Doctorb Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 What's the best sized/most functional bolt kit setup for alpine climbs? How many hangers, what size drill? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 The Petzl hand drill is supposidly the lightest. But they have the tendency to break...read that story about "The Flame" in Pakistan. I have the Hurricane for aid routes. Pretty bomber, works good....kind of heavy, but what isn't. Bring 1/4" for lead and 3/8" for belays. Just depends on how much time you are willing to spend drilling. Then again my buddy in Montana just carries his Bulldog into the Alpine. But he is burly like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off_White Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 Okay, being somewhat familiar with the character that started this thread, I'm pretty sure it's just a troll, but that original intention has been trumped by a couple of serious replies, so we'll all take this as a serious question and be polite about it, rather than lose the information in the sea of chaff that is Spray. I'll reiterate to make it clear for all: Don't Spray In This Thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crackbolter Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 Kit bag would contain: Metolious hangers 5/16" buttonheads spare Hilte bit spare allen key hook for resting while drilling on lead hand drill Hilte drill bit Question: A Chounard alpine hammer with an ash handle and alpine pick or Estwing rock tool seems to be the best setup for bolting efficiently on lead. What do other folks use who are experienced in this type of craft? I am looking for something lighter but just as sturdy for easy swinging. Second tools are good for pitons but lack the beef for drilling quickly. Just curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catbirdseat Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 Here's a related question. What would you carry as an emergency bolt kit for bailing off of routes, for example at Darrington? I would assume it would consist of quarter inch gear only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 I would never and have never carried a bolt kit at D town. I might carry one if I was doing a FA. I've virtually never carried a bolt kit in the alpine either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted January 6, 2004 Share Posted January 6, 2004 OK since this is a serious thread now: a bolt kit is dead weight in the alpine. You might as well leave it at home or just take it when you go cragging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billygoat Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 Here's a related question. What would you carry as an emergency bolt kit for bailing off of routes, for example at Darrington? I would assume it would consist of quarter inch gear only. Pins and slings (dark coloured, thank you) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 Catbird - Like Mr. K, I have almost never felt the need to carry an emergency bolt kit for alpine climbing or subalpine climbing at a place like DTown. However, even when retreating from a failed climb or during bad weather I generally avoid rappelling down big steep walls if I have much doubt about whether there will be anchors available. 99% of the time, you probably don't need the emergency bolt kit and certainly not on most established climbs. Yes, you may leave some gear behind some time but, you know what? I almost never have and I certainly have not had to do so often enough to justify carrying an emergency bolt kit on anything like a regular basis. If you are putting up new routes, there may be more reason for it but even still maybe not -- I have put up some fairly large routes on previously unexplored rock without one. The kits described above would not be bad choices, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 It really all depends on what kind of Alpine terrain you are talking about. The route in the high country of Mt that my buddy put up with a power drill has several 5.12 pitches out of a total of 10 or 11. Lots of linking small features with hard face climbing. For this route a good drill was 100% essential. If I was going to...lets say try to FA some big rock route in the Ruth Gorge or Baffin or something, I'd sure as hell have a drill. Not that I'm planning that anytime soon... For some ridge romp...of course it is rediculous to cary a hand drill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlpineK Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 You have a point Lambbeotch, but it kind of gets lost in your bragging about how bad ass you and your buddy are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dru Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 if you are going to bolt in the alpine you already know what to use if not --- see deleted pictures of bolting equipment or see here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambone Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 ...but it kind of gets lost in your bragging about how bad ass you and your buddy are. I'm not badass..I humped a load, jugged a line and watched some cool climbing...but my buddy is...and I can brag about him if I wan't, cause I wish I was that cool. But dru's got it right, if you need to ask you probly shouldn't be carrying a bolt kit. The "how many hangers" line pretty much gave away the troll... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crotch Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Kit bag would contain: 5/16" buttonheads The Fixe 5/16" buttonheads are supposed to be made of metal so soft as to be worthless. The old Rawl ones should be fine though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crackbolter Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 I disagree that buttonheads are worthless. If you climb a route and need to pass a bolt that I have placed or clip it for a belay, I think you would trust that it will hold a fall. The interior width of a 5/16" rawl is only 1/4" I believe. I'd rather not take a shear fall on a 1/4" shaft that could have been stressed while twisting a nut around it to tighten it. I have seen the nut shear the shaft without much effort at all in a controlled situation. (meaning at home in a vise rather than in the mtns) If a 5/16" buttonhead is placed wrong and the head bends before it mushrooms over the hanger, they are less reliable than if it is hammered straight in. I think skill is what makes them bomber, not the nature of the material. I will continue to use 5/16" buttonheads until they are not available. They are in fact, bomber and I trust every one that I have placed. I also apologize in advance if it sounds like I am chestbeating. I am only stating my opinion based on my own personal experiences. I don't think that everyone should follow my lead when it comes to equipment selection since it is simply a matter of style and opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomtom Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 I have seen the nut shear the shaft without much effort at all in a controlled situation. (meaning at home in a vise rather than in the mtns) Lubricate the threads if you're worried about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crackbolter Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 The threads are not a concern, it is when the nut is being tightened to the expansion sleeve. It is mainly a concern of overtightening the nut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattp Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 tomtom - I think he is talking about the fact that you can very easily break off a bolt when you over-tighten the nut and it takes surprisingly little force. I don't think lubrication will help prevent this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 (edited) The Fixe 5/16" are really 8mm. I haven't calculated the difference but that may be an issue -esp. if you have resharpened your bit several times. Also , the claim that if you have to ask you shouldn't is bogus. I learned that Petzl drill holders suck from reading this very thread. I was thinking of buying one since bits are hard to get for the old style holders. Now I won't. PP Edited January 8, 2004 by Peter_Puget Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinker Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 5/16" = 7.9375 mm difference from 8mm = .0625 mm = .00246" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter_Puget Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Seems pretty minor. I wonder what their true dimensions are as they appear quite different upon visual inspection. I gave a ton of the old rawl 5/16" away to friend going on a trip and a coupel years ago bought 50 of the Fixe bolts. Haven't used them because of their rep. I have five old 5/16 left and 10 5.10 5/16 bits. Any offers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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