mattp

It sounds to me as if "they" or somebody did a little work on it, then. That's good news! Let's hit it in two or three weeks.

I agree with everybody else. Whats up with guys who put folks down for using tape? Among anybody who isn't striving for some kind of "expert" status, it has been fairly common practice for 30 years and it doesn't hurt you any. I for one am happy to see the video even if I know I could make something so incredibly much better that everybody would join me in calling the OP a pathetic loser.

Nice job on that topo! Thanks.

A ranger told me they were going to send somebody up there to fix up that low spot last week. It sounds as if they may have done so. Was water still flowing over the road at about the 4 mile mark? The Forest Service has not cleared the road beyond the 3:00 trailhead for over ten years. I've participated in more than one work party cutting branches and filling potholes and once we even hauled a load of crushed rock up there but that gets expensive real quick. For Subaru, they did a little maintenance on the Exfoliation Dome fork whenever that was - four or five years ago. I have to take care of family business this weekend but I'd be up for a work party and climbing campout sometime soon. The road to Dreamer will require a lot of work. We could reclaim the road to the parking spot for Exfoliation Dome with a more reasonable amount of effort, I think (though in reality the present blockage probably ads no more than a half hour to that approach even if it makes it into a trip most climbers will not want to undertake).

Sign me up for a room in that villa!

A little perspective may be hard to take but I think Puget has a point. I like the Cascades as much as anybody and have climbed more routes on Rainier than most posters here. I've also traveled a fair bit and climbed in ranges elsewhere. The Cascades have their charm, but I can't understand anybody claiming any "best" status or even thinking that the big R is some god of a mountain. Seriously: if I was going to fly somewhere and rent a car to climb something it'd be in Alaska or British Columbia or Yosemite, not Rainier or even the Picketts. The same goes for cc.com. I post near as much as anybody around and I strongly support the site. I promote it and organize cc.com events and have made lots of friends here. But we've got some serious warts and cc culture kind of sucks. As PP said: on any given day there's more talk about the size of TVash' tits than climbing and with regard to most climbs theres more name calling and jive than beta and stoke. We are all a bunch of pathetic losers in reality, and I include myself in that statement.

Don't get too emotional on us. Seattle is still full of Volvo's and it rains all the time. Hell: it's looking like it'll be raining on this holiday weekend.

Next thing you know, they'll be busting us for not having a garbage bag or hugging. I can't find the trash bag law, but here's the hugging one:

252 posts in a week is worth a finger or two just in itself!

Knucklehead that you are, if I had some Islay I'd tip one your way too.

Now here I wonder: do you really see cops hiding in the bushes trying to catch people who don't wear their seatbelts? Fircrest must really be a pretty tame neighborhood! Here in the Big City they are looking for drunks and people who run red lights. I kinda wish they'd crack down on those clueless idiots who are chatting on their cell phones and holding up traffic, though. 'Bastards me miss at least three stoplights today.

I've climbed on both formations right after a rainfall but I bet it got a pretty good dowsing last night, and I can only imagine it is going to get more. If you want bone dry rock, that is probably not the place to find it.

GHSW may well be a troll altogether, and certainly she is trolling in this thread, but I would say that lurking on cc.com would actually probably be within the job description of a recreation manager type employee. Talking smack on the Internet might violate some Federal regulations but there wouldn't be a whole lot to this spray forum if nobody ever abused their work access to the Internet.

I don't know the facts, Sobo, but I wonder if there are enough timber sales in, say, the Mount Baker Snoqualmie National Forest, to support the road and trail system that they have even if they DID charge higher rates on the timber sales. I have not seen may loaded log trucks coming out of the woods in recent years. I agree with everything else you say about how the NW Forest Pass is a bad program that should never have been adopted and wasn't given much of a public process, though. I also agree that it appears that most of the fees are NOT used to support the road and trail infrastructure, and the problems we face with roads and trails going unmaintained is largely a matter of budget priorities and politics.

Great TR. Thanks, Mr. Klenke. Nooksack, if not the hardest summit to attain, certainly gets a lot of coolness points. It is a stunning looking thing. Maybe something along the crest of the Picketts is harder, but I'm not sure.

You're more than a good egg, Carolyn. You are a REALLY GOOD egg. Latte is a very lucky beast and, I think, you are pretty lucky too. After all, you've had the privilege of spending time with Latte.

Johndavidjr, your post appears to have been the first to offer a personal or tangential attack, based on the idea that sailBOI had some crazy stuff linked on his web page. (I agree that Fairweather's posts continue this trend.) Lets see if in this forum (access issues) we can talk about access issues instead of who is more of a nutcase. In my book, you both lose and it is "outside the scope of this forum." Take that argument to spray.

True that, but I'm wondering: why didn't Bush order him targeted back in 2001? Clearly, in announcing our plans for two months in advance, capturing Bin Ladin either dead or alive was not our objective.

I don't believe so. I have indicated my opposition to it every chance I have had and this includes in-person talks with Forest Service staff as well as letters to higher ups. I have only bought one or maybe none of those passes yet. I am simply of the opinion that it will do climbers no good to take their frustration out on the line staff who sell the passes in the ranger station or who may be ticketing cars in a parking lot. These people are not likely to respond to being abused by sending a supportive message to their superiors.

Fair enough, Mr Zonk, and the ranger should be able to understand that and let you go on your way. It may well be "their business" what you are doing and where you're going, though.

You may be right about our "rights," Mr. Builder, but I personally will usually politely answer the ranger's questions and look for an opportunity to end the conversation as soon as possible. My experience has shown that law enforcement personnel do not react well to being challenged. If faced with a rookie, maybe you can stand on your rights and get them to back down, but I've also heard stories of that poor rookie getting on the radio and calling in law enforcement who DID arrest climbers in the Tetons for failing to cooperate. One thing is for sure: you are asking for trouble if you give a fake name. I know that lots of people have done this over the years but it is a crime that you probably don't want to be busted for. A "crime of dishonesty" may be held against you by a subsequent employer or if you want to be appointed to take care of business for an aging parent or something. I'm not suggesting you give up all sense of dignity. When a ranger has lied to me or is being unreasonable I have called them on it and on occasion followed up with a supervisor. But that is a different sort of dynamic than the "20 questions" game that is the topic of this discussion. If a ranger asks me where I'm going, I'll answer their question.

nolanr, where you been? Del Campo's NW face is also pretty good.

Actually, this project was not undertaken with my leadership. I was most definitely a follower. Mark had the vision. I've been talking to the rangers up there for the last 20 years, though, and I have a pretty good impression of the folks in the Darrington District. Today I spoke with somebody at the Forest Service who said they plan to send a crew up there in the next week or two if all goes well with other projects. As you might imagine, they have a huge list of needed repairs this year and as some of you know their budget has been cut hugely over the last couple of years. I asked who we could call to suggest our support for more funding, and the roadway supervisor in the Wooley office told me we could call Rick Larsen, Representative in the Second District, Washington. The Access Fund and Washington Climbers Coalition have been sending periodic messages to his office and those of Cantwell, Norm Dicks, and Jay Inslee because they have been working on related issues. There will still be more to do, however. They are not going to address the avalanche wastage on the road below Exfoliation Dome or the Eightmile Creek Trail (though WTA may target the latter).

Yo Bill, I appreciate the spirit you show here, but I gotta say I disagree with part of your message. Based on a few recent conversations that I have had with Forest Service employees at various levels in the organization over the past few years, it sounds to me as if this program is generally unpopular within the Service just as it is with many of us hikers and climbers. It IS their job to enforce the law, though, so if you get a ticket you are welcome to contest it all you want but try to remember: it is not the poor schmoe who is sent out to Icicle Creek to pass out tickets who is behind all this and they probably don't deserve your abuse (Larry the Tool excepted). For sure, it is more than a little provocative for GSHC to come on here and post that they've shown this to their supervisor and now somebody's gonna get towed but don't you think it was also provocative for Radon to post here about how they are breaking the law and put it as if they are suggesting others do so? The Northwest Forest Pass program sucks, but lets try not to let it destroy our relationship with the line staff who (3 out of 4 of them, anyway) are just trying to do their job. Your typical ranger is not in it for the money. Just like us, many of them value public lands and outdoor recreation.