Chriznitch Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 the first thought I had after reading about the possibly cut rope--it was due to iced up knots and/or cold hands
high_on_rock Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 An injured arm would possibly explain why there was one glove left in the cave, and partially explain why at least one of the ice tools was left. It is my understanding that all of the gear was found in the cave where the body was not. Is that correct? Do we know yet what was found in the cave with the body?
Didgie Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 has anyone come up with a pic/map of the mtn with the locations of the caves, tracks etc.?
Zeta Male Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 Much thanks for the tremendously informative info Sean. Â There were quotes in the paper yesterday that suggested that the surviving climbers' being on the S/SE/SW side was as much a possibility as anywhere else but that the search of these areas was being discontinued only because it is so vast and therefore impossible to search thoroughly with the available resources; I found this, if accurate, somewhat disturbing.
Zeta Male Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 If the other climbers were alive and had not fallen or something happen to them don't youy think someone would have seen them coming down the mountain yesterday on a good day. not trying to be morbite just realistic and the poor families need closer and i pray they get that and don't have to what until the spring.Iam still praying. Â One or both of them could still be merely unconscious or otherwise immobilized - perhaps he/they stumbled into rocks in white-out conditions.
margaret Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 Lurker, you u may be correct. The glove left behind may very well be because of his injured arm. It is nice to have found a forum such as this. The Fox News forums and AOL forums have been absolutely discusting the last few days in regards to the missing hikers. It is so sad to think of the suffering these men and their families have endured. It would be nice to see a map of the Newton Clark Glacier area showing the "gullies." Any links? Don't ever stop caring about others. xoxo Â
billcoe Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 Posted on page 15 and brought forward. Â I've just spent the past three hours reading every post on this extended thread. I'm not a climber so this will be my first and last post on this site. Thanks for the privledge. Â What I have seen, heard and read over the past week in following these three climbers is somthing we should all strive for - - putting our dreams and desires into action - - climb a mountain for example. Â These climbers did just that. Got up, got out, and are trying something difficult but something they love doing. Â My lesson from listening to all you folks and watching this story unfold is that we should all take their example of daily courage and follow this path to happiness. Â That's what I learned from understainding their story. Â Â Best post in quite a while babachu, thanks for the reminder. We all can understand the extreme pain that the family is in. However, we climbers realize that all of us will die all too soon. Too many of us involved in these kind of active sports, by our own hand. We only get one shot at life, and these guys were doing it. Â We have no choice as for us it is only to live life to the hilt. We are reminded of our mortality all too frequently, sadly like when brothers like these are not with us any longer. Â For those of us with memories of nearly biting the big one via hypothermia, it may be one of the very best ways to go, almost a pleasant experience as both the cold and any memory of cold or suffering slides away, leaving you in a very pleasant stupor. Â Whatever else you can say for these guys, certainly they went down like brothers we would all like to have climbed with: taking care of the injured man and ensuring his (relative) safety, like true climbers. Like brothers. Â Considering the unimaginable crazy weather that these men must have been battling against with all of their lives and might....it had to be a story we will never know of stoic, quiet, desparate heroism and fight. Â Â Bless them all.
iancurtis Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 An injured arm would possibly explain why there was one glove left in the cave, and partially explain why at least one of the ice tools was left. It is my understanding that all of the gear was found in the cave where the body was not. Is that correct? Do we know yet what was found in the cave with the body? The sheriff states today that there really was only one "snow cave" - the place where the gear was found sounds more like a belay station with a windbreak cut. Â "there was an anchor, with a snow cave - and it's more like a shelter, it wasn't a good snow cave like the first one they built, where the body is. It's another one that they - it's more like a place that they cut out of the snow on a steep hillside, to work from because it had an anchor right there - it had two aluminum snow anchors driven in the snow with some webbing, which only told us that while they were there they put something in the snow so they could clip in and be safe because there's two slings coming off that, which kinda indicates that two people used their carabiners to clip into the rope, for the purpose of just being stable, on a steep slope on the mountain. " Â They wouldn't need two pickets to rappel, so maybe one was downclimbing while the other belayed him tied into that anchor. But that doesn't explain where they went, and why they didn't take their pickets. Â Perhaps someone who saw the place where they found the gear firsthand can clarify this.
Zeta Male Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 the first thought I had after reading about the possibly cut rope--it was due to iced up knots and/or cold hands  I think they wanted to leave enough rope to signal James Kelly's location but wanted to take the rest with them, so they cut it.
Chriznitch Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 after rereading everything, it sounds like tracks approached the newton-clark headwall and then backtracked towards the cave. It sounds as if the "gullies" are actually the major right and left gullies of the north face.
KitCatherine Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 I know I am new here, but I have been reading this forum for a few months now, and I just have to say "thank you" to all of you, who have really taken to heart what the families are feeling. I know myself, having only in the past year, deciding that I want to learn to climb, and reading what you have said, just shows me how compassionate of a group that is here. Both yesterday and today, I have cried, just watching the news. And coming here still gives me hope for the families. I just wanted to say "thank you" for that, because although it seems like hope is slipping, many of you are saying reasons to still not give up, and to still hold out.
Christy Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 (edited) I'm new to mtns too, Kit and I think that's why I've lurked here too...even if it's a long shot, I needed to hear from real climbers that their skills and supplies can still culminate in a miracle. Â I'm holding out hope for Brian & Nikko, and praying for their families...what a long ordeal for them all. Edited December 19, 2006 by Christy
margaret Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 I have spent my 36 years thinking very little about climbing, if at all. A good outcome of this tragedy could be the awareness it has brought to our nation. This tragedy has gotten the interest of many non-hikers. I venture to guess that this site has never seen so much traffic and that many "regulars" will be glad to see all of us "strangers" disappear. The majority of us "strangers" are just extremely empathetic people, and strongly desire a positive outcome. In the process however, I am so thankful for my newfound knowledge, awareness and respect of climbing. *** The loss of these beautiful men is just devastating. ***
Christy Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 *** The loss of these beautiful men is just devastating. *** Â So far, make that singular.."man". I still have visions of Brian and Nikko walking out, but I've always been an optimist. :)
Christy Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 Can anyone post a good link to local weather conditions at Mt Hood? I'd like some 'real time' info on the weather in that area if it is available.
gosolo Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 I have been following this thead and a familiar with Mt. Hood. I have nothing but the deepest compassion for the climbers friends and family. But realistically, there is little hope for the two missing. Any of you who were stuck in a snow cave for that long would be jumping out seeking attention in the current weather. Reality is difficult, but holding out false hopes does not help either. Based upon what the sherrif said this morning it sure sounded like a recovery operation, not a rescue today. My condolences.
quicker_than_ewe Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 http://www.nwac.us/products/OSOTML Â Northwest avalanche center data baa
LhotseDreems Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 It's called a search engine...  Awesome work SAR/MR you guys are rockin' it  I hope that the other two are merely missplaced at the moment and will come home with a helluva story soon. My sympathies to the James family.
MauiHawk Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 sean, Â Thanks, good info. Â I had been under the impression that both the snowcaves had been very close together on the north side. I presume it was by following the direction of the footprints that Kelly's snowcave was discovered? Otherwise it seems pretty miraculous that it was discovered over there as it sounded like the brunt of the operation was focuses on the north face.
mdw Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 Hoodie, it that you in the video. Was this part of the rescue party. Great images. It looks like about 50mh winds. Wicked.
Hoping4Today Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 Here's a map from the Oregonian (PDF) FWIW... Â Oregonian Map
Christy Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 (edited) It's called a search engine... Â Thanks, I'm familiar with them. I couldn't find anything that was updated often enough. Â Thanks for the Oregonia PDF, Hoping. Â Edited for spelling *rolls eyes* Edited December 19, 2006 by Christy
texplorer Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 The map says the climbers caves were 300ft below the top but it looks to me like their spots on their picture are nowhere close to the top 300ft of the mountain
KitCatherine Posted December 19, 2006 Posted December 19, 2006 They just showed on CNN and Nightly News that the caves were at the top of the anchored "y" Formation on the NF of the mountain at 300 feet below the summit. Maybe its just the angle of the photography? I am wanting to hear what new clues they found today. Â Someone asked if the only injury sustained was the broken arm, and so far, reports said he had a severely broken arm, and that was all found at that time.
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