Off_White

That's a good point about the wording of the Poll Merv, beause of course we're talking about individuals. It was a long time ago that I lost the simple notion that membership in any subculture automatically makes one an okay person. If you've already had contact with the person doing the bolting, and know there is no chance of agreement, you get nothing but "fuck you, I'll do what I want, and you can't stop me," then what are your options? Calling the cops is better (though maybe not more satisfying) than setting their car on fire. Public embarassment if private negotiation brings no results? That's a possiblity, especially if common sentiment runs counter to the individual's actions.

Now that's a good question. I think the constitution wouldn't allow stocks and pillories. Also, there's a question of just how effective the education could be if the person supposed to provide it is not truly repentant?

Would you call the forest service if Gotterdamerung rides his bike to Dutch Miller Gap? Will you call the BLM if someone smokes pot at camp during the Smiffytuffyfest? Do you call the cops when your wife speeds? I think discussion and peer pressure would be far more preferable than tattling to the cops. The fact that things are illegal doesn't stop people from doing them (see the list above) but if all your friends think it's uncool you're much less likely to do it.

With regard to the actual crime, rather than playing guess the perp, it sounds like a good outcome. Awareness and education about the issue will be good for everyone, and the more noise about it the better.

Scott? Here's a tidbit: he was once involved in stripping all the bolts and chains off the Beaver Wall on Mt Lemmon in Tucson in a short anti-rap-bolt war in the mid 80's. Unlike the mangled hangers in that photo, no damage was done to the wall or the hardware, and it led to a large community meeting and discussion at someone's house, and the gear was deposited there in a huge clanking heap. I think there was a brief diminshment in activity, then there was a large climber population turn over and subsequent sport explosion. Scott went on to do a lot of bolting from hooks, and I believe from there into full on rap bolt creations. He's put up some good routes, and has been prolific as hell.

I've met Lou too, but I was much less impressed than you. I thought he was full of poo and none too attached to the troo th

I'll stroll down the crag today and check it out. The end of last week, there were the start of some serious drips, but only a few, so naturally I'm optimistic.

If it's that one from Spanish television, I think remarkably they did live. I think it was an anchor failure rather than a rope breaking. It's a real gut churner of a vid clip though, a link was posted quite awhile ago. I don't need to see it again.

I was always more partial to Zamfir, the Lonely Goatherd. Man, that guy could play the pan pipes. Just imagine what he could do with jazz flute!

The real question is how does it stack up against a Unimog? Funny, I can't seem to find any info about mileage?

I understand, just trying to give you a jovial nudge to put things in perspective. Yes, you are working on it.

That place is pretty much top of the list of family vacations not yet taken, thanks for the trip report on such a "non climbing" destination.

Honestly GD, you engage in personal slurs towards others at times, so you shouldn't be so brittle when shit slops onto your side of the kettle.

The joke being that No va is spanish for "Won't go" There's another car model out now called the Tucson. Hey, there's some good climbing down there, but really, the town is like Queens with palm trees.

I think that's the crux of the biscuit, war is an inappropriate tool for winning hearts and minds, and it's a mistake of the political set to think it can be used that way. War is really about death, killing, blood, guts, and veins in my teeth. It's a dominance and submission thing, and a clumsy instrument to wield in service of swaying opinion. If they wanted to to just change people's minds, it would have been better to pump 1/10th the funding into the advertising industry and let them do as they will.

Are you sure you didn't mean to say FUCKING RETARDED?

In the main index, in the description of the Spray forum (which this thread is in right now) is this line: Be warned this forum is not for the thin skinned.

Maybe he was talking about Masceoli & Pilling

Dude, he's an anonymous guy with a sharp stick in the spray forum, so don't show him your balloons already.

Thanks for the reminder Chris, that story is brilliant.

The secret formula of Amazing Co. Diet Gu finally revealed!

Or perhaps that overconsumption of Olestra as brought up in some thread or other...

Yup, inside the meter box, flush to the ground and usually in front of your house. Often the valve is hidden in dirt that has humped inside the meter box. Top of the valve is usually a straight bar, and while there is a special tool to turn it, you can usually get away with a basin wrench (another plumbing tool) or a couple wrenches: one to grip the bar, and the other to grip and turn the first wrench. Channel locks, vise grips, crescent wrenches, I've used 'em all. Water water everywhere sucks so bad, I feel for your friends. Another tip: if you're going to put in a shut off valve at the house (a good idea), use a ball valve instead of a gate valve. Gate valve ususally has a wheel shaped knob on top, and moves a gate up and down in the valve body. It's more prone to age related leakage, corrosion, and outright failure.

Okay, this thread ends here, and I've shipped the last bit to Spray, where you're free to wallow as you see fit.