Fairweather

I agree with everything you say here, but I think it's important to understand both sides. I suspect that most (not all) of the feelings you describe are the same emotions many private-sector employees and business owners feel when something like Obamacare is imposed on them. There are, in fact, a lot of private sector wage-earners who have or will lose benefits, hours, or even their livelihoods over this legislation. Food for thought. No intent to disrespect you here. In fact, the work you do is exactly the reason I pay my taxes. I hope this nonsense is over with soon.

[video:youtube]PFkAAvDkj9k

The Butlerian Jihad is almost upon us.

I live in the new WA 10th District, and my Congressman is Denny Heck. Seems like an OK guy for a D, although I would have preferred to remain in the 6th where Derek Kilmer took over for Norm Dicks. Heck did respond to my email re Syria and assured me he was "inclined" to vote no--had the vote actually taken place. Hopefully, we'll never know.

2001 and 2006 Patriot Act roll call. Looks like almost everyone's autograph is on the ballz: http://educate-yourself.org/cn/patriotact20012006senatevote.shtml 2008 FISA Amendment Act: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/110/hr6304

My worry with this NSA shit is not, necessarily, that they're doing it; rather, it's that no one seems to care that they're doing it. At the risk of sounding like a Luddite, I am becoming less enamored with some aspects of technology with each passing year. My impression of FISA was that it was very limited in scope and was focused on authorizing the monitoring of data (or even conversations) where at least one party was overseas. This is not the case now--don't know if it ever was. Feel free to blame Bush for opening the door that Obama has eagerly stepped through. I recently had a conversation with a family member who proclaimed, "if data mining can save three thousand lives or prevent another terrorist attack then it's worth giving up a little privacy." I don't think so. This "meta-data" will almost inevitably be used for political purposes--if not by Obama, then by the next clown we elect--and this represents a threat to our democracy. Hell, the CIA/NSA/FBI can't even prevent an attack when the Russkies provide names and addresses (the Boston bombers), why should we think our government can make sense out of our digital crumbs? But then again, we probably shouldn't expect too much concern over privacy from Americans who are busy putting their entire lives on FaceBook and texting pictures of their genitals to the latest significant other. As for the Republicans shutting down part of the government, well, I've already made my opinion pretty clear. Obamacare will be a fucking disaster, but the people spoke twice (once through their representatives, and again in the 2012 election), and it even passed the judicial smell test. If I had a Republican Representative I could write to, I'd tell him to knock this shit off--and get rid of that total moron tool orange nasal-tone crybaby House speaker.

Prole, aren't you the expert when it comes to "Wedge" issues?

This one is more chilling: [video:youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLodCejCoYE

In fact, every single action you mention above had legislative approval and was voted on in Congress. You can accuse Bush of practicing populism, opportunism, or even lying to game the system. But Obama often acts like he is "above" the system--especially with regard to Syria and the NSA scandal.

Even GW never had the audacity to think he could bypass Congress to start a war--or to spy on US citizens' internal communications. Also, Ivan, I think your memory is failing you regarding No Child Left Behind. I recall a collaboration between Ted Kennedy and GW led to its overwhelming passage.

Not to worry, I hear the LMA has stationed its militia members throughout the Icicle to ensure that the area remains open to locals and stays as beautiful and free as ever as this crisis plays itself out.

I damn near agree with this. I'm not entirely clear on the reason why the employer mandate got a delay, but it sure plays poorly. As to the train wreck, I agree too. If the law is in fact a disaster, than it will need to be amended or repealed. If in fact the American people like it, as we are told they may, than perhaps it is not a disaster worthy of shutting down the government. Shutting down the govt over this is the epitome of arrogance. If ACA works, then the Dems and Obama get all of the credit. But if it doesn't, then I can't see how any of these Ds deserve to stay in office. If this crop of Republicans is the only alternative, well, that's scary too.

Yea, those are bad. I went to school with a guy named Justin Case. Now that's a cool name. Sadly, Justin was not "Seattle-based"-which probably explains his mediocre grades, and his inability to properly display any narcissistic traits or passive-aggressive behavior.

Not surprising that those on the left will grant a pass to their leader's autocratic behavior with obfuscation and a straight face. Then again, this is the same president who was ready to start lobbing cruise missiles on Syria even as he ignored congress--and the law. In the end, he read the writing on the wall--and for this he gets props. If only the Rs would get their heads straight too. Still, you've gotta admit Obama's got some "issues" with the rules. Republicans? Shit, I suspect he holds near-equal contempt for Congressional Democrats.

Who in the fuck names their kid Kiliii Fish?

If the Republicans do have one good gripe it's that Obama has given a one-year delay to big business and not to individuals. If the law is the law, I'm not sure how Obama is allowed to do this. In any event, the Rs are too dumb to just step out of the way and let this train-wreck of a law play out. Wait until the uninsured have to pay that IRS fine. Wait until the insured see their benefits start to evaporate. Wait until unions pull their support (already happening)...

The Republicans are probably finished as a party, IMO. And they have been since Romney lost. Despite the abomination that Obamacare will almost certainly turn out to be, it passed Congress by a single vote, was signed by a president who was subsequently reelected, was upheld by the Supreme Court (Roberts, no less!), and is now the law. If the R's were smart--and they're not--they would have passed on this fight and defunded the government in two weeks when the borrowing limit is once again reached. Now that's a legitimate issue. Bring on the Libertarians; the R's are in the ICU.

Shhhhh!

Thanks! I'll check it out for future dates; this was my first trip to Colorado. I was amazed at the amount of mining/industry along the I-70 mountain passes. Near Loveland Pass it looks like they're taking the top off an entire mountain, and just east of Copper Mountain lies one the largest settlement pond/cofferdams I've ever seen. Anyway, I talked to a guy who skis Elbert in the wintertime. It's a good avalanche-free climb and descent. Pretty tame for a skier of your skills, but I'll bet it would be a great lung trainer for Alaska.

The NPS "climbing programs" at Rainier and Denali come to mind--although the ranger efforts at the latter seem to offer climbers at least limited value for their money. On the USFS side, I'd point you to the pay-to-play fiasco down at Mount St. Helens. The arbitrary 100 climber-per-day limit has created an artificial demand for the climb that would otherwise not exist, and the fees go to support some bogus "Mount St. Helens Institute." The scheme is already similar for the Enchantments and popular areas throughout the West. Mount Whitney comes to mind. The "Volcano Pass" that the FS tried to implement has been a failure that I believe the program no longer exists. (If it does, I guess I'm a scofflaw.) And then, of course, there is the famous "Fee Demonstration Program" that continues on to this day--even as more and more public access is strangled off with each passing year. The tragedy is that the alliance between climbers and conservationists--who worked hand-in-hand to create MRNP in 1899, Olympic in 1938, NCNP in 1968, and to pass the Wilderness Act in 1964--no longer exists. And the USFS, fresh off 100+ years of Pinchot's "multiple use" fantasy, now justifies its existence by treating recreation as its new commodity. The environmental "concerns" of orgs like the NCCC and LMA are simply a convenient lever the USFS can use to artificially intensify demand and then regulate for $$.

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More libertarian, actually. And based on the responses here I'd say it's an increasingly popular sentiment--or at least one more nuanced than the typical right/left worldview. Again, to me it looks like a local agenda trying to gain traction on public/federal land--while it waits for real teeth to appear. Regulations and restrictions are always easier to navigate when you live three minutes away. In any event, I have spoken with Woody Goomsba, and he is not happy.

I've kind of gathered a picture, based solely on this thread, that this is largely an effort led by local climbers who hope to restrict access (or reduce numbers) to "their" crags and wilderness--by usurping the language of environmentalism, wrapping it in a loose package that they have named the "Leavenworth Mountain Association"(a group with no 501c3 or .org status), and then supposing to represent the broader climbing community in an effort to bring in additional federal enforcement toward the realization of their goal. The dripping hostility toward and mockery of outsiders and dissenters in this very thread is plain to see. The irony, of course, is that most (all?) of these locals are likely transplants from the west side. Sorry if this conclusion upsets the LMA membership--or sounds paranoid--but I don't see how it can be interpreted any other way. By their own account, the Icicle "is as free and beautiful as ever." So why else the fuss? Bing Images

Yes, please provide the necessary. And a kind day to you good sir. Holy shit, I know this guy. What a small world it is. As for Ivan, I think he should surface that up or hold it in the parking lot until senior leadership has a chance to trickle it down to the teams.

I think this statement is revealing. Local sentiments like those expressed by Sol, Blake, Pete, and the "LMA" are always important, but most of the crags in question lie on federal property that is owned by us all. To grant too much weight to local sensibilities is to submit to a standard that could end up turning our shared heritage into a municipal park--or a private club.