mattp

Most of the time, the road is plowed to the trailhead above Ross Dam, so you can even drive past Colonial Creek and drive up the hill on the other side of the bridge for a pre-view of Colonial before you head up there.

Maybe you are right DFA. Does anybody have an example of how an issue has been consistently portrayed - in news stories and in headlines - with a "liberal slant" in major newspapers or on national TV?

I have to do some work now, but let me take a shot at this one. A certain former president called Nelson Mandela a "Terrorist" right up until the very day that he received the nobel peace prize. He was not criticized for this. Not at all. I agree with what Patty Murray said - she did not say that Saddam was a humanitarian. She said that he, and I believe she actually talked more about Bin Laden in this context, had helped build infrastructure and helped people to feed theirselves and that in so doing they had built some good will. These are true facts that our government wants to ignore in portraying these poeople as the agents of evil and portraying ourselves as the great white saviors. Gotta go, but I'll talk w/ ya later.

Trask: can you cite a single example of an issue that the TV and the Seattle newspapers have concistently presented with a "liberal" slant? I honestly can't. Take another example: Global Warming. Last week the paper had a front page article headlined "Global Warming Uncertain" - or something like that. What the story said, if you actually read the lengthy article, was that there had been a recent study of the complex ecological happenings that have resulted from global warming, not that there was anything uncertain about the existence of the phenomenon. But most people look only at headlines or read the first paragraph of such an article and then get bored and look for the latest footbal score. People like Mtn Goat, who still believe that the greenhouse gas thing is "junk science" will have their belief confirmed when they look at the newspaper even when the article in fact supports the opposite conclusion. In the context of the story about greenhouse gasses, the "opposition viewpoint" (the one the administration would like to present to us even though their own scientists admit is untrue) is given equal coverage and credibility. When the headlines and the content is so slanted in favor of the administration's message while over half the AMerican public disagrees, or when almost all scientists disagree, our newspaper is spewing propoganda at us along with the sensationalism that Greg complains about.

Greg- Do you care to address my argument or discuss my examples, or do you merely reassert that the press is liberal?

Just for the record, this is the first time I have ever posted this: Dan Larson SUX. Where the hell were you, Dan? And Peter Puget SUX too.

That's my point, Greg: The "liberal media" is a complete myth. Anybody with any opposition to the war is portrayed as a traitor. How "liberal" is that?

Freeclimb9 wrote that in another thread. Isn't the same true in the U.S.? The "box" is called a TV set. I've been thinking about this quite a bit lately, and this morning I believe I heard a similar idea expressed on NPR but honest - I thought of it first. In the discussion of the war on terrorism, and particularly with regard the Iraq war, there has been absolutely no credible opposition in the mainstream press and absolutely nothing on television that would present the case against the war -- even though most of the citizens of this nation are either against it or have serious misgivings about it. Example: the president and his men says we are going there because they are going to get us if we don't get them first. He says we are going to fight for freedom. He says that if we fight this war against terrorism by invading countries like Afghanistan and Iraq we are going to be more secure at home. The TV and the newspapers parrot this message to us every day, with no attempt to give equal press or even significant press to any critical view of these ideas. Example: Somebody from the administration is on TV every day telling us about the latest terrorist threat that never seems to materialize, and about how our intelligence community is preparing to protect us. And there is no serious publicity of the idea that they may be alarmist or that the new security structures may not be very effective. Example: Saudi Arabia reverses their position on the U.S. use of their bases in any invasion of Iraq and it is reported with no background given and no follow up. This is probably the single biggest story in the middle east in the last two months and there are no questions asked about what actually happened. Clearly, there must have been some kind of background deal but the press asks no questions. Example: There has been no link shown between Iraq and terrorism. There was a reported meeting in -- where was it? East Germany or some place -- between some Iraqui official and al queda guys. bbut the Iraqi's deny it, Al queda denies it, and the German's deny it. It was asserted as fact, but all indications are that it never happened and there is no real discussison of how this appears to be blatant propaganda. You may agree with Bush/Rumsfeld/Cheney or you may not. But clearly the TV set and the newspapers are only spraying propaganda. Anybody who criticizes the administration's rhetoric is portrayed as some kind of traitor like Sean Penn or Patty Murray and there is no serious discussion presented to the American public.

No. The term is straight out of Edelweiss' technical manuals. You can do your own field test and duplicate their results if you try to jumar up one or if you rappel to the very end of the rope, let it slide through your braking device, and let go.

What's up, Fairweather? Those evil dems getting you down?

I DO think they are worth the price. But yes, a play on your words was attempted.

At nearly twice the price of any other 9mm, they are clearly TWICE as good. The rating for an edge over a hold is, as Cavey noted, unique. Also, they have a stiff handle to them, which I kind of like, and Edelweiss ropes are just plain good ropes anyway. But they ARE boingy.

No bumper stickers. But where else do you think the water goes? Some got into the cylinders the last couple times I drove it because the exhaust smelled bad, and I see it on the ground some times. My mechanic said it probably only needs the gasket, though he thought there was some chance the head would need to be machined. I was already looking for a new car anyway and just didn't want to mess with it. Trask: the stereo is only 25w per side (Sony) tape (no CD) and you wouldn't be happy with it anyway. Don't sweat the speaker.

It is a 22R. There was not a lot of antifreeze in the oil last time I checked, but it was not holding water so I was having to refill the radiator every other time I drove to work before, two months ago, I stopped driving it. It will not start because of what I think is a starter issue although I can't understand how this problem mysteriously appeared when I stopped driving it. I have had no problem with the tranny/hubs etc. or the brakes. I drove it on 800 or 1,000 mile trips twice this past summer, and since I returned from the second tripo I have not driven it more than a couple hundred miles so I believe that, once the imediate issues (admittedly serious ones) are resolved it will be an OK vehical.

Tell her you are going to a wine-tasting.

It is pretty shady over there on the N. Face. It might actually be OK though I bet the ski run down from the base of the face is sub-optimal.

Do you think we are stupid enough to seriously think Iraq would lob one at us? Clearly they miscalculated in the case of Kuwait, but they have shown no inclination to send any weapon at the west except that during the war they sent an inefective couple of missiles at Israel. The difference in policy is not explained by how smart or stupid we think they are.

I agree with Trask. I don't think the current crisis (today's crisis) is as bad as all that because I don't think anybody is going to shoot a nuke at anybody. The sad thing about the story is that it seems to me the main lesson from all of this is that might makes right and if you don't want to get pushed around by the U.S. you gotta arm yourself to the maximum extent possible. Can you blame them for wanting to restart their weapons program after we have stated that they are in the axis of evil and we are going to come after them as soon as we're done with Saddam? In these circumstances, shouldn't Saddam be saying to himself "look at those guys -- the U.S. isn't going to invade them because they have nukes and can hit Soeul. If only I had something like that."

You can't blame the judge. He's just being arrogant and cares only about his own enjoyment and property value -- probably not unlike what lots of us would do but on a larger scale. Ever dump your yard waste over the fence? "Trim" you neighbor's branches? It is the prosecutor who isn't doing his job.

I'd probably carry a single 9mm stratos, but mostly that is because that is the kind of rope that I have. I'll often lead "short bits of mid fifth" on a single strand or, if need be, double it up when I think I'm facing some serious-fall potential. I know, the stats say "you can't do that" so maybe that means you should ignore everything else I've said, but on the kind of ground that you are talking about I feel pretty safe doing this because you are not talking about climbing Index town wall, but ridge lines and psuedo-scrambling where you are going to take sliding and bouncing falls. When simul-climbing, a short rope is usually easier, and in that case I just coil up part of the rope and throw it over my shoulder. I have a half-rope length of 8.5mm rope which I sometimes carry on scramble climbs when I have a partner who may request a belay somewhere. It is also pretty nice for canyoneering, though it has been a long time since I've been to points SW.

I'm not that desparate yet. Granted, a vehicle that needs engine work and a starter is not worth bluebook (something like $4,000) but ....

You mean that economic stimulation measure that just about ever economist there is says will have little postive effect on the economy but will increase the federal deficit plenty?

Ray-I'm looking forward to seeing your topos. Maybe instead of bivvy spots, you should note party ledges and snafflehound holes.

Spanker: The answer depends on who is buying. To Bill Gates, I bet the $150 bottle is well worth it - and if he has a well developed palette, he can probably honestly tell you it is three times as good. You and I may react as Fleb did - that it is a whole different breed of wine (assuming we have chosen a $150 bottle that suits our individual tastes) but how can we say it is 2x, 3x, or 5x as good. Is Outer Space 1.5x as good as Orbit because it has an extra star in the guidebook?

Fleb- Ross and I have continued the discussion in private messages and I said one thing to him that I will repeat here: don't concentrate on the mathematics like whether you face a factor one vs factor whatever fall. When you begin a lead, one look at the situation and a modicum of common sense tells you to place gear to protect your belyer from a big shock. When you are looking at a difficult move with a potential splatter below, the same analysis will tell you to double up on the pro and, if I am leading on two ropes, I will see if I can get both ropes involved. The calculations may be interesting, but they don't really affect my practices - in the field. As to your conclusion that one should not take a factor one fall on a half rope, I am not so sure that is correct. Isn't the point that the half-rope will stretch at a lower load than a full rope - so you won't generate the same forces? Again, my resonse to such a concern will be exactly the same as stated above.