jfmctlaw

good news........ Just mins ago http://blog.oregonlive.com/breakingnews/2007/02/searchers_reach_climbers_repor.html

Ketch, That's an awesome pic.

What good is a map/compass in a white out? Yes, it's nice to know your heading but it's pretty hard to know where you are without some landmarks or sightings....agree?

Where the hell were you? Not sure what your point is. Are you saying Kim got helos and telcos and multiple SARs all working together? Did you read the research piece on Oregonian about the SNAFUs? http://www.oregonlive.com/search/index.ssf?/base/news/11663313078330.xml?oregonian?lctop&coll=7

Telektr, nice thoughts. I hope everyone had a chance to read Jerry's TR from Rainier (with pics) last year. It's a great report and lesson all in one. I will never forget his closing words as he spoke about his gear prior to the fall into the crevasse: "Yes I felt like a nerd walking from Schurman to the flats with all that stuff rigged. No I will never feel like a nerd again." http://www.cascadeclimbers.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/481405/page/7#Post481405

So how come cellphones can stay on for 100-200 hours and track GPS whenever it's on, as you claim, whereas GPS devices only last 10-20 hours? And why can't I pay Verizon $100 extra up front (or $1 per use) for me to grab my cell's own GPS coords? They're always looking for itemized ways to make money. What's your qualifications for talking about this? The power drain for your handheld gps type devices is mostly the display. Verizon and Sprint do offer GPS services on some of their phones. Search for Verizon VZ Navigator. I'm pretty sure Verizon also has a neat little phone you can give to your kid and you can track your kid on the 'net' using the GPS technology.

I don't think most cellphones have a GPS... I thought they calculate the triangulations of the celltowers themselves to get coords, instead of having the celltowers compute it? Many cell phones for sale since early 2002 are 'E911' capable. That means GPS info can be transmitted. I agree the system is not mature or uniform within the US. Check your manual if you aren't sure. The phone is embedded with a Global Positioning System chip, which can calculate your coordinates to within a few yards by receiving signals from satellites. In the E911-capable phone, the GPS chip does not wait until it senses danger, it's switched on whenever your handset is powered up and is always ready to transmit your location data back to a wireless carrier's computers. Ok, enough cell phone stuff for me.

I agree accuracy can vary and certainly be less than what I quoted, but the accuracy has nothing to do with cell towers on a 911 call. It has to do with how many GPS satellites your phone can receive. (Yes, you have a tiny GPS receiver inside your phone) The more sky, usually the better accuracy, so above tree line is usually very good. Now if you can't hit a cell tower from the mnt then you are SOL b/c you can't transmit that fine GPS coords from your phone.

Pinging or making a routine call does not give accurate location info to the Telco. At worst it says you are 'near' some tower. A 911 call transmits the GPS info and they know where you are usually withing +/- 2 meters.

That is a long subject, dependent on many variables (hydration, exertion, air or water temp, wind chill, wet or dry clothing, time of last meal, blood loss from trauma). If we are talking hypothermia only the speed of demise primarily depends on the temperature differential the person is experiencing on their skin. You can become hypothermic by swimming in a lake in July if the water is cool enough, there is a nice breeze and you stay in for some time. I don't want to say much more for fear of being 'spanked' for being off topic. I already got spanked yesterday.

Pinging is nothing more than a handshake btwx the cell tower and cell phone. Something like Tower: "Hello, anyone there?" Phone: "Yep, phone No. 123 reporting in" or the phone says: Any Towers out there? Tower: Yep, tower 2 right here.

Hyponatremia is another medical condition occurring from an imbalance of electrolytes (extreme exertion is one path to this condition). Impaired judgment and disorientation are likely symptoms. Fluid intake consisting of water alone exacerbates the condition. You must receive some salt to alleviate this condition. The autopsy tomorrow may shed some light on whether Kelly suffered any traumatic head injury.

It appears the photos depict what gear they carried with them on the ascent, and possibly what gear they did not have.

I've treated many dislocated shoulders. The pain can be excruetiating and the PT can only move slowly and carefully. One could barely hike a moderate trail to safety, never mind climb or descend a steep slope. You also lose the use of both arms for balance as you usually use your good arm to cradle/protect the injured limb. If it happened before the summit, I think that Brian and Nikko would have to literally haul Kelly up that mountain.

The gullies are a little harder to see. The left gully is right below the red dot and filled with snow. It's like a valley only standing up on its end. The right gully is just to the right of the left gully and parallel to it. Both run straight up the mountain.