builder206 Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 I rescued a pregnant female cat from a mall parking lot. I kept two of her kittens. One of them was a female. She came on heat very young, before I could spay her, and had four kittens. I kept two, brothers. One lived about 17-1/2 years and the other to within days of his 19th birthday. Both went down with kidney disease. I nursed both of them longer than I should have, including daily subcute fluids and epogen injections. (I would advise against epogen for a variety of reasons) It is pretty tough to see our little pals go down after so long with us. My memories of their end days sometimes cloud my fuller & happier memories of the many years they were healthy and in good spirits. In general, though, I say that God must surely love both people and cats to have put us together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Having now met Latte in real life I can say she's an amazing cat. She sure has a lot to say at times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt_warfield Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 We're going through this exact thing right now with our 14 yr. old cat. Didn't eat or drink for days then the vet (kidney failure) then a bit better after IV THERAPY and then the vet again ($$$$$) and now home with resolve to not visit the vet again until the end. Subcu water, fiddle with food, and wait to see what happens. Your timeline lets one know what is possible but if quality of life is not there, it'll be time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmncwrtr Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Thanks so much for the Latte update, Carolyn! What a lucky kitty to have you for her mommy! Keep having fun with her!!!! And Happy Belated Birthday! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
builder206 Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 My guys were first diagnosed with kidney problems around age 14 or 15. I needed to do rather little for them for a long time after that. Once things got really serious, my recollection is that they lasted something on the order of 14-16-18 months. Caveat: I was super-dedicated to keeping up with their subcute fluids, meds, etc. each and every day. They were pretty sick by then. I would do thinsg differently now. I would not get myself so strung out with their treatment---by the end, I was very stressed and frazzled---nor would I let them linger so long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobo Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 My Trango lived for about 18 months after his initial CRF diagnosis. I almost gave up climbing (as you've heard carolyn allude to) for that time, because I just didn't trust anyone else to keep up on his medication regimen. LRS subQs 3x/day, meds, special foods, treats, etc. Still, I wouldn't have done it any other way. Trango was very kind to me in the way he passed out of this world, as I didn't have to stress out on "which day was the day" to put him down. He chose his own time and manner, and it didn't become apparent until the following morning. A few here on this board know that story... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolyn Posted December 13, 2007 Author Share Posted December 13, 2007 I would do thinsg differently now. I would not get myself so strung out with their treatment---by the end, I was very stressed and frazzled---nor would I let them linger so long. I hear ya. I think most animal owners just want to let their furry friends live out their lives as comfortable as possible. It is a total judgement call on the owners part as to how much they are willing and capable of doing to keep them comfortable until that time comes. Like I said, Im not longer taking her in for bloodwork. I wont assist feed (I will spoon feed when necessary), I wont give her pills (WAY to traumatic for her), and Im honestly not too concerned about 'what' she eats (she basically eats kitty crack right now. I hope I am able to eat as much yummy, crappy food in my last months). She gets her sub-q fluids, adjusted to her needs and LOTS of love/attention. There are plenty of other medications and procedures I could offer her, but they would all (imho) increase her stress, thus reduce the quality of her life. That said, Latte had what I believe to be a seizure tonight. Ive seen her have about 3 "awake" in the past few years and dozens in her sleep. This was an "awake" type. She never appears to be affected negatively when its done. In fact right now she is doing her evening laps of the house and nibbling on her food. My first reaction is call the vet and bring her in tomorrow. Realistically there is nothing that can be done. Unless or until it appears to be affecting her quality of life, I need to just let it be. Its just another reminder of how much I will miss her and appreciation for days like today, when I got to cuddle in bed with her for hours and read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pindude Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 Sorry about the seizure, Carolyn, but glad to hear things are OK with Latte overall, and you're spending some good time together. I'm sure you're doing all the right things. We've got 2 older cats who keep bouncing back and are currently doing well: one with Irritable Bowel Syndrome who's mostly holding her own with careful diet and several different med's (she's real demure and accepting, and doesn't mind being pilled), and another who we're treating for pyelonephritis. Katy was going downhill until we sprung for an ultrasound, allowing for the pyelonephritis Dx and subsequent Tx with an antibiotic. Vet had to shave Katy's tummy and sides for the ultrasound, so she's now walking around with a mohawk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobo Posted December 13, 2007 Share Posted December 13, 2007 That's rich, Steve! Pussy With a Mohawk! Sounds like a name for a punk band! You could always tone it down for the kiddies by changing it to Kitty With a Mohawk... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolyn Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 Time for an update!!! Latte is kickin' back and enjoying her remaining time. A recent (minor) infection required a visit to the vet. Somehow I was convinced to run a set of labs on her, despite my promise to her that they would never draw her blood again. There was good reasoning for it and I have no regrets. Her lab tests came back with some being the same and some better than in September!!!! She has also gained a little over a pound! Thats a lot for a cat who weighed just over 6lbs. She definately has her rough days, but it appears that she wants to stick around and keep me homebound for a bit longer. In the meantime I have done a great deal of research regarding the medication she was given (metacam). I have had some productive conversations with the MN vet board and the FDA regarding the dosing confusion, Client Information Sheets not being given out prior to administration, and the drug company. It appears as if the drug company has its reps telling vets the drug is approved and "safe", but the label hasnt been changed yet. It also appears that Latte was given twice the recommended dose in european countries where the drug is approved. I am working with both organizations to send out a letter to vets making sure they are keeping up with literature on acceptable dosing as well as following state and/or federal law regarding informed consent. I have also requested an investigation and/or warning to the drug company regarding their reps misrepresenting the medication. Im optimistic, maybe nieve. I think a change could be made to make sure owners are informed before deciding to give this medication or any NSAID (pain reliever). So thats the scoop. She is a fighter and its rubbing off on me. carolyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 go latte! go latte! good on you for working to fix the situation!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmncwrtr Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 Wonderful news, Carolyn And wtg on both Latte's and your fighting spirit. That's great what you are doing to help other cat owners. Latte's got an awesome mommy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobo Posted March 13, 2008 Share Posted March 13, 2008 That's just great, carolyn! Latte sure has it made with the Mommy she chose. Fight! Fight! Fight! Gooooooooooooooooo Team! And good on ya for trying to rectify the situation regarding the metacam. BTW, have you located the old doc that the drug companies buried in the bowels of the interior of the Pfizer complex yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolyn Posted March 14, 2008 Author Share Posted March 14, 2008 BTW, have you located the old doc that the drug companies buried in the bowels of the interior of the Pfizer complex yet? Well the dr from pfizer involved in the class action suit is now with BI Vetmedica - metacam. Im not sure where the original metacam dr got displaced to. He apparently went out the door the same time they stopped providing compensation. Its too bad, because up until my last conversation with him I found him VERY helpful. My vet called them again to see if they would reopen my case, but according to BIV they are no longer providing compesation to any cats with adverse reactions. She offered to write a letter, but doesnt think it will do any good. Im going to have her do it anyway. I will see her on Saturday with latte because we found the injectible famotidine and they want to show me how to administer it. I can talk to her then. I think if any of the reps told her the drug was approved OR told her where to find information on the dosage in cats (which is common practice recently reported to the FDA)then she may have some pull . On the other hand Im really beginning to understand how much bureaucracy is involved with the simple request of providing clients with information on the drugs which vets administer to their furry friends, or at least certain ones like NSAID's. I dont exactly understand how the FDA can mandate the CIS (client information sheet) on a federal level, yet any state can exclude that from their regulations. My understanding is that employees of the FDA have been fired over advocating for informed consent of an owner with certain off label drugs (NSAID's), among other things. I guess when it comes down to it the equation looks like this - CIS = informed owner = less distribution of some medications = less money in the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies. Im a little scared with all the information I have obtained. I feel like Im in some John Grisham book and someone is waiting around the corner to shoot me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 carolyn, you are amazing. you are really sticking with this in an amazing way. latte is so lucky vetrinary pharmaceuticals is such a tricky area b/c its not well regulated and most of the drugs used to treat our furry friends are drugs developed and tested in people. there's not a lot of study or research done with them to determine dosing for our furry friends. just to reiterate what carolyn has been pointing out, ask lots and lots of questions about what medicines your pet is getting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmncwrtr Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 Very good advice, Minx. Even vaccines can give reactions in pets just like in kids. One of my cats, Rocket, ended up with a cyst at the spot where they gave him a Rabies vaccine. It took two surgeries to get rid of it. No more of those shots for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobo Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 Mel, If Rocket is an indoor cat, or mostly indoors, rabies vaccinations are not necessarily necessary. Rabies is contracted by getting into violent scrapes with other infected cats/critters. So if Rocket stays inside all day, there's no carrier with which to come into contact. If he "escapes" or occasionally goes outside, even then the odds of his coming into contact with a carrier are rather low. We stopped the annual vacc for rabies for Phydeaux years ago, and have seen no issues. He's a lover, not a fighter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 watch out skipping vaccines. like sobo said, especially for indoor/outdoor types of cats. the disease risk is much more serious than a cyst. the good news is that most vaccines are species specific so they've been tested for the animal that's receiving them. there are occasional side effects but generally they are mild as for not vaccinating children, don't even get me started. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmncwrtr Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 I wasn't talking about not vaccinating kids or animals, Minx, just saying that there are side effects of them and pet owners should be aware. When you take kids in for shots the side effects and reactions are mentioned by pediatricians (fevers, fussiness) and you're given a sheet of what signs to look for before kids get vaccines. In my cats case, the vet said the disease outweighs the risk when talking about pet vaccines and that was pretty much it. Yet this side effect was serious. The cyst got so big and hurt him so bad, we had to get it out of there. Twice. Our other two cats, one who does go outside, continued to be vaccinated for it. But when Rocket's sister got diagnosed Hyper-T, they stopped all her vaccines. She's now doubled her weight and is fully recovered after her radioiodine therapy so I'm sure they'll start vaccinating her again when we take her in next week for her yearly exam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted March 14, 2008 Share Posted March 14, 2008 wasn't really directed at you specifically. just a rant in general. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolyn Posted June 5, 2008 Author Share Posted June 5, 2008 Hey its time for an update! Latte is doing the same ol same ol, though her good and bad days are often closer together than they used to be. Im getting a feeling lately that she is kind of sick and tired of getting shots and syringed medicine. I got her a new "friend" - a betta fish. She has been enjoying watching 'matilda' quite a bit. Someone recently gave me a larger fish tank, so I hope to get some help picking up supplies this weekend and filling it with some goldfish (plasma tv for a cat!). There are a few interesting updates on the political front with the drug company, though I need to save that news until its all confirmed. One thing I can say is that I recently received a letter from my Attorney General in response to a complaint I filed against the company. though not liable for their product - (ha!) they will offer $500 dollars toward Latte's veterinarian care. Obviously I will accept. However, I will not accept without making it clear that I hold the company liable for their product and employees, who advocate its off label (unapproved) use. I have all receipts from her veterinarian and will ask for an amount closer to what has been spent and needs in order to stay comfortable until she is ready to move on. OMG! When will that be! Love her to pieces, but sometimes I wonder WHY she likes it here so much! Since she will be paid off at the end of this month, I may ask for a refund of $100 from what I have paid so I can buy a new pair of climbing shoes! Wooohooo! No more barge cement!!!! The rest will go into a slush fund for future veterinary and end of life expenses. carolyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobo Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 Carolyn, Glad to hear how Latte is doing. I won't repeat what I said in my email here re BIV, you already have it. The reason she likes it here so much is YOU. That should be obvious. Latte has lived this long post-Dx, with what I can see by your updates/emails is a good quality of life, because of the exceedingly fine care you have given her. You have researched her condition to infinity; mobilized State Attorneys General forces not just for her, but for other kitties; made huge life changes for yourself, not to mention numerous personal sacrifices; and just "been there" for her. She could not have asked for a better Mommy than you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minx Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 carolyn-- you are so awesome! i'm glad latte is with you. you will know when its time. i am glad that you're getting some compensation from the manufacturer. and i hope you find the perfect climbing shoes too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
builder206 Posted June 5, 2008 Share Posted June 5, 2008 At the time I put down my last cat at age 19 the vet said that he had hung on as long as he did because he knew I wanted him to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carolyn Posted June 28, 2008 Author Share Posted June 28, 2008 I figured after my post on the climbers forum I should update... I can count on one hand the number of times latte has eaten on her own (w/o a stimulant or being assisted) in the last 3 weeks. Her labwork 3 weeks ago came back normal for the first time since this fiasco, so I was pretty suprised when she couldnt keep anything down two days later. Last week I brought her in for blood work and it showed her kidney functioning was deteriorating more. It should still be managable w/o such severe symptoms (not eating), lethargy, a bit of hiding, etc. If its not the kidneys than I dont know. I cant afford, nor do I care to put her through more poking and prodding just to find out all I can really do are treat her symptoms. Its confusing because she is still grooming, not vomiting anymore, talkative most days, somewhat her normal self (what is left of it after the metacam). She does have her sparkling moments. Yet her bloodwork, her fighting the medicine (she pockets her pills and spits them out elsewhere in the house), excessive drinking, lethargy, hiding (maybe its the heat), her occassional looks of enough is enough. Im taking her in for some basic bloodwork tomorrow. If it is rising (kidneys deteriorating) I will probably do another check within a week or so. If there is a rising pattern I will need to prepare for that inevitable day. If it is stable, I dont know what the fuck I will do (forgive the language in cafe sensitivioso). I just know that not being able to eat on your own is a HUGE quality of life issue. Whether it is more an issue for myself (its exhausting to assist feed) or for her, I dont know. Im trying to sort it out and not project my exhaustion and frustration onto her. I hate to give up on a being that WANTS to live. Yet I hate to keep one around that is only doing so for me. We have had a number of 'talks', but all she seems to say back to me is "MEOW". I still havent figured out what it means I must say with sincere sadness I had to flush Matilda (the fish) down the toilet today. I felt sooooo bad. Now I wonder and hope I can take care of these guppies and aquatic frog I bought a few weeks ago for the 10 gallon tank. They seem to be thriving at the moment, but so did matilda. Im such a sucker! Carolyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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