crazyjizzy Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 Carabiners break when they suffer a blow, casting defects, or undergo loading in a gate open position. Years ago, Yates Screamers were resposible for many carabiner failures because as the stitches blew, the gates would rattle open, and the biner could eventually break. This happened to us on a early ascent of the ZM when a fixed RURP with a rip runner held, and the bean broke. To aleviate this people started using lockers, or the newer wire gates. Wire gates are much less likely to come open in the above scenerio due to their lesser inertial mass. I don't think any climbing rope would act as a static rope during a zipper fall. The rope would rebound quickly, and more importantly, the rope would stretch a fucking mile. I have tied ropes to Cat D4's and the other end to a tree, and they will stretch and stretch, and stretch. Aid climbers have taken lots of rippers, and if ropes lost their dynamic ability part way thru a zipper, then the impact force would kill the poor fucker that fell. With the exception of highly fracured, rotten, or poorly indurrated sediments I think that cams fail when they are poorly placed. Period. I believe that the friction between the cam and the rock is always greater than the force on the cam. Even in Indian Creek, where you can see "skid" marks of cams resulting from a fall, it is the underlying sandstone that is failing, not the frictional interface(senso stricto). The rocks of the Columbia River Basalts are much stronger the the sediments of the Colorado Plateau. Quote
Lambone Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 Zenyatta Mondatta? werd...I didn't know that about the screamers, interesting. Quote
fern Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 are carabiners cast? I was under the impression that they were forged, stamped, extruded, bent etc into shape? What do you mean by 'suffer a blow' ? Quote
COL._Von_Spanker Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 quote: Originally posted by fern: are carabiners cast? I was under the impression that they were forged, stamped, extruded, bent etc into shape? What do you mean by 'suffer a blow' ? Drop a rock on one, drop the bean, close it in the hatch of yer subaru legacy and I reckon it has suffered a blow. Quote
fern Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 I'd like crazyjz to define what HE meant. Thanks though COL. Quote
AlpineK Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 quote: Originally posted by fern: I'd like crazyjz to define what HE meant. Thanks though COL. Well you'll just have to wait since he just left the library where he goes to do his online stuff. Quote
JayB Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 You can find an MIT grad student's investigation of carabiner failure here: http://www.mit.edu/afs/athena/course/16/16.62x/www/Graham_Jon_622.pdf For info on rope/knot/cord failure check out this site: http://www.xmission.com/~tmoyer/testing/ More info on 3-Sigma Testing: http://www.bdel.com/bd/quality_3sig.html Some info for heavy climbers: http://www.safeclimbing.org/Heavy_Climbers_Beware.pdf Great general tech weenie site for climbers: http://www.fishproducts.com/tech/techweenie.html Petzl Fall Force Simulator: http://www.petzl.com/statique/sport/ENG/tech/html/simul/FC/index.html Good info on shockloading: http://www.petzl.com/statique/sport/ENG/tech/html/shockload.html Other techy type links about gear/climbing out there? Quote
Alex Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 nice info God its hard to believe a #1 head's wire is supposed to hold almost 500 pounds! Guess I should stop sketchin' on bomber nuts when aiding huh? Quote
lizard_brain Posted October 4, 2002 Posted October 4, 2002 quote: Originally posted by JayB: Other techy type links about gear/climbing out there? Just this... Tom Moyer's Rope and Gear Testing Quote
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