into a bit of an amalgam when Buddhism showed up, incorporating aspects into its systems of thought and ritual, similar as to what happened in Tibet. I'm not sure what percentage adhere to Shintoism; is it the national religion? I do know that there are various sects of Buddhism in Japan, such as Zen Buddhism, Buddhism adhering to Hinayana doctrines, Buddhism adhering to Mahayana doctrines, etc..

Hey, no harm in being called a lefty, or a communist. I have much more sympathy for an intelligent socialist approach to governance than I do for run-away capitalism!

Hey Fairweather, why do you think Daniel Ortega's government was evil?

Hey you barmy lefty, Sartre was a Communist!

But, I do agree that Buddhists tend to be the least aggressive of the religious bunch. I think it may simply be because Buddhism is rather entirely based on the Buddha's teachings, and his teachings are ENTIRELY non-violent. Also, the teachings have passed down through the ages quite intact, escaping distortion, except in just a few cases, such as the Japanese Samurai distortion (where killing was justified). [ 11-24-2002, 11:14 PM: Message edited by: sexual chocolate ]

Actually, fairweather, most imperialists are quite pro-business. And as far as JGowan's observations of Bush's imperialist agenda goes, he hardly needs a US citizenship to state it. Chretien's assistant didn't need one to quite correctly observe that Bush is a moron, although morons MIGHT be insulted. "Christians are not currently trying to convert the world through force/violence." Abortion clinic bombings in the US? Mosque bombings in Africa and India? Plus, the christians that we get news of generally seem to enjoy a status which negates the need to wage holy wars. We waged them already, and won. And, the Buddhists are hardly guiltless. I know there are other examples, but the imperialist tendencies of Japan had a rather strange relationship to certain aspects of the Buddha's teachings on dhyana; you know- the myth of the Zen warrior? Anyways, no harm. Just continuing a pleasant conversation!

Hey Jake, let's not continue to perpetuate myths, ok? Myth #1."he kicked out weapons inspectors in '98". Maybe you really didn't know, but Iraq DIDN'T kick out the weapons inspectors. The US forced a pull-out. Granted, Iraq was less than an amicable host, but it's pretty well accepted as fact that the US had planted spies in the weapons inspection team (both US inspector Ritter has spoken of this, along with Hans Blix, head weapons inspector, among others). Myth #2: "...Saddam used chemical weapons on Iranian soldiers during the Iraq-Iran War and also on his own Iraqi Kurds." Ok, not really a myth, but its manipulation has elevated it to near-myth status. Iraq used gas on Iranians with full US knowledge. As a matter of fact, I believe it was Rumsfeld who was in Iraq, shaking hands with Saddam during some of the gassings. But in our zeal to contain Iran, US looked the other way, as not to offend Saddam. During this time, we were also supplying him with arms and various other needs. Only once he invaded Kuwait did our song change. And as far as the Kurds go, I'd liken his treatment of them to our treatment of Native Americans, who we attacked with biological weapons. Myth #3: "What needs to be realized is that as the premier economic and military power in the world, it is the US's job to lead. Otherwise, another country, possibly one that is not particulary friedly to the US, may try to take charge in world affairs." Simply because we are the premier economic and military power in the world does not automatically elevate us into a leadership position; leadership positions need to be earned with the qualities of honesty, integrity, just action, openness, and a willingness to acknowledge past sins, none of which the US possesses at this time, at least regarding foreign policy. Remember, bullies were rarely regarded as leaders, at least where I grew up. Maybe the bully had the idea he was a leader, but whoever he intimidated had no respect for him, and would turn on him as soon as was safe.

Late seventies, I think you meant to say. I'd personally say they missed (ignored) the signs as soon as they chose to begin work in ousting a democratically elected leader. The Shah was a ruthless dictator, whose creation necessarily entailed the type of blowback we came to see in the revolution of the late seventies. The ends do NOT justify the means, in my humble opinion. Any religion can lend itself to violence. Of this, plenty of current examples exist. To call Islam a violent religion is to call all religions violent, since every religion has, and continues, to be used as justification for said violence. Personally, I tend to see the current Islamic violence in more secular terms. The reaction to the types of injustices we see globally don't need the banner of Islam for violence to occur; the injustices themselves serve as catalysts quite effectively. I think if one furthers the perception of this situation as one of religion, one misses the underlying secular causes, helping to narrow the parameters of analysis, which will distract from the real causes, inevitably promoting misunderstanding and fueling the resultant violence. [ 11-24-2002, 04:48 PM: Message edited by: sexual chocolate ]

quote: Originally posted by mikeadam: Kill these savages with prejudice...Crusade. Isn't this formally known as an "oxymoron"? (Besides also being known as a "bad troll"?)

Hey! They ALWAYS sold Toblerone!

quote: Originally posted by z: http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/meast/11/21/kuwait.soldiers.shot/index.html http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/africa/11/21/nigeria.missworld.ap/index.html http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/meast/11/22/missionary.remembered.ap/index.html Just a few of the more recent events. Yep. Welcome to the new world order. And the problem is that we all have to prepare for ever more violence, as the most powerful country leads the way. Real people really dying because of really really bad foreign policy.

That's funny! He's been spotted quite a bit lately, starting to make his way around the talk shows. Wants to see how the masses respond to his visage after being gone for a couple of years. I guess he'll check the ratings, check the results from some focus groups, and then announce his intentions early next year, huh? (I bet he runs....)

Sheesh. You don't think she really wrote that pap, do you? Oh wait...She did write Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone, and Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Azkaban, and ....

Hey, and just cuz they're big don't mean they're bad. A while back I had a ten dollar bottle of their pinot gris I think it was, and it rocked! Too bad I quit drinking....