Rodchester

Will: Commercial non-guided climbs, or even adding non-guided commecial climbers onto a permit is standard in the industry and always has been. This is mostly in Asia, other areas don't have the same permit issues. I don't see any problem at all toward commercial non-guided climbs or climbers on a permit. I am familar with how it works. Further, ading a guide that just wants to climb a peak is fine, but on many peaks the permit is based on the number of people. Add a guide, cost go up. Now, if the owner is using what would be his profits to cover the increased permit cost allow a guide to climb, so what? That's just dumb business. How does that make guiding under the rules a scam? It doesn't. If someone breaks off of a permited climb and climbs another peak, well, that is breaking the rules. They don't have a pemit for that peak. How does that make guiding under the rules a scam? It doesn't. Doolittle seems pretty clear that all guiding is a scam. I disagree.

EriK: I can understand some concerns that many have. And to a certain degree, I agree. I also know that many here are troubled by guiding in certain areas: i.e. 8000 meter peaks. Again, I don't totally disagree and realize that many concerns are valid. But Doolittle's rant is not realistic. The permit issue he raises is a BS misconception of how guiding and permitting works.

So one wannabe gloms onto another wannabe? Sounds like you're saying that the guide is a wannabe just like the client? Who is getting scammed, the client? And please explain how an owner can take a run up another peak using the permit for the client's peak? Permits in most countries are for a particular peak. How does having a client(s) pay for the permit as a part of the cost of a climb for the client's peak allow the owner to climb another peak without a permit for the other peak? Do you have personal experience with this occuring? Where? What company? And who is supposed to pay for the permit anyway? Isn't that a business cost? Hmmm....$250 a day....hmmmm. I wonder what the $250 a day is paying for...hmmm. Man, this guiding business must be a scam, making a lot of people rich. Just curious about the scam.

In Utah, weeks are like marriages...there is more days in the week and more wives in their marriages.

Are you saying all guides are wannabes?

I wouldn't say they are dumb, but I'd say that autolockers can let one get lazy and assume becuase you heard a metalic click/sound that the biner locked. In an alpine environment or multi-pitch setting one often has a lot of gear on, and the biner gate may be making that metalic sound as it hits something else made of metal, say another biner, a cam, a nut, etc. With a classic screw locker, you know you have to lock it...not just check it. I stick with screw lockers to force me to not get lazy and assume that it locked. Just my opinion/preference.

Glacier: I remember that well. Your friend is a good guy and was well liked despite ultimate differences. I think he is much better off where he is now, as far as work goes it has more room for a strong willed guy like him to make animpact on his work and those around him.

Hmmmm...I thought you said: Hmmmmm....

Leading WI1 in full goretex while your partner video tapes you is not up to my standards. And jugging fixed lines that a shepra or another climber placed the day before is not climbing, it's jugging fixed lines. Let me know when she actually climbs an 8000m peak, instead of jugging fixed lines set by sherpas or other climbers to the summit of an 8000m peak. You're really up to speed on her and her climbing experience and abilities aren't you? She Did Shisapangma "alpine style" (to the true summit) with no porters past basecamp, no fixed lines, no moving camps in something like a few days. I can't recall exactly. It was just her and Fowler. I know she herself fixed lines on GII and K2. Dude, you are so funny. You don't know shit about her. Why do you make such simple-Simon-assumptions about someone you don't know. Maybe she was doing an instructional video for children? Who knows? CB does a LOT of work with kids and schools. She is regularly involved with helping "Room To Read" raise money for children in Nepal so that they can go to school and learn. She does promos for them. Sorry this isn't up to YOUR standards. Maybe it was a promo for M2? Get over it. Anyway...I've known Christine fairly well for 8 years. She has always been shy around the camera. Many around her push her into the spotlight and she is smart enough to realize that it can help her climbing and others, so she does it but I does so reluctantly. Its not her thing. Many climbers are like this, and that’s cool. Just because a climber is well known or is featured in R&I or something doesn't mean they are a poser. DRU: Come on bro, you know she's not my girlfriend. Just kidding.

I would consider doing other things besides Rainier. If you like the volcanos look into Baker and Glacier. Also try Shukshan. Too many great peaks in the PNW to spend 8 days on Rainier with 1000 others.

Oh, I agree that we shouldn't have to pay...and that the guide companies should. I do agree with that.

Why don't you drop Moonstone a line at: Moonstone Mountain Equipment 1700 Westlake Ave N, Ste. 200 Seattle, Washington 98109 Toll Free: 800.390.3312 email: info@moonstone.com

STeepC: Those Corps are paying a pretty penney to guide and use the land. You'd be surprised how much guide servcies pay for the users days.

What's the difference? The funds were there, but congress choose to not allocate the funds for management because it saw that suckers like you would let them not do their jobs and would pay at the gate so to speak. That has to be the weakest argument I've ever heard. A shortfall in funds provided, but not in funds? Too funny.

I have the old style neon Koflachs. I am very happy with them and have had them since they were new. They are warm, but the warmth is in VERY large part dictated by the type and condition of the liner. (that's likely obvious to you). The older Koflachs (Neon ones), sometimes had a foam liner that was VERY warm but it crushed down fairly quickly. As far as ice climbing goes it is fine, but not exactly comparable with the newer insulated leathers. It is like most plastics, a sloppy boot. Fine for winter stuff, mountaineering on the volcanoes, etc. Shell holds up very well to the cold and is somewhat flexible for French stepping.

Carlos Buhler and Mark Price did a line very close to the Simpson Yates route in 1999 (I think it was 99). I spoke with both of them in Huarez right after they did the route and have since duscussed it with Carlos on a couple of occasions. He was, and is, impressed/amazed by the effort Joe undertook to get his as out of there. He said the terrain was very rough. he said the route they did was challegning and if I recall correctly difficult to protect.

Traditional, or trad climbing, is the use of traditional (trad) gear to protect in the event of a fall. In trad climbing one may also use natural protection as gear by slinging trees, chockstones, etc. However, very rarely does one rely solely on natural gear. There is nothing natural about a cam, a nut, or a hex, or etc. Why are you using the term natural?

The droop of the pick and the teeth are often indicators of the age of the axe. Also the length can INDICATE age as well. Back in the 1920s and 1930s almost all axes were long, damn long. Can you post a picture?

But the Fee Demo program was done when there was a surplus? Surplus. So what shortfall were they dealing with? Hmmmm.....

Chuck: Are you serious? Spain has been active in fighting terrorism WAY before the US bothered. The recent activity has been going on since Franco took over after the Spanish Civil War in the 1930s. The Basques have been very active, more so at times and less so at other times, in terrorism. Recall that Franco's right hand man was killed in a terrorist bombing. He had been hand picked by Franco to replace Franco and was he a real bastard. (I can't remember his name). After he was murdered, Franco relented more or less setting up the return of the Monarchy (Juan Carlos), who eventually turned the government back over to the people. ETA has previously worked with terrorist organizations from outside of Spain (but has kept thier own activities pretty close to Spain and the Basque area in France). This includes the PLO and the IRA. In fact, many NSPS types and intel wonks believe that the IRA trained and supplied ETA to kill Franco’s handpicked successor. It was done almost identically (method and means) to the killing of Lord Montbatten. Spain has been suffering from this for years and has always asked for help.

I disagree with you Mark. Respectfully, yes. We have been paying taxes and funding the FOREST SERVICE through the general fund and the Dept. of Agriculture for years and years and years. The idea has always been to make the Forest Service land open and available for recreation. This is a great idea. However, we are still paying taxes, but now its not free. If there is a shortfall in funding it is up to the legislature to gather taxes. (Recall that when this was set up, the fee demo, we had a surplus, that's right a surplus ). Agreeing with user fees for what has historically been funded by the general fund provides a pass to politicians, right, left, and middle to not do their jobs. Again, we still pay taxes, the politicians have just used the same money that would support the FS and put it toward PORK, because the “users” will pay. In effect the “users” are be taxed double. This is BAD. Further, and just as bad, is that it is slowly creeping up to the point where “public lands” (parks are another issue) are becoming for those that can afford the fees. This is beginning to leave out a good portion of the public and is only getting worse. We still pay taxes and now they want user fees also. This is not like a “sin tax.” This is historically non-fee public land with a long history of public use for recreation. Paying to get into, and use, the Parks is different. You are paying for the facilities. The Parks are financed differently through the Dept. of Interior. This has been the long standing tradition. If you can’t afford the parks you can go to the Forests. Oh, no you can’t, not anymore. And what are we getting for our money anyway? A trailhead that already existed? Bullshit. A new Crapper? Bullshit. Sure the funds are going toward the maintenance and upkeep of these, but the FS has always done this. . .through general fund tax revenue flowing through the Dept of Agriculture. . ..not through user fees. The Forests need to stay forests, open free to the public. The politicians need to do their jobs. Your position lets the politicians off the hook and double taxes me and other users.

After living in Ouray, Levenworth will weem cosmopolitan, a pretty scary thought. Actually L-worth is a really good idea. Close to Seattle, yet right in the heart of good crag climbing and the entrance to some GREAT alpine trad and mountaineering, and close to the volcanoes for mountaineering. I could think of a lot worse places. For a few months to a year, L-Worth would rock. How about spring skiing? When do the local areas shut down? Stevens?

Of course, gear/protection needs will vary with each route. That said, here is a rough OUTLINE for a basic alpine rack: ONE SET OF NUTS: There are many brands out there. I know some hear will disagree with me, but FOR THE MOST PART, nuts are nuts. On most climbs that you are looking at, a set of standard nuts should do you fine. I think if you buy them as a set you’ll get 20% off if you use you dividend before April 1, 2004. . . I think. The smaller sizes are mostly aid pieces, so don't worry about picking them up. HEXES: I have and will carry (when a large piece is needed) the large sized Hexes. I have the four largest BDs. The two largest are lightweight and work great when you need one or two large pieces to protect a move or two, but you don’t want to carry (or pay for large cams). CAMS: Throw in about four mid-sized cams and maybe two smaller cams, and you’re set on protection. (For the most part). DRAWS: About six 24 inch runners (get the Mammut Dyneema slings, they are strong and light ) and two biners per sling to make six good alpine draws. Pick up the Trango lightweight wire gate biners at Second Ascent, or some other lightweight biner (Omego JC Wiregate, BD Neutrino). Then get two long, 48 inch, runners, an handful of extra biners, and a few decent lockers. ROPES: I like the smaller diameter single ropes, like a 9.8 mm x 60 meter dry rope. If you need a rope, using your dividend and the 20 % discount may be the way to go. Of course, gear/protection needs will vary with each route and your ability/comfort level. On some routes you may just carry the nuts and a couple of draws, on some you’ll carry everything. Many here will say that this a big rack for what you’re doing. But if you are just learning to lead, having the gear to “stitch up” tricky sections with a lot of protection is good. Also, throw in some "leaver" 1 inch webbing and a couple of rap rings.

She's hotter than a half-fucked fox in a forest fire.