selkirk

Even if a draft is applied equally, strings will be pulled regarding where/in what capacity draftees are assigned. Not everyone serves a combat role on the front line. But then it's not being applied equally. Not everyone needs to be on the front line, but no one should be in the rear just because daddy knows a general.

But again, how evenly was the draft applied? It may have been random in concept, but it seems that political strings can get pulled, and were back to the loss of life being a somewhat abstract concept for those making the decisions, instead of the loss of life possibly including their sons and daughters.

First off, I may have mistated myself. I don't necessarily think the Liberal bias in education makes itself overly strongly felt. Most of the instructors/TA's etc that i've dealt with do a good job seperating their own beliefs out from the subject matter, and teach the subject of the class pretty cleanly. I am however in engineering so there isn't all that much controversy. What I have seen is not so much liberal bias affecting most courses, as have met very few (none in higher ed) highly conserative people who teach at any level. Trying to sum up the basic positions real quick. KK: Liberal Bias exists because in order to academically succed one must kowtow to the profs and either actually hold or at least espouse their own liberal bias. Does that sound right? Dberdinka, Jiggler, Foraker: Liberal bias is there as to be successfull in education you can't be close minded or too dogmatic since you must continually analyze opposing viewpoints and analyze the support for your own beliefs. ChucK: Liberal bias is an artifact of conserative individuals having a different set of priorities (i.e. $$$) Jim: Have you stopped beating your wife yet? And KK, please, of course there are liberal ego-maniacs in each and every field , though I tend to see this more in people who are primarily researchers then those who are primarily teachers. I've met a number who seem to view teaching as penance that they have to do in order to be allowed to research at a major Univ. However there are also an awful lot of good people who are very focused on education and learning and aren't their for their own prestige or advancement. And yes there are dogmatic extremist wacko's on both end of the spectrum. As for a more well rounded education? Why would the left wing not support that? I have to agree completely, and i'm certainly a liberal though I doubt i'd qualify as left wing. We've shifted too far from the original intent of a university education, from a broad, general education that teaches one how to think clearly about any topic with some specialization in one field, to an advanced technical degree, where the only issues you are ever confronted with come from one very narrow field (extremely true in engineering). My own impression is along the line of ChucK's. I've met very few conservative people who are interested in teaching others. Many tend to be of the "Those who can do. Those who can't teach." mindset, and primarily define success in a career/monetary sense. While the more liberal people I know tend to define their success/quality of life based around the relationships and/or the positive outcome of the work they do. It's my opinion that the people who go into education to teach, do so because they feel that teaching the next generation of students is the most valuable thing anyone can do, and the best way to insure that our societies and ideas don't dissappear. (Those who go into academia primarly to research are often of a very different breed though.) On a sidebar, i'd even be willing to venture that there is a spectrum of the level of liberality from lower education through higher. The more complex and involved the concepts are, and the higher the amount of education necessary to teach those concepts, the more liberal (in general) the average person who ends up teaching at that level. (So I bet the Elementary and Middle school teachers, are on the whole, somewhat less liberal than high school teachers, who are somewhat less liberal the Community College Instructors, who are somewhat less liberal than major Univ. instructors. (again, thos who are primarily focused on research are somewhat excepted.)

Ok, I think most people are willing to readily accept that there is a liberal bias in education (k-12, and collegiate) as well as in the science community. So my question for everyone is why? Is it something that self selects? Liberal establishment chooses to promote/advance liberal causes, which are pursued by each new generation of liberal researchers/teachers/proffessors who then become the liberal establishment? Or is it something more fundamental? On a related note, why does education seem to correlate progressive/liberal beliefs? What are everyone's thoughts?

Ok, so lets assume there is a bias in science and it does tend to produce left leaning results. (Global warming is man caused, burning grass fields leads to increase asthma levels, were going to run out of oil in the near future, etc etc.) How should we approach that error? Is it better to completely write off the results do what ever we want and deal with the consequences later? Personally i'm in favor of erring on the side of conservation. If were wrong, nothing happens, the trends continue, and we have a few more resources later on (trees, oil, coal, etc.) and what suffers in the short term are a few companies pocketbooks. Employment levels drop for major polluters as they spend money on upgrades and employment rises as regulation and remediation technology producers to help clean up the "dirty industries". Net effect, temporary economic slowdown, possible minor depression, unpleasant in the short term but no major long term effects. In the long run, we can always cut down the trees, burn the coal, drive off the oil, 10 years from now as easily as we can now. If the scientists are right? Were ourselves over right now and in 50 years, we'll be seeing significant temperature changes, more droughts, more dangerous heat waves, more species dissapearing faster, permanently lost forests and biodiversity etc. We may not be screwed but our children might very well be. So..... which is it to be? Err on the side of caution, and at worst temporary discomfort? Or Err on the side of potentially screwing ourselves over? hmmmmmm, tough choice and yes, I'm a highly biased scientist. What can I say, I want to graduate Bias does exist, and does take a while to correct itself. But as it's been stated before.... the scientific process eventually sets itself straight, it might take a few years, or a generation. But nothing garners scientific prestige and recognition faster than good reproducible data that refutes the current level of understanding. Names and careers are never made confirming current understanding, but by rocking the boat a little and producing new understaning.

I didn't sit on my ass and watch TV at home. How could you all be inside? Leavenworth and Vantage were in! Though Vantage was a bit crowded :-(

The tri-nuts are actually a different design. the cross section looks like a triangle with all the points cut off, so you actually get three different widths out of it instead of the traditional 2 you get of most nuts. Though you sacrifice a little rock contact area on the cut-off-triangle point side.

Has anyone used the new Omega Pacific Tri-nuts? Or fondled the new DMM wallnuts? Those are inspiring wicked thoughts just looking at them.

Has anyone else heard the scuttlebut that it might starting taking a passport to get back in from Canada/Mexico? (as opposed to a Birth Certificate?)

Is that the day Layton finally gets some?

How could you have neglected to post the poem Squiddy!!! The Mark Johnstone Version of "Twas the Night Before Christmas" "Twas the week before Christmas, and boy was it neat. We had been on vacation, and my wife was in heat. The doors were all bolted, the phone off the hook, It was time for some nooky, by hook or by crook. Momma in her teddy and I in the nude, Had just hit the bedroom and reached for the lube. When out from my privates there arose such a cry, That I lost my boner and thought I would die. Up to the window I sprang like a very big flea, The pain was so bad it stung like a bee. I ran down the hall past the 'putter I'd built, And looked in a mirror, clean up to the hilt. When what to my wondering eyes should appear, But an airhole in my scrotum - I said to her....Dear. With two holes now seen, half out of my sock, It's time for a phone call, right now to a Doc. The first one I called, said I'd just lost my mind. So I paid him his worth ... it was only a dime. The next one I called said it was just a small mite Sure as I'm speaking, he was high as a kite All I had left was to lay there in pain A cry in the night with nothing to gain Then down the chimney came a big red guy St. Nick I told him, it must be a fly. He was chubby and plump, a right jolly old prick, And I laughed when I saw him, in spite of my dick. A wink of his eye and a twist of his head Soon gave me to know I had more problems to dread Whoa Shithead he said - you are such a Putz, Stop whining right now or I'll cut off your nuts. A phone number he gave and a big bag of ice He said call this Doc and he will be nice He sprang up the chimney, to his team gave a whistle And away they all flew like the down of a thistle. But I heard him exclaim boy "Don't bitch or don't pout" "Merry Christmas to all and be glad they are all out!"

no, not particularly. But what's so special about 62 million years?

Last thing I heard was it was one of the poor guys first trad leads. He was several pieces up and pitched (I think it was on the route just right of Nimrod's Nemesis? (The big roof on the climbers left at Royal Columns, which goes 5.5 I think)). From word of mouth it wasn't a spectacularly bad fallm just more than bad enough. Probably 10 or 12 ft, no ground fall, and his pro held. But he must have caught his foot on something during the fall. Sounds like a combination of newness to leading and bad luck while falling. A good reminder that even if you don't hit the ground you can hurt yourself.

eeeewwwwwww !!!!! I thought this was going to be a discussion about chicks

He's obviously too turned on to think straight.

What are you hoping to see with more details than your roof or car?

Yes, but since the atmosphere is thinner near the poles than they sky will squish Canuckistan first!!

or should that be sheepskin merkins?

Where's Snowbyrd been? Isn't she a red-head?

Bone Daddies, Jem (surprisingly good!), a little Blues Traveller, Susan Tedeschi (Damn she's good!!) Kenny Wayne Sheppard....

I felt like such a stud after climbing Karate last year (had to take 1 rest, 2/3 of the way up.) Then I got back to Seattle, and was talking to climber friend of mine who did quite a while back on hexes and nuts. There went my buzz!

A nice warm day out at Vantage. Thrashed my way up Tangled up in Blue, boy was I ugly on that! . repeat to self, must never climb strenous route without warming up. Then hit a bunch of plesent routes down on Millenium wall, though I don't know the names. Was just very nice to get out!

At the end someone gets to a make a decision about what is in someone's best interests when that person can't decided for themselves. The courts have always held up that it should be the spouse. Are you saying that with all the dysfunctional screwed up familys in this country parents are necessarily more qualified? As well put by my sister the nearly a dr. "Parents will never stop parenting." They will always want to do what THEY think is best for her, not necessarily what she would want for herself. I think the spouse who you've been living with day in day out for the last however many years has a better idea of your wishes than parents whom you see a few times a year, and will always think of you as their little baby. (Your wife excluded Dr. Crash ) If he had a history of being an a mentally or emotionally abusive asshole, I imagine they would have transfered guardianship a long time ago. Is there anyone present here, who would rather have been kept alive in that state then had the plug pulled? If so speak up cause everyone i've talked to has said pull the damn thing, with the intent that they dont' want to exist like that and wouldn't want to keep their friends and family from grieving and moving on. Now she'll always be remembered and thought of as quasi-vegetable instead of the beautiful person she was before.

Absolutely, no climbing on grid bolts! And if you want to climb a crack at least don't clip the bolts next to it. Well, maybe that obscenity the Caldwell trad led on monkey face last year . I'd clip those bolts instead of placing micronuts. Of course I can't climb 5.obscene so it's a moo point.

Spray? Stay on topic! You must need more coffee Minx! Your clearly delusional That said..... How do I decide what route to climb? as i'm still a relative gumby finding my feet I typically look for route reviews in guides, recommendations from friends, and or sweet lines when they strike me (Karate Crack last year, Zebra-Zion right now we really do need a tongue hanging out drooling gremlin!). Then try and spread it around, hard bolts, less hard trad, thin slabs, steep face, sweet cracks (still my favorite). Alpine/Adventure or crag/tame totally varies from week to week. Much to dependant on other factors. Right now I don't have time to be in great shape so alpine is out and cragging is in. Is there anyone here but Poop who's so obscessed with the no bolt/adventure climb ethic that they only climb and enjoy/appreciate remote sketcy alpine trad? (Within reason of course, grid bolting, and bolting cracks is just wrong! All climbing should be done with minimum impact feasible for that line the FA chooses.)