Lambone

Late June would be considered very late season on that route though...correct? One of those news articles (CNN I think) was saying that the Lib Ridge was one of the most difficult routes on Rainier. I had to question that statement, like aren't there alot of really sick routes on the Willis wall and such that would be considered the most difficult, putting Lib Ridge as a "walkup" relative to those? Not that it isn't a hard route, I don't doubt that, but one of the hardest on the mountain? Sounds more like a trade route to me...

so if you put your email in as like "matt at hotmail" can they figure that one out, or no...

damn...

yeah, it's known as the "Falls Wall" by all the cool people. It acctually includes the Rock on both sides of the Falls and the LA Spire. Lots of unrepeated Kohl routes over there (uhhh...like no thanks)...the one in the photo goes almost directly up the path of the Falls. There are some moderates too, but not many. The Reid book shows some of the old ones.

yeah well, like...duh no reason why we can't talk about other countries too though, since that is where this particular conversation began...

At the same time how can you blame them (them being locals in "underdeveloped countries")? I mean, you wanna have your nice house for your family, clean water, transportation + gas that runs it, yummy cheeseburgers and everything else...why shouldn't everyone want to have access to those same luxuries? You can go to almost any place in the world that has electricity and log onto the internet somewhere and see all those nice things that so many people have now, and I can't say that I wouldn't want to emulate that also, because I do. I'm not saying it is right, i'm just saying it's reality, and it may seem sad to us that people are losing their cultural traditons...burning yak dung in their stove and eating rancid yak butter. But that is our veiwpoint, from their prospective, at least the youths perspective, I think there are millions who are very bitter that they cannot have those things. That was part my experience in Nepal, talking with my peers in Nepal who wanted nothing more in life then to get out. The real problems arise, and will arise in the future when access to these luxuries that we have become more and more available, but systems of good resource custodianship (like we have in the US...to some extent, i.e. Recycling, Environmental Protection, etc.) are not available. For example, China- huge economic boom and fast growth, coupled with environmental exploitation and degredation on a massive scale. As far as the ecotourism thing, I think skyclimb is pretty right on. Although I would say that there are alot of ecotourism buisnesses out there which cause alot of impact. Especialy in places where there are no guidlines or systems of control in place that are enforced, Costa Rica being a prime example. It's pretty easy for any resort type buisness to put on the guise of "ecosystem friendly" and wow guests with first impressions and bathroom labels that say we wash our towels properly, when in reality there are alot of bad things going on behind the scenes. Not that I am authority on the subject, just something I studied for a short time... China is on a big push to develop ecotourism in the western Part of the country right now. For example, Panda refuges in the Sechwan (sp?) province.

Yeah dryad, intrested in your perspective considering you were recently over there...

"It's out there." exactly

There might be one now...there was a Baskin Robbins 31 Flavors when I was there 4 years ago... Still, the times have allready changed and now many of the local mountain people rely on the tourist industry as their main income flow. I'm sure they are hurting with travel on the decline in Nepal. Yeah BC kicks as...the Canadian Rockies are amazing.

upload them to the Photo Gallery, then insert them into your post with url and the button. You could also post reports like this as a TR ("Post New TR" button at the top of the screen when viewing the forum). Then your account will be easily refrenced by using the Trip Report Index. Any open crevases on the Hotlum? Did you ski in? Thanks

oh, ok...thanks.

Jon, two questions: 1- What is Engrish? Some computer lingo that I don't know...or a typo, are you going to send us emails in a foreign lauguage? 2- Is it ok to post our email addresses in the user profiles, or is this "Spambotted? too? lummox, you crack me up man...

yeah. sounds like a total epic! Dryad, no i haven't been to Gokyo, but i'm thinking my wife and I will hike that way...

Well, I'd say the Khumbu is pretty much the biggest and most overwhelming...that I have been to at least. But I wouldn't call it "remotenss beyond belief." The treking infrastucture kinda takes a little away from the experience, but it's cool anyway. Patagonia is on my list. I'd be happy just to hike around there. Of course there is the Trango Region, but I don't like thoughts of being beheaded. I guess if remoteness were your thing, Baffin, the Northern Himalaya in Tibet or in Northern India would probly be the way to go...

Right on dryad! Did you hike up kala Patar? Did you see that huge waterfall right across the canyon from Namche? That thing had me drooling! Can't wait to go back someday...

I am glad someone posted an analysis of the accident, as I had never heard what happened, and was very curious considering the number of years of climbing experience all climbers involved had between them. Saying that it was "not an accident" is just uncalled for. That's like saying...well you know..I don't even want to say it. And I don't blame RumR for the way he responded as i know he is close to those involved. The insults don't belong here though.

cool! how long did the approach take to camp? Considering routes for this weekend. thanks...

wow you are the man...

Edit: i wrote this before i read Rumr's comment, but he pretty much sums up what I was getting at. well, yeah of course it was negligant. I suppose it comes down to how one defines the term accident. I'd guess that almost every report detailed in "Accidents in North American Mountaineering" could be attributed to negligence at some level. But it is not like they intentionaly dropped Beta...sheesh. it sounds like it was a gross misscomunication. Which i would call an accident. What gets me about this one in particular is that as Dcramer stated above, Beta did alot of his climbing and route work alone, but his fate was ultimately determined in the hands of another climber. very sad.

holy shit, that's a crazy story mattp I don't exactly understand the situation that led to David's fall, but regardless...it is truly horrible.

Drove up to Bend from Ashland and Rode the Deschuts Trail, Phils trail loops. Monday rode Cultus Lake Loop, warning...Cultus isn't cleared on the West Side, lots of carrying the bike. My wife is getting better/faster, thank god!

it's hard to see, but mine is a snaffle with a bazoka... I call him the Bahgdad Snaffler...

hey, I wanna go,...I live in Ashland. It's 1 hr-1.5 hrs to the trailhead from my house. Send me a PM I'm dyin to go there...

Road Phil's trails in Bend. Mt Biking is fun.

I have done the exact same thing. Nothing is scarier the doing a bunch of free climbing, then switching to aid and having to bounce test some sketchy piece. My near ddislocation happened while testing a hook on the Tripple Direct. I have to conciously tell myself not to hold onto the rock these days for fear of dislocating my shoulder up on the wall, it is my nightmare. I'd rather take a long ride! Nice Job!