tomtom Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 Email to Arc'teryx (bird@arcteryx.com): ******************** Hi. I just purchased a Medium Sirrus SL jacket (Sangria) from a local retailer. I was looking for a lightweight hardshell for backcountry use, and this seemed to fit the bill. When I got the jacket home, however, I was disappointed to find out that the jacket weighs 12.4 oz (after removing hang tags, etc) on my digital postal scale. The hang tag on the garment advertises a weight of 10.8 oz. This excess 15% seems a bit excessive. This is my first Arc'teryx garment, and I purchased it based upon your reputation for quality and integrity especially considering the a $300 list price. I'd like to exchange this jacket for an example that does weigh 10.8 oz. Thanks. - Tom ******************** Email reply from Arc'teryx: ******************** Thank you for your interest in Arc'teryx. On our web site the advertised weight of the garment is 352 grams which converts to 12.41631oz. In reviewing why there was a discrepancy in the weight between that hang tag and all other written material on the product I found out there was a number of initial changes with the fabric and corresponding weights. In other words when the original design sample was weighed (presumably without the toggles and draw cords) it was weighed using a fabric which ended up not making it to production. I can only speculate that this mistake occurred in the rush of getting product made, hang tags produced, fabrics reaching production standards etc. this mistake has long since been corrected (we haven’t used those hang tags for at approximately a year). Unfortunately there are no final production garments made at the weight specified on that hang tag. If you are not satisfied with the garment I would suggest returning it to the retailer who sold it to you and finding something which meets your expectations. The retailer will be able to contact us and work something out. I’m sorry for this confusion and mis information. - (name deleted) ********************** Quote
cracked Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 Poor baby. Those extra 1.6 ounces are gonna kill you. Suck it up. Quote
cj001f Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 Good good you weight weenies are funny. Arc'teryx should have asked "How recently was your scale calibrated? Triple Beam Balance? Relative Gravitation?" As has been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere, there are very few manufacturers whose advertised weights match their actual weights - usually for the exact reasons given. Quote
Crackbolter Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 Why does two ounces matter and why is it so much fun to call them on thier error? Of course it will not weigh as much as they advertise! They never do!!! Bored climbers waste my time. Just go pee and you will save as much as 8 ounces in weight every time! Go number two and you can save even more! Quote
cracked Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 Ya know, you should exchange it for XXS, that one will probably weight LESS than 10.8 ounces. Quote
Bronco Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 It is frusterating when you consider the weight of an item durring your shopping and find out that it's not accurate after the purchase. It's like finding out at the check stand that it's actually ten dollars more than the price indicated on the tag because, well, it's last year's tag. It is my experience that Arcteryx is the worst offender with their advertised weights. Why put it on there if it's not accurate? It's a sales ploy. That's what you get for buying stuff from a communist country. Quote
fenderfour Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 So none of you think that it's funny to call them on their known bullshit? Quote
cracked Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 No manufacturer reports reliable weights in my experience. It it matters that much to you, take your damn scale to the store. And some variance between samples is unavoidable. Maybe Arc'teryx reports the weight of their jackets size small, and tomtom bought an XL. So instead of bitching at the company, figure out a way to get reliable weights (eg do it yourself) it it really matters so damn much. Wanting to return a jacket for one that weighs 1.6 ounces less is one of the most ridiculous things I've heard. Quote
fenderfour Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 I could be wrong, but I think that "ridiculous" is what tomtom was going for. I don't really think he intended to exchange it, just to make the manufacturer aware that people were paying attention. switch to decaf? Quote
cj001f Posted June 9, 2004 Posted June 9, 2004 I could be wrong, but I think that "ridiculous" is what tomtom was going for. I don't really think he intended to exchange it, just to make the manufacturer aware that people were paying attention. switch to decaf? It's called process variance. Unless you show me (or Arc'teryx) that the average weight of their product (sample of say 100?) is greater than they claim, they ain't going to care. Quote
tomtom Posted June 10, 2004 Author Posted June 10, 2004 Maybe Arc'teryx reports the weight of their jackets size small, and tomtom bought an XL. So instead of bitching at the company, figure out a way to get reliable weights (eg do it yourself) it it really matters so damn much. Wanting to return a jacket for one that weighs 1.6 ounces less is one of the most ridiculous things I've heard. The advertised weight in the hangtag was for a medium jacket, and I bought a medium jacket. The 1.6 oz represents a 15% increase over the advertised weight. The jacket is advertised by Arc'teryx as a lightweight jacket, so total weight of the garment is important. The ultra-light Sirrus shaves it off, leaving only the essentials. A featherweight package with waterproof protection. Should I wonder about the waterproof claim as well? Quote
tomtom Posted June 10, 2004 Author Posted June 10, 2004 It's called process variance. Unless you show me (or Arc'teryx) that the average weight of their product (sample of say 100?) is greater than they claim, they ain't going to care. Read their reply. It's not product variance. They acknowledge that the target weight is 12.4 oz. But their advertised weight was 10.8 oz. Quote
tomtom Posted June 10, 2004 Author Posted June 10, 2004 What if BD's famed 10% additional expansion range was just marketing hype? They are heavier and more expensive. I guess that's their appeal? Quote
Mark_Husbands Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 solution: manufacturers should use confidence intervals... 10.8 ounces +/- 5% Quote
fenderfour Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 Ok, I was wrong. tomtom was serious. Just an FYI to the rest of you, adding a K&N airfilter will not add 20 horsepower to your 1986 Westfalia camper. Ok? Quote
cj001f Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 solution: manufacturers should use confidence intervals... 10.8 ounces +/- 5% I would be fine with this. As was evidenced in the Florida election debacle, the general population cannot grasp this concept. Quote
Rainier_Wolfscastle Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 Almost all the outdoor clothing I have bought has weighed more than advertised. My Cloudveil Enclosure Parka was the biggest offender: MFR weight: 23 oz. postal scale: 36 oz. I expected a few extra ounces, but that difference was unacceptable. I returned the jacket. Quote
tomtom Posted June 10, 2004 Author Posted June 10, 2004 Some companies do this. From GoLite: "PLEASE NOTE: Due to variations in materials, all GoLite products may vary up to +/- 10% from the published weights. GoLite goes above and beyond industry norms to work with its factories to produce the lightest gear possible and then to publish product weights that are as accurate as possible. The precise amounts of materials that go into GoLite equipment and apparel during the manufacturing process, however, can and do vary to a limited but unavoidable degree." Quote
cracked Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 Golite has been reasonably accurate in their reported weights. Still, I'm not going to call them up and bitch about an extra 1.6 ounces, that's just ridiculous. Quote
Dru Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 this thread more super-anal-gear-freak bantering please! i want someone to discover their 20cm quickdraw is only 19.5 cm long!! Quote
olyclimber Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 Hell ya! I'm busting out the postage scale for everthing I buy from now on! Those muthas gotta another thing cuming if they think they're gonna weigh me down! I'm ExtremoUltraLightDude! Quote
Mark_Husbands Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 i want someone to discover their 20cm quickdraw is only 19.5 cm long!! That's within one standard deviation dude! relax. Quote
CascadeClimber Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 i want someone to discover their 20cm quickdraw is only 19.5 cm long!! I have one of those new Mammut slings that is about 5cm shorter than the others (double length). Quote
RichardKorry Posted June 10, 2004 Posted June 10, 2004 I took all the wood back to Home Depot because my 2X4 was 1.75X3.75. Can you believe it? Seriously, it is a bitch to consider weight in your purchase and then have the advertised weight be way off. Cloudveil seems to have a problem with this. Kudos to Arc'teryx to admit to the problem, determine the cause, verify that it still isn't a problem, and offer help in getting you what you want (e.g. your money back). They could have given you corporate speak of "screwed ya!". Quote
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