Overtraining

[p_tapley]

just be careful with it man and remember that it's not the end of the world to take a break. for me that was the hardest part; I was so invested in climbing and training I had no idea what to do with myself outside of it, so I kept slipping back into the routine...

 

obviously these are all very relative situations with each case having its own best medicine. don't let me psyche you out with my horror stories, but be sure not to relapse - it is shockingly easy and happened to me several times while under the advice of several different physicians.

 

I agree, overuse of the couch isn't any good either, but your mention of the muscle wasting you encountered is a huge red flag. I don't mean to be doubting your doctors, just want to share my experience and try to help. keep it in check for quite a while and you'll be ok.

 

let me re-iterate...my doctor (the one who finally helped) expressed this clearly: he had multiple relapses and found it easier to slip each time. we need to consider ourselves just like any other junkie. read: once you're an alcoholic, you stay one, perhaps a recovering alcoholic, but the issue persists. make sense?

 

I feel for you man. know that things will be ok...long trails will still be there, bad ass routes will still be there, and your technique will stay with you - probably even shine through better once you're not relying on brute strenght to get you through.

 

just stay chill and let it come. try to avoid setting expectations or time-based goals. eat a burger, read a book and get ready to be harder than ever before you know it.

 

-cheers

[i_like_sun]

Tapley, Sherri, vw4ever,

I can't tell you how much of a difference your posts have made! Meeting other people who have gone through what I'm currently dealing with is making a massive difference in my cognitive health. Most individuals in my life haven't ever experienced what it is like to push one's body to its maximum limit. They don't have any idea what true fatigue feels like! Thank you for your posts.

 

When I experienced the worst of my symtem's catabolic rampage, I began a nutrition diary to make sure that I was getting enough calories. I was simply desperate to stop losing weight! Then, as I desribed in earlier posts, I came down with monoculeosis last fall, and literally "suffered" my way into a 4.0 quarter at Western. Great grades, terrible health....

 

To drastically simplify the story, when I began to finally get the weeks of couch time I needed, I found my body in a state of chronic fatigue. I've never felt so utterly debilitated in my life. Scary. I've even dropped out of school for a quarter so I can put my health first.

 

Over the past three months, the lost pounds started their everdue accural. In fact, my body seems to be dealing with a "shock rebound", because I'm all the way up to 165lbs (a solid 20lb gain, and bigger than I've ever been). My muscle strength is back, but man, I'm looking forward to putting this shit behind me! All I want now is my health and life back, but I do realize that I have to remain chill and build myself up SLOWLY. I tell you guys though, my brain still thinks my body is some killer animal! Caution has to be my biggest priority. I like how Tapley compares this to alcoholism. Because fitness is definately an addiction. Its a strange and fine line to walk, but I am determined to beat this, be balanced, and be a better climber than ever.

 

I'll keep posting as things change. Perhaps this forum can help some other poor bastard out there!

 

Thanks again.

R

[layton]

Photos!

[Blake]

Thanks Blake, that was a super useful post.

 

 

You said all your issues were due to not enough calories on you trips in the mountains. Well, eating more high-fat foods like cheese and sausage will help that. There's a practical reason most alpinists take along fatty foods... lots of calories for the weight!

[p_tapley]

well, good on ya for being open to the long-view man. like I said earlier - everything you're describing about this experience mirrors mine, so it's struck a chord with me. I remember all too well how much suffering is involved with this (ironic too, because suffering in the mountains used to be so much fun - part of my addiction was to live for that discomfort, operating in the red, etc. ask lambone on here sometime about the tapley alpine diet program ).

 

anyway - stay strong (willed that is) and stay patient. this is a great time to focus on school or whatever else is separate from your training addiction that you never had time for. perhaps one of my most profound revalations was the discovery of life outside of climbing. try to look at this as an oportunity to broaden your horizons, or if you can't get past it, an opportunity to reset your system, and re-train your body but this time with a whole world of skill and experience already in place.

 

so, keep us posted and know that you got people. it's a long road I know, so don't forget, if it's a year from now and your body's still not where your head wants to be you can always hit us up for support.

 

-cheers

[i_like_sun]

Actually, yes, I would like to hear about how you managed to mangle your health! And for that matter, what your symptoms were.

 

" This, in turn, led to months of general rest, and I was the most depressed I'd ever been. My mind was telling me to "train! train! train!", but I knew I couldn't. I felt lazy, floppy, and out of shape. "

 

Yes, this part sucks. I know I'm WAY healthier than I've been in months, but jeeze, I used to be so damn ripped! I keep telling myself "it'll come back, be patient". The whole part about feeling lazy, floppy, out of shape, is extremely irritating. I think I'm probably used to being so ungodly fit, that my brain is simply going through withdrawals; going for easy walks seems to slap me out of insanity. Maybe I should put a rubber band on my wrist like those self-mutilator types, so I can sting myself every time I want to go out and run like hell.......

 

R

[Ed_Hobbick]

I've never experienced anything more than normal burnout, but I'm wondering what you did on that day that you pushed it too far, it must have been pretty spectacular!

[i_like_sun]

Oh man, last summer was nothing short of spectacular quadriceps carnage....

 

It wasn't one day in particular, more of a "theme" to my climbing, or rather, lifestyle. I had about six consecutive trips where I would be out for, oh, probably 15 - 18 hours straight, basically what I like to call "shredding". My most massive failure was to not plan my nutrition adequately. If you can imagine how many calories you burn in hard mountaineering, then factor in perhaps only as many as 1700 for my "trail food", I lost ALL of my body fat. Then I noticed that when I came down from climbs, my appetite wasn't its usual ravenous monster, but more of a pathetic sick little bird with a broken wing. On top of that I was working constuction during the week, and weight training in the evenings. Basically, overtraining lead to a wierd little eating dissorder. I simply could not stomach enough. After about 4 months of my appetite dropping lower and lower, I crashed completely and learned what REAL suffering is all about. Man I hope nobody has to feel that kind of pain.........

 

Then, only a few weeks later, I got Mono......... all through the fall I suffered myself through university, and my health simply decided to say "you suck mister, I'm leaving". God damn I fucked up this year! 8 months later, my body is finally out of that "Jacked-to-fuck" state, but still having a hard to keeping up. I'm fianally starting to heal some of the "personality problems" that lead to this, so perhaps I can start to actually LIVE for real and materialize a finer, stronger, smarter me. I am looking forward to putting this shit behind me.

 

Sorry if I've spooked the living shit out of anyone. But burnout can be, as I've learned, probably the hardest lesson for any athlete to overcome. Peace.

 

R

[i_like_sun]

So, after months of being a massive SLUGG, I'm starting to exercise again. Jeeze, going back into the gym and being the most out of shape I've been in years is proving tough on my self asteem! I'm just not used to being out of shape.... in fact by MY standards, I basically just feel FAT.

 

It does feel good to be burning calories again though. The protocol given to me by my doc. has me doing resistance training with light enough weights that I can lift 20 times, 3 X week. Then walking for an hour on the off days..... This is frustrating! I know I've got to do this right, but all I really want to do is go run and get super swetty!

 

I get blood tests next week to see what the hormones are up to, then depending on that she'll either up the intensity or keep it the same....

 

Oh yeah, I'm eating like a horse again! Its fantastic to feel my body back into its normal 23 year old's metabolism! Also, my muscles have pretty much made thier comeback, as everyone is telling me that I look "healthy" and "buff".

[pink]

Last summer, I sort of damaged myself by doing some very long and hard days without nearly enough calories. I experienced sort of a "metabolic slowdown" as a result, and I had to see some endocrine specialists. Then, in the fall, I got really bad mononucleosis. I am starting to recover, but my endurance is taking a wee while to come back.

I was just curious if anyone else out there has dealt with extreme athletic burnout before, and if so, what was your experience?! The docs say to keep my activity up, just not to over do it. This is actually very hard for someone who has been in phenomenal shape before, because I keep thinking that I can handle more than I can! Call it exercise addiction or whatever, but life just isn't complete if you can't workout hard and climb hard! Peace.

 

 

stick to sport climbing

[Chad_A]

So, after months of being a massive SLUGG, I'm starting to exercise again. Jeeze, going back into the gym and being the most out of shape I've been in years is proving tough on my self asteem! I'm just not used to being out of shape.... in fact by MY standards, I basically just feel FAT.

 

 

Big que to ignore this from your mind....your ego is talking.

 

It's referencing back to the way you USED to train, and since your conscious mind knows it can't do that, it's telling you that you're weak and overweight.

 

Don't believe it.

 

You're strong, and yes, you're starting over, but take the lesson you've learned and run with it. Nutrition (even if you gain a bit of body fat, which in mountaineering, is not necessarily a bad thing) is necessary. Trust me, you will not let yourself become overweight, so don't worry about that. And throw the scale out the window. It doesn't matter right now.

 

Eat to fuel the effort, train, then replenish, and don't skimp. Remember, even on an hour and a half trail run, you can easily burn up 1000 calories above your RMR (resting metabolic rate). Keep up the effort.

 

And remember, to get stronger, you have to eat and rest.

[i_like_sun]

Dude, thanks. I have completely stopped weighing myself entirely, and I am eating everything in sight! The coolest thing I've noticed however, is that my muscular endurance is SO much better than it ever was.... I benched and squated 145lbs. for 20 reps yesterday! Fuck, that is so much stronger than I've ever been.... (I know thats alot of reps but I'm working on endurance before max. strength)

 

So all of that makes me feel a bit better about myself. It really does come down to calories I realize. I notice that when I eat simply TONS of food (focusing on alot of fruit and veggies), I don't have the crashes like I was. Plus, blood test have shown my testosterone to be super high again.

[kweb]

Here is an easy way to prevent overtraining before its to late. Figure out what your resting heart rate is (best time is as soon as you wake up in the morning, and after a few days of rest).

If you start to notice the number increase, you are headed down the overtrained highway. Back off until you get it back down again.

[sk]

Three years ago i was climbing at the top of my game. I becasem very ill and was bleeding rectaly.i was dropping weight quickly and very animic. i was pretty convinced i had colon cancer and after avoiding for 4 months finaly went to the doc. they thought i had Chrones or Colitus but after a colonoscapy they discoverd it was some kind of parasite that was already gone. the doc told me i would be okay after a year or so. i still have yet to atain the level of fitness that i had just before that.

[i_like_sun]

Muffy, damn....

 

My first diagnosis of this overtraining thing was "Irritable bowl syndrome". Because my metabolism had slowed so much (2.5% body fat) I was only pooping like, every third or fourth day! Jeeze that sucked...

 

I'm trying to figure this life thing out still. Because it does come down to personality and stress patterns. I've always "used" exercise to relieve stress, even if I am super run down and exhasted - like after midterms, when I'm buzzed to the max, I'm [starving] etc... what do NORMAL people do? Um, probably relax. Me? I decide to go do heavy squats till I puke... Then I crash and burn for an entire week. Its such a bloody waste.

[sk]

Muffy, damn....

 

My first diagnosis of this overtraining thing was "Irritable bowl syndrome". Because my metabolism had slowed so much (2.5% body fat) I was only pooping like, every third or fourth day! Jeeze that sucked...

 

I'm trying to figure this life thing out still. Because it does come down to personality and stress patterns. I've always "used" exercise to relieve stress, even if I am super run down and exhasted - like after midterms, when I'm buzzed to the max, I'm [starving] etc... what do NORMAL people do? Um, probably relax. Me? I decide to go do heavy squats till I puke... Then I crash and burn for an entire week. Its such a bloody waste.

 

 

well before the intestinal thing i spent a large portion of my life incapacitated. this was before i disocerved climbing i didn't know how to relieve stress. I have been diagnosed with IBS conected with Endomitriosis. i have had 3 relativly minor surgeries and one very major one all on my abdomin. the best advice i can give anyone who can not "work out" is YOGA. yoga has saved me and taught me a new level of peace and streangth.

 

when i say i have never been an athletic person i am toatly not joking.

[i_like_sun]

I keep meaning to get into yoga classes. Just haven't found the time yet.

 

Muffy, if you climb you are athletic enough for me! Frankly I don't think it matters how [good] you are at an activity, just that your smile is SUPER MASSIVE!

 

The stess thing is a fantastic point. Yoga sounds like the perfect way to come down from a high horse, not squats and deadlifts!

[Alpinfox]

Yah, I've got a little problem with overtraining myself:

 

[sk]

Yah, I've got a little problem with overtraining myself:

 

:lmao: :lmao:

 

OMG that was so funny

[sk]

I keep meaning to get into yoga classes. Just haven't found the time yet.

 

Muffy, if you climb you are athletic enough for me! Frankly I don't think it matters how [good] you are at an activity, just that your smile is SUPER MASSIVE!

 

The stess thing is a fantastic point. Yoga sounds like the perfect way to come down from a high horse, not squats and deadlifts!

 

Yoga, I am telling you it is wonderful. it's hard for some super activ epeople becuase it is not fast paced. but if you can stick it out the first couple of months and get into it... ya might like it

[jon]

Yah, I've got a little problem with overtraining myself:

 

The story behind that guy is CRAZY. His last name is Valentino or something.

[i_like_sun]

I KNOW THIS GUY! He's the loser who got synthol injections in his arms! Those are not real muscle my freinds, they're chemical sacks! No joke.

 

Just look closely: natural bodybuilders have tons of striations in their muscle bellies. Those are just balloons.

[Sherri]

well before the intestinal thing i spent a large portion of my life incapacitated. this was before i disocerved climbing i didn't know how to relieve stress. I have been diagnosed with IBS conected with Endomitriosis. i have had 3 relativly minor surgeries and one very major one all on my abdomin. the best advice i can give anyone who can not "work out" is YOGA. yoga has saved me and taught me a new level of peace and streangth.

 

when i say i have never been an athletic person i am toatly not joking.

 

werd on the yoga.

 

I just started this year, but I love it.

 

It can be even harder than other types of workouts, especially when you have to hold a pose for more a bit. Since the poses engage stuff you neglect in everyday life, they really get in there and make you work.

 

The balancing poses are a fun challenge, too. Good for focusing and grounding yourself.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 2, 2007 by Sherri

[lizard_brain]

A word about yoga classes:

 

I highly reccommend them. The female/male ratio is usually at least 9:1. Excellent training method.

 

:tup:

[i_like_sun]

A word about yoga classes:

 

I highly reccommend them. The female/male ratio is usually at least 9:1. Excellent training method.

 

:tup:

 

 

I'll get in there this afternoon.