needtoclimb

This is a long shot, but worth a try. My buddy and I climbed at classic crack, and the next day up at Givlers dome. This was about the second weekend of october, and we used my buddy's rack. He hasn't climbed since, and has noticed that he has 3 cams missing, a black, purple and blue newer metolious power cams. (I think those are the right colors.) This is a long shot, but anyone come across these cams in teh past few weeks? The only other place they would be is the pullout for Givlers, as they might have been dropped while sorting gear.

Any new updates/pics on the route itself? Thinking about trying it next week.

The "trail" as I remember is only about a quarter mile from the trail head, and goes up beside a creek, on the right. There isn't much a of trail, lots of bushwacking and a couple small cliffs to scramble up. You won't find anything that looks like a real trail until you reach the ridge.

Went up there today. Great job guys clearing the road. The road is easily drivable to 3 O'clock rock trailhead in a 4X4,and passable in a Honda Civic, only it would take a bit longer. The road to Green Giant Butress is not passable at all, and trees block the way right at the 3;oo trailhead. It was soaked today. Was hoping to find something dry to climb, but it was not to be. Too much water, but still fun hiking up.

Feeling a little paranoid? Perhaps the ranger is brand new to the outdoors, and trying to learn the ropes? Seriously, the permits are used mainly to determine how many people use various trails, and this helps relate to funding. Why spend as much time and money on a trail that sees 50 people a year, compared to one that sees 500?

I went last september and wore hiking shoes up. A little sturdier than tennis shoes, but half the weight of boots. Boots are not needed, unless you are going up early enough where you will encounter a lot of snow. I carried climbing shoes in my pack.

The top three are real guns, the bottom one is a toy gun. Glad you are such a gun expert that you can tell the difference between them in half a second.

I am game for anything. Hike up something, ski down. Or climb up something, hike down. Or ski up something, fall down. Give me a shout if you want to get out saturday. Kevin

Check your PM's.

Hmmm, riverdweller seems to directly contradict what you told us. So, were they or were they not parked directly on the road? You said your friend took pictures. Look close to see if they were off the road or not. That makes it real tough. If there was an emergency and all the cars are towed, then what? But if there was a head-on collision because the cars were taking up a lane, would this have become a 7 page forum? I'm not sure what middle ground action could have been taken. If the only way to clear the road was to tow them, then that was the appropriate action. I was under the belief that all the cars were parked on the shoulder, and that the road was clear both directions. The best course of action is always hindsight.

I found a good motivator to get me training this winter. It is a 10k or half marathon in May sponsored by The North Face. challenge.thenorthface.com Training and running this will get me in shape for the mountains come summer. Anyone live in the north end who want to get together regularly (a set time once or twice a week) to go for a run? I can make myself run several times a week, but I need a partner to help get me going a couple more times.

Wasn't meaning to jump on you like that Bill, was just having a bad day. However, you are mistaken. Having the tow truck driver give a kick back to the deputy is possible, but implausible. As much as the media likes to portray, there is very little law enforcement corruption on the west coast. LE out here is seen much more professional as say, Detroit or New Orleans. Several months ago the Seattle PI did a huge investigative report on officer corruption. What did they come up with? A couple of officers may (may have, wasn't proven that they did) have lied on a report. That is the extent of it. Most LE over here is not going to risk a $70k a year job for a measly kickback from a tow operator. Every meet a tow truck driver? Trust him to keep his mouth shut about something like this? No way. It just isn't plausible. The reasoning that you discounted, sheer stupidity or ego, is actually much more reasonable. Every get into an argument with some who is blatantly wrong, but refused to see your point? That is human nature. Or how about plain ol' ignorance? That is usually the case. The deputy doesn't understand the implications because he has never set foot on a trail. (Much like how the layman can say the cop is being dumb, having never seen it from the perspective of the cop.) This is what I meant to say the first time, but was a little frustrated and pressed for time. Hope this makes more sense. P.S. To have things looked into, you need to have a reason to look into it. Otherwise, it is just a fishing expedition.

What? You confuse me. Who was motivated by money? The $193 was a towing fee, most likely to a private tow company. The deputy does not get a dime, the sheriff department does not get a dime, and the county would make a pittance, if anything. No, it was not about money, not at all. It was for the reason the deputy gave, though I agree that it was a pretty weak arguement without much though involved. Unless, you think it was a vast conpsiracy with the tow company? Maybe the tow truck driver called into the county to set the whole thing up? OF course, that must be it.

So? It should still be my choice if I want to take that risk. It is not up to the cops to tell me when I'm not being "safe". So you just be allowed drive 90 mph down the freeway, play in traffic, or sleep on railroad tracks? When your dangerous actions affect other people (drivers or snow plows having to avoid you) then the government does step forward. Also, when the government can be sued for not stopping you, then they have the ability to enforce rules to stop you. Unfortunaly, we are such a litigous society that that the government has to make more and more rules to keep people from suing them and others. One more thing. Remember, congress, counties and cities make the laws. The cops are tasked with enforcing them. Its not just the fact that the cop has nothing to do and wants to go pick on you. Maybe sevral people called it in, forcing him to take action. Maybe a supversior or higher has made patrolling the corridor a priority. Many things go on beyond "the cops telling me what I can and can't do." Oh, and one last thing for thought. The 13 year old who just died in an avalanche. What if the road was blocked by people illegally parked there, and SAR could not get up there to look for her. Then we would have the whole community screaming "why aren't those roads patrolled! Why weren't those cars towed!" It's real tough to have it both ways.

Hmm, this changes things a little. The deputy was now ordered to take action by a supervisor. As long as it is a legal order (and this will easily fall under that category. Illegal orders are ones that are so obviously and wretchedly wrong that there is no doubt whatsoever. Orders may be dumb, or lack common sense, but that does not make them illegal,) then the deputy had to act. If he was told to tow the cars, he had to do it or risk disciplinary action. So now you have to move up the chain of command, and work on identifying the supervisor, not the deputy. He did nothing wrong. The supervisor needs to be told why this is a bad thing. I mention this because as a society we love to bash people, and want to see revenge even if we have the wrong person. And since shit always rolls down hill, it is the deputy who will get the blame, even though he was following a legal order. (yes, there is a huge double standard here. It sucks.) I like the idea of the SAR organizer talking to the Sheriff. That may work, as it is coming from a person of authority and knowledge, not just some hiker who parked on the road and now is mad about it. Not sure who runs Snohomish County SAR, but that would hopefully help get the point across. Am I correct in the idea that we simply want it made clear to Snohomish Sheriff Office that the cars should not have been towed because that would leave people stranded, possibly incurring life-threatening scenarios? Correct? If you go this route, a directive (written order that effects the whole department) might be written explaining why towing cars on mountain highways is a bad idea. If your plan is simply to go after someone's head, then it will affect just the one person, and not really fix the problem as everyone else will not know why this was a bad judgement. (Not to mention destroy moral among deputies for being punished simply for doing their job.)

This won't work. Prosecutors take cases from law enforcement, not from average citizen. If they did, think of how many calls they would get from people stating my neighbour is trespassing, my mom ate my doughnut, etc, etc. The prosecuting office will tell you to call the Sheriff. Close Mountainmandoug. What you do is contest the towing. This requires a little research and setting up a court date, then responding and stating why the tow was illegal. Problem here is that the tow was not illegal. A judge must follow the law, and can't reimburse you for something the county did legally. You may win if you argue there were no signs and you were safely off the road, but it is a toss up. I agree that the media is so often wrong that when I read the paper I can only believe half of what they say. Just read their articles about lost climbers and hikers, and see how bad their stories are. Anyway, calling a legislature might work, but you are going way too high over the deputies head, and it might never filter down to him. Start at one level above the deputy and work up. For the Sheriff to know why you are voting against him, you need to tell him. Thus, write that letter and call him. One more thought. Remember that cops are humans too, and sometimes they make stupid mistakes. If a cop makes a mistake, the public cries for his firing. Have any of you ever made a mistake? Did you have the public shouting for your firing? Probably not.

Ah yes, another cop-bashing thread by the ignorant. You know, yesterday I went out to eat, and the waiter was rude to me. So now I hate all waiters. This one deputy was making a very bad judgement call. Please direct anger towards him, not towards law enforcement in general. Being in law enforcement, I am going to give you real advice on what to do, not this "I saw it on TV" advice that so many people want to give. What he was doing was technically legal, but very bad judgement and common sense. At the scene his name should have been taken. (It will be on the tow paperwork if you got it.) You should have asked for his supervisor to respond to the scene and that you want to make a complaint at that time. Being that this is a day later, and you may or may not have his name: do this. Call the snohomish county sheriff office that patrols that area. Ask for a sergeant or lieutenant. Now here is the hard part; calmly, truthfully and respectfully explain what happened and why towing the cars was a bad idea. To stop anyone from responding stating "I pay their salary, I should be able to be rude and crass and they still listen to me," I will cut that off now. Being human, if you start lying (easy to spot) or being rude or use comments like "i pay your salary," You will simply make the supervisor you are talking to tune you out, thinking you are blowing things way out of proportion. By talking calmly and respectfully, you sound like a sane average citizen and will be listened to. After talking to a supervisor, write a letter and call the actual Sheriff's office. You won't speak to the Sheriff, but your communication will get to him. After that, call and write to the Snohomish Executive (the equivalent of Ron Sims.) All this will get the message across that towing the cars is not right. Yes, it is a lot of work, but bitching will not change anything, while taking the effort to do these things will. Hope this will help.

Chris was way too nice in his trip report. I was cursing, crying, and praying to Jesus, Allah and Buddha all at the same time on that wall. Chris and I made good time heading in and it was almost dark so as we made it down to the creek where we knew there would be water, and as it turned out a beautiful campsite. Out of camp we followed a faint trail up Cedar Creek for about 30 minutes, then bushwhacked a quarter mile to the base of the wall. That is where the fun started. The first pitch was my lead and went straight up the dike/crack in the pictures. The dike was a full 200 feet of climbing with a few decent gear placements, a few 5.6 moves, but mostly 4th class. Then it was Chris' lead. His book stated "traverse unprotected slab rightward." Boy was that correct! From the top of the dike to the next nearest protection was about 80 feet of solid but unprotected 5.7 slab. Instead, Chris went up a little higher, finding a dirty, wet crack below a roof to place some gear in before traversing a 50 foot section of unprotected slab. He cound't quite make it to a belay, so we simuclimbed 20 feet until he reached a tree, and I followed across the slab traverse. It went 5.7 on good rock, but absolutely nothing would have prevented a huge sliding whipper if either one of us slipped. An hour later, I would have given Chris' left foot for 50 feet of runout solid slab. The next pitches involved kitty litter rock with nothing but Jesus to hang onto. I was 60 feet above the belay when I placed my first piece, after I dug the plant and dirt out of a tiny, shallow crack. The cam was as trustworthy as a pedophiliac Cub Scout leader, with the next move being one hand on a crumbling jug with the other hand on a smaller crumbling jug. With a sphincter so tight that if swallowed a piece of coal I'd crap out a diamond, I let loose a flury of expletives and climbed another 60 feet before reaching a belay tree. 120 feet: 1 piece of useless pro. I've seen better rock in a sandbox. The next pitch was the same. Chris led 100 feet with one piece of pro. He reached a horn, and we decided enough was enough. He rapped the horn back down to me, and we rapped from tree to tree (10 raps total) until back on solid ground. One of the trees was the size of my wrist and looked as strong as a Charlie Brown Christmas tree. We slung the tree and downclimbed, using it only as backup. If you looking for a fun, decent climb on good rock, go climb the Liberty group. But if you are looking for a religion-inducing pile of choss the constancy ball-bearings and axle grease, then this is the climb for you.

My girlfriend and I are taking a 3 week roadtrip to Yellowstone and the Tetons. Is there a Wyoming equivalent to Cascadeclimbers.com? Anyone know of a good resource for Wyoming climbing? We are going to spend a week or so in Yellowstone, then hopefully climb one of the Tetons. Not sure what else to do. Also, any Wyoming locals here who can advise me on September weather there? Thanks

Yesterday around 1400 I saw an ambulance in a pullout across from yellowjacket tower, and what appeared to be a Coast Guard helicopter (was all orange, too far away to see any markings) hovering around the tower for about 30 minutes. Anyone know what happened?

A #4 cam works great for the flake. That is what I used to protect it. For the offwidth above, if you place a lot of gear, 2 #4 and 2 #3.5 will be plenty. Chris used the #4 low and slid it up several times as he moved up. Hope this helps.

Looking for a couple more for this route on August 1,2,3. My plan is to leave seattle later afternoon on the 1st (can carpool) and camp at glacier basin. Next day hike to shurman camp, and third day summit and hike out. If you can only do two days, we can meet up at glacier basin camp morning of the second. Two caveats: 1.) Looking for people with some glacier experience. Need to be able to self rescue (prusik) out of crevasse, and confident arresting and setting up rescue. 2.) Must be reliable and commit to the climb. I have had way too many people from CC.com say they want to go, then cancel the day before, or even the day of. Nothing ruins a climb like half the party bugging out the morning of the climb. If interested, pm me. Kevin

Have to work this weekend, only have tommorrow off. Well, looks like I will be going for a hike. Anyone here have july 9-10th off? would love to do Stuart N ridge.

Are you up for Prusik Peak thursday?

check your pm's.