mattp

I find it pretty funny to see Dru and Harry trying to argue that there is no even vaguely identifiable regular or periodic user group on cc.com. They spend literally several hours a week on the site and they sure seem to notice when someone new posts to the board based on their frequent comments directed toward the "newbie." Both have also been known to make broad general comments about unspecific groups of people - newbies, snowshoers, peak-baggers, rednecks, whoever. Even mountaineers (were not some of the "mounty" pictures actually boealps or something?).

So the quesion remains: are people who waste lots of time on cc.com more prone to having climbing accidents than the mountaineers?

tomtom - we have a secret handshake and everything.

Whether Harry wants to debate the meaning of a "club" or not, there is a definite affiliation thing going at cc.com. Half of my climbing partners stay away from this site, or perhaps lurk but don't post. They are not cc.com'ers. The other half of my partners appear here on a regular basis. They are. Harry is one of the club's elder statesmen.

That was exactly the point, Archy. Ten years ago, we didn't have cc.com and few of us chatted on a daily basis the way many of us do now.

I think you'd have to wait and classify CBS until after he gets involved in an accident. If he is on The Tooth with an intermediate climbing party of Mountaineers, it would be a mounty accident. If he were there with his buddy Peter Puget, it'd be a cc.com misadventure. It does seem like we are having lots of accidents but it may be, as you hint, that we simply talk about them more on cc.com than we might have, say, ten years ago.

I may be able to cut out of work a little early if somebody wants to go to North Bend. I generally prefer Exit 32 over 38.

From the end of that logging road AJ mentions, you can make a slightly dropping traverse into the basin and then, on return, follow your track to minimize climbing back up. You have to cross a couple of tricky avalanche chutes if you go this way, though. Every spring, the avalanche debris in that basin is some of the most impressive I've seen anywhere in Washington but it does seem to go in massive isolated events rather than firing at every skier who ventures in there. The generally shaded slopes at the intermediate elevation on that approach and lower down on the White Salmon itself often take a long time to set up when the snow goes isothermal in the Spring, so it is bottomless muck for at least a couple weeks at this time of year starting, I would guess, some time soon, but the White Salmon is a very scenic and not too hard ski route.

Damn! I think I see a ski run! Its been avvy checked and everything.

Retired General Wilkerson OpEd

Outstanding photos!

I'm just providing simple information If you were looking for a sunny evening at the Ballroom, that was probably LAST night.

Yes, in past years some folks have brought their kids. Some have brought their parents, too. This year, I think our special guest the sendbot will be putting on a bouldering clinic as there is a small boulder right next to the shelter. In addition to the slide shows, if it is nice enough I'm not worried about wetness I may bring a small collection of large printed photos taken by the late Larry Kemp. He was an outstanding photographer, and his rock climbing pictures have appeared on climbing guide covers and in various magazines.

TODAY...SUNNY THEN BECOMING PARTLY CLOUDY LATE. HIGHS IN THE UPPER 60S TO MID 70S. NORTHEAST WIND AROUND 10 MPH. TONIGHT...PARTLY CLOUDY IN THE EVENING THEN BECOMING MOSTLY CLOUDY. LOWS IN THE 40S. LIGHT WIND BECOMING SOUTH 10 TO 15 MPH

TUESDAY...MOSTLY CLOUDY IN THE MORNING THEN BECOMING PARTLY CLOUDY. HIGHS IN THE UPPER 50S TO MID 60S. SOUTH WIND 10 TO 15 MPH. TUESDAY NIGHT...PARTLY CLOUDY IN THE EVENING THEN BECOMING MOSTLY CLOUDY. LOWS 40 TO 45. SOUTH WIND TO 10 MPH.

Join us for a barbeque and slides to celebrate the coming season,Thursday, May 4, at 6:00 pm. We'll be at Woodland Park picnic shelter number 6: Bring something for the grill, or maybe a side dish, slack line or a frisbe. When it is dark enough, we'll show some slides, starting off with John Scurlock showing some of his outstanding North Cascade aerials, and David Whitelaw showing crags illustrated in his recently published "Weekend Rock." If you have something to show, send me a private message. Directions appear on the front page, but here goes again: the picnic shelter is next to the lawn bowling area and horseshoe pits. Head north on Aurora Avenue about a half mile north of N. 50th Street and turn right into a park entrance that is not all that well marked. Just inside the park, steer left and you'll see the picnic shelter on your right. Alternatively, you can head up internal park roads from near the swim stadium/golf course. We'll provide charcoal and paper plates and stuff like that. There will be both digital and analog projectors available.

Whoa. Someplace new?

President George W. Bush was scheduled to visit the Episcopal Church outside Washington as part of his campaign to restore his poll standings. Bush's campaign manager made a visit to the Bishop, and said to him "We've been getting a lot of bad publicity because of the president's position on stem cell research, the Iraq war, Hurricane Katrina, and the like. We'd gladly make a contribution to the church of $100,000 if during your sermon you'd say the President is a saint." The Bishop thought it over for a few moments and finally said, "The Church is in desperate need of funds and I will agree to do it." Bush showed up for the sermon and the Bishop began: "I'd like to speak to you all this morning about our President. George Bush is a liar, a cheat, and a low-intelligence weasel. He took the tragedy of September 11 and used it to frighten and manipulate the American people. He lied about WMDs and invaded Iraq for oil and money, causing the deaths of tens of thousands and making the United States the most hated country on earth. He appointed cronies to positions of power and influence, leading to widespread death and destruction during Hurricane Katrina. He awarded contracts and tax cuts to his rich friends so that we now have more poverty in this country, and a greater gap between rich and poor, than we've had since the Depression. He instituted illegal wiretaps when getting a warrant from a secret court would have been a mere administrative detail, had his henchmen lie to Congress about it, then claimed he is above the law. He has headed the most corrupt, bribe-inducing political party since Teapot Dome. The national surplus has turned into a staggering national debt, gas prices are up 55%, and vital research into global warming and stem cells is stopped cold because he's afraid to lose votes from some religious kooks. He is the worst example of a true Christian I've ever known. But compared to Dick Cheney and Karl Rove, George Bush is a saint."

May 6: Mt. Erie, near Anacortes, WA. The Mt. Erie Adopt-a-Crag is hosted by Solid Rock Climbers For Christ with Dallas Kloke heading up the effort. Contact: dallas dot kloke1 at verizon dot net May 13: Cushman Crags, near Hoodsport, WA. The Cushman Crags Adopt-a-Crag event will be hosted by The Alpine Experience, of Olympia. Contact: Robert Plankers, rob at alpinex dot com The Access Fund promotes Adopt-a-Crag events all around the nation. These upcoming events are planned for Western Washington.

Actually, I think he's referring to the eight-year Whitewater investigation. The current affair is based on allegations that somebody in the President's office actually did something wrong in the conduct of their duties there.

Jay seems to think we have done little to be ashamed of in our treatment of prisoners, but at least some people disagree. Press Release

As KJK pointed out, Chuck, Saddam certainly did provoke us. However, even before 911 and well before the run-up to the war, he knew he was on our "hit list" and his days were numbered anyway. Faced with that reality, his bellicose game of chicken may have seemed like his best play. And remenber: I don't know if KJK has recently said this or not but BushCo says it a lot and I've definitely read the misstatement on this board about how Saddam threw the weapons inspectors out. It was NOT Saddam who threw them out; Bush told them to clear out because we were going to bomb. Doing his dance, Saddam rattled his swords but also allowed the inspections full access. He tried the presidential palace thing as a dodge, but in the end he backed off on that ploy, if I remember correctly.

another link

Nooksak Tower is one of the coolest things around. Some people fear/complain about the rock, and it is definitely rotten, but it is sick for sure - a real spire that is surrounded by tumbling ice, and there is no easy descent. It is one of the harder to attain summits in the range yet not so far into the wilderness as some of the others mentioned here. It is, however, a lot more serious than you suggested when you wrote "mostly snow climbs with a bit of rock/exposure towards the top, but i'm okay with a few pitches of rock up to 5.7 or so."

No bait there, Peter. I think we more or less agree that the proper discussion should have been that the Administration thought there was a problem there which wasn't going to go away so we'd have to deal with it sooner or later. But apart from how you interpret statements that if we waited for proof we'd find that proof in the form of a mushroom cloud over Manhattan, didn't you see the same stories I did about how much of what they were trotting out as evidence was exaggerated at best? Wasn't that cause for just a little bit of skepticism? Did you think we couldn't wait any longer or just that it was time to invade if we were going to do it?