Fairweather

15,000,000,000

Wow, this is one of those "screw 'em both" stories. Kind of like the .50cal Makaw(sp?) Indian Whale Harpooners versus the Kooky Sea Shepard group....hmmmm....whom to hate the most? Better to just let them "have at" eachother. The psycho lady has a point about free speech though. I'm so fuckin' tired of hearing the thought police say, "even free speech has limits".They sound like big bro to me.

I just visited the "Powdermag.com" website and the format there looks suspiciously like the one here. Are the CC gods moonlighting?

quote: Originally posted by Dwayner: Back in the day...they used to call the Mountaineers, "The Hardy Queers", but I 'spose that ain't so nice. I've got a number of stories about encounters with them characters but I'll only bore you with a couple. Dwayner used to do quite a bit of unroped solo climbing. Once I did a little alpine ridge route and I paused on a ledge a couple hundred feet up to have a snack and enjoy the view. Meanwhile down below, I watched as a group of Mountaineers were organizing something. It turned out that they were going to send two of their best up there to rescue me! It took them a good while to reach me and then they informed me how everything was going to be O.K. and that climbing without a rope wasn't a smart thing to do. I packed up, continued my climb, and told them to piss off AND have a nice day. On another occasion, I had soloed a rock route and had returned to my pack. A stern looking Mountaineer with a red cross on his helmet approached me: "I'm on the Mountaineers First Aid Committee and for a minute there we thought we were going to have a little practice." I told him to piss off AND have a nice day. And speaking of "reserving the glacier", I've had Mountaineers "instructors" in Leavenworth tell me on a Saturday morning that we couldn't climb in a particular area because they were "using it for the entire weekend." Needless to say, I appeared on the site an hour earlier the next morning with my ropes and students while the Mounties paced nervously waiting for us to finish. "They're on our rock!" I heard one of them cry in anguish. Apparently they had spent Saturday rehearsing their short 5.2 lead and there wouldn't be enough time for all of them to get their little rock lead requirement checked off if they didn't start early. We used the rock until we were finished and then packed up to leave. Before our ropes even hit the ground, 50 Mounties ran out of the bushes with harnesses on and ropes ready to go. Now that's desperation! Gee whiz! makes me wanna drink! - Dwayner Ya' should have given that mountie leader a golden shower for his efforts before you continued up.

Climbed Little T in winter 1983 from Paradise. This is an easy 2 days. Camped below Anvil Rock. The lower Cowlitz is heavily crevassed and just below you is one of the biggest icefalls on Rainier....don't drop too low if it socks in! The Ingraham isn't as bad and the notch up onto The Whitman Glacier is easy. Watch for avalanche danger on the upper Whitman. Easy gullies lead to the spectacular summit ridge (which was corniced and icy). The final block is 3/4th class in summer, but coated with rime ice in winter. Takes a little nerve. Lot's of exposure here. This is a cool climb in winter!

While I agree with much of what you write I must point out....You mention California's "progressive" state parks system that actually lowered park fees. Unfortunately, a large percentage of State Park campsites are not available for use by the general public as they are set aside for the homeless....and it aint' pretty, much less sanitary. ( Don't believe me? Go down to Dash Point State Park right here is good old WA State.) While I don't have a major problem with this as a stop-gap solution, the great state of California has made it somewhat of a permanent thing. I think it is wrong to charge exorbitant fees to use public lands. I think nominal fees CAN create a greater sense of ownership and silence tax-paying critics who view OUR persuits as elitist. Unfortunately, any $$$ raised will only be deducted from a would-have-been budget. I don't believe there is a conspiracy by GW or his associates to gouge us. I think he has more important things to think about right now...

I climbed Warrior back in early spring 1994. The view from this summit of Constance' north face is incredible. It was plastered with snow at the time and looked incredibly alpine. There is a fair sized glacier at its base that leads up to Crystal Pass. Inner Constance looks great from this vantage too. I think you are right. This would be a great trip and I think it could be done in one long day if the temptation to climb any peaks could be resisted. [ 01-05-2002: Message edited by: Fairweather ]

Here it is the middle of winter and I'm thinking about wide open, sub alpine meadows, glaciated peaks and remote basins. I've done a few off trail routes in The Olympic Mtns, but am looking at a few choices to in summer 2002. Anyone climbed over Mt Christie, Dellabarre, and on to Muncaster Basin? How about The Valhallas? Skyline Trail? Queets Basin to Glacier Meadows? I'd love to hear some Olympic XC stories.

I've got no gripe with The Mountaineers. They certainly have every right to be in the mountains! It does seem that a large % of their class instructors are incredibly arrogant, but then there is no law against that either. Indeed, it is The Mountaineers that seem to think they own the mountains. "Reserving" the Nisqually Glacier???? Another point, they are not really a "club" but rather a corporation. Books $$$, membership $$$, lobbying (some good, some bad). So far they seem to be on the right side of the access issue, as opposed to some local groups like WTA that want to lock hikers and climbers out of the mountains.

A friend of mine was teaching a group of Explorers crevasse rescue on the lower Nisqually a few years back when a huge group of Mountaineers arrived and told them they would have to leave because their club had "reserved" the glacier that day. Once when rapping off the last pitch on Ingalls Peak South Ridge I came upon a group of 12 Mountaineers going up. As my partner started down the rope from up above...the majority of which lay in a heap at the base of the climb, their instructor told me in a very loud, animated and condesending tone, "Hey pal, why don't you do your friend a favor and tie a couple knots in the end on your rope." This seemed intended to impress his charges. I replied, "Hey pal, why don't you do us both a favor and mind your own fuckin' business." His students were all laughing as the guy was apparently a real prick.

Climbed Pyramid Peak from Westside Road junction in Feb 1983. We "scooted" across the Tahoma Creek suspension bridge, which was jacked up at a 45 degree angle to prevent snow-loading, by hooking our snowshoe claws over the higher edge of the bridge decking and hanging on to the cable with our bare hands which froze. ...terrifying. Camped at Indian Henry's..it snowed 2 feet during the night. We summited the next morning in marginal weather. Kicked a large slab loose on the way down. The trip was certainly a "youthful learning experience" which I'm lucky I survived.

quote: Originally posted by Norman Clyde: Royal Basin ought to be a fine winter destination, with Deception and Fricaba being easily accessible ascents, though the valley has definite avalanche potential, especially into Surprise Basin just E. of Deception. The approach is 6 miles, as I recall, very steady slow incline the whole way, with a few old glacier steps at the top. I spoke to Olympic Mountaineering a few weeks back and they said the forest road is not always passable in winter, being unmaintained and sometimes snowy even at that low elevation (around 1000 feet I think). They suggested Deer Park as a good jumping off point. But I'd favor Constance myself. I climbed Fricaba a couple of years ago in early spring. On the decent we discovered the biggest slab-path I have ever seen. It started just below a sub-peak west of Fricaba and dumped toward Royal Basin. It was probably 10+ feet thick, 300 yards wide at the top, and slid well over a mile. It was only a day or 2 old. Snow blocks the size of small cars. It increased my respect for Olympic avalanche potential.

The Yashica you are probably refering to is the T4. It was just recently discontinued. It had a sharp lens (Contax T) that was sharp enough for slides. I'll have to disagree with the suggestion that the Olympus Stylus is a good choice. It's metering does not have any manual or automatic exposure compensation for shooting on bright snow in midday conditions. You will endup with a lot of underexposed (dark) photos. I own a LOT of cameras and here are my suggestions: 1) a used Olympus XA. (NOT an XA1 or any other variant.) Expect to pay about $125 for one in good shape. It weighs 8 1/2 oz. You can open 1 1/2 f-stops with a switch on the bottom. 2) The Yashica T4...if you can still find one. $159, weighs about 7 oz. My favorite point and shoot is my Ricoh GR1. Sharp lens, but kind of pricey.

quote: Originally posted by epb: OH yeah (Fairweather)...sounds like your just making excuses to justify you lazy ass lifestyle. Classic. Enviromentalist are all radicals...waaaah. Rather than discredit the movement that exists, why not keep the movement you once supported alive (or revive it)? Next to the South Koreans and Japaneese, Americans work more hours per week than any other citizens on Earth. Maybe it's the rest of the world that is lazy? Just a thought. "The movement" I once supported was hijacked by radicals. (like you?) It now consists of fear mongering, junk mailers, Hollywood whiners and lobbyists who rely on questionable (the lynx study, a case in point) science and twisted or anecdotal reasoning.

quote: Originally posted by Dru: "The Reagan years were a disaster for our forests, cutting and shipping raw logs overseas." USA is threatening Canada right now cause you want us to ship you raw logs....... you gonna protest that one too Fairweather? I don't vote in Canada. I'm an American If you don't like the policies of your government, vote for change. Don't cry to me.

quote: Originally posted by AlpineK: Right on SS. I couldn't agree with you more. Whoever those scientists were they sure fucked up. By falsifying there data they end up helping the side they were trying to restrict. Just look at Fairweathers reaction. Actually, I too agree with ss. I would lay down in front of any bulldozer that tried to violate a national park or wilderness area. During the 70's and 80's I WAS an "environmentalist"...The Reagan years were a disaster for our forests, cutting and shipping raw logs overseas. Then the 90's came and "environmentalists" began to turn on their core supporters...like me. "Restricted access"; "man as the enemy of nature"; "solitude"; "let nature take the roads and trails back"....they lost my support because they tried/are trying to lock me out. I do not accept that recreation is a significant cause of environmental degredation. The past 10 years they have pissed me off so badly that I look upon anything they say or claim as a junk-science-LIE. The lynx study is the tip of the iceberg, I suspect.

AlpineK and nolanr, Does our nation's standard of life mean you'll be giving up your car soon? How 'bout your home and property? Your climbing trips? Flying? Your gear? Your computer?...I didn't think so. Do you really think lowering OUR standard of living would help others around the world? Sure there are still people trashing the environment, but great progress is being made. It is not nearly as bad as "they" would have us believe. I suggest you read "The Skeptical Environmentalist" by Bjorn Lomborg. (a Dane) Environmentalists tend to be hypocrites, BIG TIME...and their old Volkswagen Micro Buses probably put more hydrocarbons into the air than a Chevy Suburban!

Great Story!! Thanks for the info s.s. It only affirms my belief that the environmental movement will go to any legnths to "have their way". Lies, bogus science, fear mongering, terrorism, and a general hatred of American style freedom are all their trademarks. I believe many of them, including some gov't "scientists" simply find environmentalism a convenient way to impose their socialism on our country.

Wy'East route is a great winter climb if snow conditions are stable. The final chimney is a bit steep and exposed but the rest of the route is fairly easy. Leuthold is another good winter climb. I haven't done Sandy Glacier Headwall, but I've heard it can be a good winter climb too.

thinking about getting back into ski mountaineering, but I'm not quite ready to buy all new gear. Has anyone tried the Backcountry Access bindings that work with your alpine skis/bindings? I know they work with either alpine ski OR mountaineering boots. Any thoughts?

The Fox Hole army surplus store in Tacoma has NEW 3-ply "Gore Tex" (the real stuff) parkas and pants for $149 and $99. They are seam sealed, pit zips, side zip (partial) pants, butt re-enforced pants, nice quality stuff. Only one choice of color: cammo! I'm tired of trashing the butt in the $200 wind pants I buy when I glissade, so I'm going to give the pants a try!

Done both East and North ridges in winter. The East is considerably easier....two pitches plus easy unroped before and after. The steepest part of this climb is up a large pillar which seems to me somewhat detached. I suspect it will fall away someday and I wouldn't want to be huggin it when it goes....just my read; maybe I'm way off.

Scott, While I detest the "environmental extremists", and this guy who repremanded you is probably one of them, not cutting switchbacks is very "101"...you just don't do it. Regarding the WTA....they are not, as their name implies a "trails" organization. They have of late become just another environmental group. A TRAILS organization would not support locking hikers out of The Middle Fork of the Snoqualmie by lobbying to shut down the road. Additionally, reports they feel are "inappropriate" are censored by their webmaster.

Scott, While I detest the "environmental extremists", and this guy who repremanded you is probably one of them, not cutting switchbacks is very "101"...you just don't do it. Regarding the WTA....they are not, as their name implies a "trails" organization. They have of late become just another environmental group. A TRAILS organization would not support locking hikers out of The Middle Fork of the Snoqualmie by lobbying to shut down the road. Additionally, reports they feel are "inappropriate" are censored by their webmaster.

Actually, the Wilderness boundary starts up by Crater Rock. The rest of the climb is just regular FS land....which begs the question, how can they regulate from the parking lot at Timberline? Will they post a ranger at the boundary? Will they try to physically stop someone from proceeding if they have already climbed 4000 feet and have only 1000 to go?