Peter_Puget

report money quote: "Overall, these results indicate that upward mobility remains an attainable goal for the majority of working age individuals. The presence of mobility implies that yearly measures of earnings inequality likely overstate the permanent earnings differences between individuals."

softball to attached weights

This takes around 10 minutes to make. I got the idea from a book on Body Results site.

I thought I posted to this thread earlier. Here is a great link: Trinity Alps I believe that Scottp is really referring to the Stonehouse. Several good climbs on it and it is easy to find. Hike up the Canyon Creek Trail until you see the obvious formation with large corner. Haven’t climbed in the area for over 20 years but there is lots of climbing. On a map look for a series of lake to the NE of the Canyon Creek trial. (I wanna say June lakes?) Nice short climbs there and shorter approach. Grizzly Falls is a nice ice climb in the right conditions.

I was guessing Wild Traverse on Midnight! PP

I am not saying the routes are good. I am not even sure if we are discussing the same ones. The ones I have heard about are several years old. I even think they have been climbed in summer.

Mattp – Well F8 assumes that the routes are indiscrete and asking for trouble. Since he did not respond to my earlier post where I ask him several question - I assume he is speculating. What if the routes are four years old and just now coming to everyone’s awareness. Would we still think F8’s opinion at all realistic? What if some were 6 years old and the one with the fixed rope the only new one? In making a useful assessment I believe that such facts would be important. Many posters seem to be assuming the mixed routes in the Snoq pass area are poor routes. I have talked to some who have dry tooled some bolted routes in the area and they thought they were really fun. These guys have climbed A5 in the Valley and done difficult routes in the Rockies. Are these guys telling me stories about the routes in question? Who knows?

I am somewhat out of this debate but I do notice that most of the posters seem to be theorists regarding these routes. For example, no one has confirmed the routes in the pictures are the routes Paco first mentioned. For example, no one has confirmed how old some of the routes are. For example, most of the posters haven’t even seen the routes and are slamming them All of this is conjecture based on a priori assumptions and biases. Mattp – Please don’t dry tool on existing sport routes. The tools can/do mess up the rock. As an aside modern mixed climbing has absolutely have no appeal to me. It appears to have very few of the qualities I enjoy about climbing. Of course that is my personal preference and in no way should be seen as an attack on mixed climbing. PP

F8 - Have you seen the routes? Are the routes in the pictures the ones Paco was writing about? Exactly what do you mean by pristine?

How long have some of these routes been in place? I think those routes in the pictures have been up for several years. Perhaps I am thinking of someplace else.

Amber Just keep the spray out of the RC forum. If you become confused as to what spray is just use the broadest definition you can imagine. PP

Were is that? Arizona?

Much more enticing. Where is it?

LOL I don't care about those pics! It is pretty shot.

Shouldn't this thread be in the New Mixed Climbing Forum? Sorry couldn't resist!

I do not think that you can equate a constructive criticism with either “shooting down” or “attacking.” In the cc.com world I’ll admit they are pretty much the same but in the real world feedback is often appreciated and sought out. A person making an FA might have difficulty appraising the difficulty of a route. A guidebook author may by too familiar with the routes. PP

I think Tieton has been rated well in the past. Some of the routes are hard to rate. For example the sport routes at Lava Point.

The last pitch of Sunblessed seemed stiff for the rating. The three tiered grading system has been used in several locations. For example the Wilts guide to Suicide.

Buy Berkely and if you dont think it is better. I'll give Erik $10 to give you at a Pub CLub Have you heard the remastered Berkley?

Aren't these routes several years old or am I thinking of a nearby cliff

Jimi Hendrix

Good read!

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Jon - When did you get your info. Do you think that the wife of a US government employee would not be considered a suspiscious contact in the regions involved in WMD? Heck anywhere for that matter.

Cavey - My comments apply to the gallery as well as your threads.