Careless_Ev

Probably just the rangers heli-skiing.

Whoa...

Hey Jose, We know who you are. You're divot, icefall and crampon. We also know that you don't live in Longmire and that in reality, you're desperate for understanding and attention. Hey, we understand, we get that way too. That's why cc.com invented other forums. Next time, I suggest that you start your attention seeking spray-thread in Cafe' Sensitivioso. You may get a warmer reception.

You're full of yourself.

I just knit a wool sweater on my way up if the weather changes.

Charging for rescue is bad public policy! Using Europe as a model wont work. We have a different public standard of liability. The county should be promptly sued after charging for their first rescue. Lawyers will pick apart the rescue, and question every decision that the rescue managers make; especially decisions that increase the cost of the rescue. The question could easily be asked; did the SAR managers do too much, or too little? If they do too much and over react, BONG! "Hey, I didn't ask for a helicopter, I just needed some help getting down the trail b/c I sprained my ankle." If they do too little and someone becomes more injured or dies, BONG! "Why didn't you do MORE to help my little Johnny? Now you're sending me a bill!" Suddenly, cost will be on the SAR manager's mind as much as the rescue. How does that sound?! Everyone has accidents; you could be next. If the county wants to be in the charging for SAR business (instead of relying on the volunteers and MAST) then it should expect suits. Defending one lawsuit will easily cost more than they recoup.

If you draft a letter, post it here, and make it simple to collect public comment, you'll increase your response. Good work, but I'm not sure I like the idea of giving land to the USFS.

As is commonly known, the wealthy can buy all the drugs and sex they want. It's a class war based on trumped up morals by hypocrites.

That's a logical statement and I would agree with you. But I suspect that the NPS can get the money for the new land, but not necessarily for the maintenance.

Good Grief Mr. Mtn Mouse, You are DEFINITELY Charlie Brown.

Forgot to mention the snow... It was soften by the sun, but otherwise a firm crust was starting to form. North facing slopes are still quite powdery and nice! We couldn't make anything slide, but did notice some activity across the Nisqually.

I'm jealous, Very nice! Wish I had more time off to play.

What about that super hero Aquaman...

Rodchester, Going down to the bridge is in GREAT shape. There some chucky snow that has sluffed off the sides, once you get down a ways, but otherwise, it's sweet. If you're on Tele or Alpine gear, stay river, or skier's, right. There a few short sections that would require a boarder to dismount, otherwise, it rides to the bridge. If on a snowboard, stay left and hike out the boot track to the bridge. The route has been in for quite a while, and it will remain in for quite awhile. Nice post Josh

sorry for the slow response. cc.com was LOCKING me out and i couldn't post. i don't have any details, i just got a call from someone close to climbers. btw, i only heard word that 2 climbers died, not three... so that's why i'm hesitant to post details...

i've been waiting for this topic to pop up, but i wont release the names. i too knew the climbers. you'll hear more about them and the accident soon, as both are active in the outdoors and volunteered a great deal of their time to mountain climbing and rescue. sobo is right, they were both outstanding men. this is very sad, my thoughts and empathy go out to their family, friends, and colleagues.

There was some good Lib/Ridge information here: http://www.cascadeclimbers.com/threadz/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/148679/page/3/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/1/vc/1

I agree, take route reports with a grain of salt. I just wanted to be encouraging. As for Lake WA,,,, let's go....

BTW, if I get up there this winter, I'll happily provide a route condition report. But then, that really wont mean much either, b/c by the time you arrive, the actual conditions and specifics will have probablly changed...

Jeeze Catbird, couldn't you see those issues from Paradise. What the hell is wrong with you? I don't think that I said you could analyze the specific conditions from Paradise? I think that I said the route looks doable because of snow cover. By all means, if you prefer to wait till someone gives you a first hand report, then more power to you. Generally, I prefer to go find out for myself, even when others say "no go." It often seems that climbers have differing opinions of the conditions and situation. Cat's statement jives with my comments... That is, the conditions were problematic and they still summited. And look: avalanche conditions on the Cowlitz, deep postholing.... I wonder if there were a few crevasses to contend with above Camp Comfort? I wonder Cat, did you have a few partners? And did you exchange leads to break up the postholing labor too... But hey, I'm just guessing because I wasn't there that day, and I couldn't see him from Paradise... Crampon guy from the land of sunny Sequim, I say go find out. The route is in winter shape, and even if the climbing conditions are difficult, this route can often be summited.

I wish I could assess routes from that far away. I usually have to stick my face in it to really know. That's too bad that you're unable to do this David. I find that looking at routes from a distance before I climb them helpful. But its good that you can recognize your shortfalls. Mr Crampon, David "might" be trying to make the point that you're unable to assess the route from far away... and for specific info, that is true. But what matters on this route is: ample snow cover on the ledges, good weather (well, that's ideal), a solid partner (unless you prefer solo), and good physical conditioning (makes breaking trail up the Cowlitz Cleaver a LOT easier). You may experience avalanche "hazards" in the chute (which takes you off the ledges and onto the upper mountain), but the larger avalanche hazard generally exists between Muir and Camp Misery (i.e, the base of Gib Ledges.) That hazard needs to be analyzed the day you climb the mountain. While we're at it, the upper mountain may be crevassed too, and the winds may be fierce, and the snow on the ledges could be sugary, or icy... but all of that information can be dealt with along the way. My point was, the route looks climbable and I encourage you to go! The snow conditions may be soft or hard, the avalanche hazard may be crazy or safe, but you'll never know, till you go... Anyway, at least the ledges are covered, and the crevasses on the mountain are starting to look filled in... If the ledges don't work, try the Ingraham Direct. The winter climbing (skiing) season is upon us.

the gib ledges route looked like it was in AWESOME shape the other day (i.e. yesterday). i wasn't climbing, but i did eye-ball it from paradise (while skiing on EXCELLENT SNOW!!!). tons of new snow on the mountain, the ledges looked as though they were filled in nicely. the upper mountain looks pristine. i looked at the nisqually glacier route too. it seems to be OK, but i did notice that i could us a bit more snow to fill in all the cracks. it probably goes, but may involve some creative crevasse navigation. all you need is a partner, weather window, strong legs, and warm clothes. good luck, maybe i'll see you up there.

Nice report. Does anyone have recent info on this traverse? Mostly concerned about snow conditions, need of ax, etc. Thanks

Don't suggest this too loudly.