salbrecher Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 I'm thinking of buying either the bibler eldorado or the integral designs MK2 and was wondering if anyone has used one or both and has any reason why one is better than the other for wind, snowloading, functionality, workmanship, breathability, and overall strength. I have a 4 season double wall hilleberg I use in most situations but want either of the above tents for specific alpine climbs and to use on my double portaledge. Stefan Quote
willstrickland Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 You might try a search on ID vs bibler or similar. I recall at least one lengthy thread comparing the pro/con of the two. Quote
John Frieh Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 Which portaledge? I believe the eldo is too long to fit completely on all ledges on the market. I have a custom BD I tent that they made specifically to fit the BD double skylounge (floor zippers, reinforcements, tie in point, etc etc) and it barely fits on the ledge. As far as the two tents go I have spent most of my time in Bibler tents... no complaints... any problems I have had with the tents I have owned BD has fixed promptly for free. With that said both models seemed comparable. I know at least two other threads exist that cover the same topic... consider searching the gear critic forum. Quote
David Trippett Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 Has anyone tried/seen a Mt. Hardware EV2? Quote
John Frieh Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 Shock cord more likely to freeze overnight and then snap/break while disassembling the next morning. IMO internal poles make for a faster setup but I guess that is personal experience... Quote
cj001f Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 Shock cord more likely to freeze overnight and then snap/break while disassembling the next morning. that's a one in a million failure, particularly in the relatively warm PNW Quote
underworld Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 my annoyance with external poles (on my marmot 'up high' tent) is that it makes a less smooth exterior of the tent and adds to the snow accumulation on the walls. in windy, wintery conditions at least. Quote
John Frieh Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 This isn't the CCH thread d00d Who climbs in just the PNW? Even if you did I believe the eldo is lighter then the Mtn Hardwear one (I should check this...). Quote
John Frieh Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 How much does vestibule add? Also compare sq footage... I think the EV2 is closer to a I tent footprint... not the I tent. With that said I believe the MK1 has the smallest footprint. Quote
cj001f Posted January 11, 2006 Posted January 11, 2006 Who climbs in just the PNW? Not me, I've climbed in more countries than you this past year [/end spray] I've never heardof, nor had problems with shockcords in good repair snapping down to -20F. Quote
David Trippett Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 God I hope it stops raining soon.....so that I can escape this black hole that is called the internet. -EV2(with integrated vestibule) 105"L x 48"W x 41"H Ground area=31 ft. sq. Minimum weight= 4.2 lbs.... -Bibler Eldorado(with Vestibule) 51"W x 43"H x 129" L Ground area= ~31 sq ft. (they only give the tent area w/out vestibule) Weight=5lbs 9 oz. -Eldo W/out vestibule 51 x 43 x 87 Area=27 sq ft weight = 4 lbs 5oz. Quote
JoshK Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 The MK1 is a better tent than the Eldo. It is almost an indentical floorplan but it has a much better pole attachment system (simple velcro instead of crappy breakable plastic things) and then venting is better, IMHO. It was also less epensive last time I checked. It is the same exact fabric as well. Integral calls it IntegralTex where as Bibler calls it ToddTex. Quote
solomission Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Have never done any climbing but I do have an MK1 XL and another rig by Integral Designs the Mega Sola which is a large hooped bivy shelter. Both are made of Tegraltex which I have found to be a very breathable fabric. Plus this stuff is a very tough durable fabric. You will not have to baby a shelter made of this stuff.Haven't seen a Bibler tent before but they seem to have a good reputation. Both tents seem very similar. The MK1XL has 2 tunnel vents which aid in ventilation which the Bibler does not appear to have. There is also a full mesh door if needed and I believe these can be ordered with a second door, and a light floor. Mine has a standard floor which like the rest of the tent is tough. I have read that the MK1XL has a better sytem for attaching the poles not only the velcro but the cups in the corners where you put the pole ends are supposed to be better than the Bibler. Again this is just what I've read. I've only used the MK1XL once on the East Coast Trail here in Newfoundland, Canada less than a month ago in about -12 degree tempertures. No condensation or frosty buildup inside the tent. I've used the Mega Sola which is made of the same material, is smaller and has only one tunnel vent year round and have not had condensation problems, so I can vouch for the breathability of these tents, at least in this environment, which is on the east coast, with the Atlantic Ocean crashing away in the background. I've read alot of good things about the MK line of tents and although I haven't put them to the test it's still nice to have top quality gear when you're winter camping. Like I said haven't seen a Bibler but I can vouch for the Integral Designs shelters. The MK1XL sets up in about two minutes weighs less than 5 pounds and is built to last. You can't go wrong with it. Not a bad deal at $550 for a top end mountain tent. Quote
Don_Serl Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 the finest of the bunch is the Terra Nova (formerly Wild Country) Mountain Gemini. see: http://www.gear-zone.co.uk/eshop/Terra-Nova-Mountain-Gemini.html about the same footprint (82.5" x 47"), but low (37.5"). pretty much the same wt (4.1lbs). nearly the same cost (GBP314 = USD360). the major advantage to the external polesleeves is that the tent can be properly guyed out in a storm. i've lived thru a couple doozies, and once this sucker is properly tensioned it will withstand just about anything. blow hard on an internally poled tent, and the whole thing just lies down flat in your face and flaps, cuz u can't guy it - there's nothing to pull against without "popping" whatever system holds the poles to the canopy. the major disadvantages to the Gemini are: 1. it's really small inside, and feels moreso cuz of the low ceiling (which does however decrease the windage). 2. there's no bug-net, so it's shit in the summer (altho u can pack along a 2m chunk of net and drape it over the awning - pretty funky...) pros and cons: 3. the ID has better ventilation. but the Gemini has a tougher floor... 4. it's probably easier in a storm to get a tent with internal poles up, cuz one person can climb inside to hold the whole flapping mess on the ground while erecting the poles. but (see earlier point) it tends to stay a flapping mess even after it's up. and i have managed to erect the Mtn Gemini a cpl times in pretty rough weather. 5. i once in my life had a problem with poles freezing into external pole-sleeves (rainy winter evening turning to clear super-cold nite). this would never be an issue with internal poles. having said at the outset that i reckon the Mtn Gemini is the best, if i had it to do all over again i'd probably buy the Integral Mk2XL, just to get the extra 4" length. the Bibler Eldorado similarly adds 5" length. ya, it adds close to a pound, but the space is worthwhile for the comfort. not so much of an issue if you're 5'10" or less. cheers, don Quote
JoshK Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 The MK1XL has guy points. I've guyed mine out several times and found it to be a tank in the wind. Quote
wdietsch Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 nearly the same cost (GBP314 = USD360) not dis'n ya Don ....314 GBP is more like 550 USD, I assume that is what you meant Quote
Don_Serl Posted January 13, 2006 Posted January 13, 2006 nearly the same cost (GBP314 = USD360) not dis'n ya Don ....314 GBP is more like 550 USD, I assume that is what you meant apologies - calculated USD560, typed 360. didn't proof-read well enuf... oops, don Quote
YWESKI Posted January 13, 2006 Posted January 13, 2006 I have used both Bibler I-tent and the MK1XL and here are my thoughts on each: Bibler Pro's: More solid in the snow & wind. The peak vents work better than the MK. The side wall guideout points are included with the tent (the MK does not, you have to order this as an option). The vestibule design (sold separately) is much better than ID. It does not have snow built up as much as ID. The vestibule door design is a lot easier to use, too. Bibler Con's: Harder to set up because the fabric is so taut when I insert the poles, my least favorite is the corner buttons, you have to insert each pole tips into these small metal pockets. ID MK1XL Pro's: Much easier to set up; no plastic clips (as mentioned from other post), no corner pockets. ID offers custom-made tent with different color and feature options. The standard tent floor is a lot thicker than Bibler. And last but not least, the MK1 is made in Canada vs. China for the Bibler ID MK1XL Con's: The vestibule design needs major improvement. I actually don't like the vent tube that much. It does need more guideout in the wind since the tent is not as taut as Bibler. About the breathability, Tegraltex and ToddTex are actually the very same fabric, both companies purchase their PTFE laminate from the same source. But Bibler I-tent seem to breath better because of the peak vent design. Just my 2 cents. Hope that helps. Quote
Jedi Posted January 14, 2006 Posted January 14, 2006 What's wrong with buying from China? How in the hell will China own the US without our continue support? Lets all rally and shop at Walmart, Lowes, Home Depot, Target and the like. IS EVERYONE WITH ME? Comeon!!! Sorry, I'm just bummed about China now owning both ends of the Panama Canal. Bastards will have us in a serious economic choke hold before it's overwith. Boycot China!!! buy the MK1 or EV2 Quote
rhyang Posted January 15, 2006 Posted January 15, 2006 Boycot China!!! buy the MK1 or EV2 the label on my EV2 says "Made in Taiwan, sewn in China" Quote
Jedi Posted January 15, 2006 Posted January 15, 2006 Boycot China!!! buy the MK1 or EV2 the label on my EV2 says "Made in Taiwan, sewn in China" OHHH it figures! There's no getting away from it, eh? In the future, there will be very few choices, on where things will be made. Quote
rhyang Posted January 15, 2006 Posted January 15, 2006 Well in theory we should be able to make lots of money selling stuff to China. I know two people already who spend a lot of time over there doing just that. Time to put on our entepreneur hats I guess and get global ... Quote
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